Favorite NEW weapon in CM:NATO?

[__Yossarian0815[jby]]

Ah OK, thx, didn´t check.

edit: Whats the rationale of not putting ERA on the CV9035?

[Lethaface]

Allright an RPG might not be the best example; however the Marder seems much better protected in game. While the CV9035 is (according to the CMSF manual) very comparable with the Marders successor: The Puma.

Is the Marder (without ERA and lighter than the CV9035) better armoured than the CV9035?

I would think that for any major conflict the CV9035 would be upgraded with ERA directly. Even the old YPR-765 have ERA versions available ingame.

I'm totally NOT an expert in this but I know more than the average human being. Perhaps there is just an error in the unit description in CMSF and that I'm making that larger then it actually is. If I have time i'll try to make a test ground in the editor to see how this beast really performs ingame.

Damian90, do you know how comes the CV9035 ingame weighs 38 tons? The CV9040C (with upgraded armour) seems to weight 'only' 28 tons, while the standard CV9035mkIII weighs 35 tons according to its manufacturer, http://www.baesystems.com/.

[Damian90]

Is the Marder (without ERA and lighter than the CV9035) better armoured than the CV9035?

No, comparabale, but Marder have similiar protection to Leopard 1 tank, good against autocannons, RPG will go through it like hot knife through butter.

I would think that for any major conflict the CV9035 would be upgraded with ERA directly.

And there is any ERA or other type of dynamic protection, designed for CV90?

Damian90, do you know how comes the CV9035 ingame weighs 38 tons? The CV9040C (with upgraded armour) seems to weight 'only' 28 tons, while the standard CV9035mkIII weighs 35 tons according to its manufacturer, http://www.baesystems.com/.

CV9035 MkIII is a bit bulkier than CV9040C, remember, weight is not only armor, but also ammo (it's quantity for example), engine, suspension, tracks, how many dismoutns vehicle take, how bit vehicle is, how many fuel it takes, everything counts in case of vehicle weight.

[Lethaface]

Well, I have read on the dutch Wikipedia (?) that RAFAEL has developed a IRA/ERA package for it:

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/CV90

Seems to be supported by RAFAEL's website:

http://www.rafael.co.il/Marketing/444-1224-en/Marketing.aspx?searchText=irA

Apart from that BAEsystems themselves say that the CV90 is protected against RPG-7 rounds. They don't say which rounds and i'm not sure whether to trust the creator of the vehicle regarding its quality

http://www.baesystems.com/BAEProd/groups/public/documents/bae_publication/bae_pdf_hagglunds_cv90brochure.pdf

And according to our defense ministery website the basis of the armour consists of 'laminated armoursteel' with kevlar coating on the inside of the vehicle. They also add that as much as possible bolt-on armour modules are used, without proving insight into what this actually is:

http://www.defensie.nl/landmacht/materieel/voertuigen/gepantserde_voertuigen/combat_vehicle_90

Google translate should provide a reasonable translation for the dutch articles.

[ZPB II]

The CV in the game has no ERA so RPGs should cut through it easily, only question is does the ammo pop or not? Never been inside one that gets hit so dunno what to say, Damian90, what kind of ammo storage method does the CV utilize?

[Lethaface]

And some more info about it:

http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product264.html

[Damian90]

The CV in the game has no ERA so RPGs should cut through it easily, only question is does the ammo pop or not? Never been inside one that gets hit so dunno what to say, Damian90, what kind of ammo storage method does the CV utilize?

Ammo storage should be same as in M2 series, because Bushmaster III is chain gun, so ammo is stored in turret basket, so probably it is safe until vehicle will not start to burn, or ammo will not be directly hit by shaped charge jet or kinetic energy penetrator.

[__Yossarian0815[jby]]

And there is any ERA or other type of dynamic protection, designed for CV90?

The RAFAEL system (see Lethaface´s link)

According to the dutch Wikipedia page on the CV90, they even stuck RAFAEL onto a dutch CV90 in 2006 for a demonstration. (At least I think thats what it says, Elmar help!)

Het Israëlische bedrijf RAFAEL heeft voor de CV9035 een aparte modulaire pantserset ontwikkeld, gebaseerd op hun IRA (Insensitive Reactive Armour)-principe, waarbij voorkant en zijkanten van romp en toren van dikke beschermingslagen worden voorzien tegen holle ladingswapens. Het waarschuwingssysteem is in deze optie nog uitgebreid met een radarverklikker en een waarschuwingssysteem voor inkomende antitankraketten. Een CV9030 MkII werd in 2006 in Havelte, voorzien van het RAFAEL-systeem tentoongesteld als voorbeeld van een mogelijke invulling van de Nederlandse armour upgrade.

[Lethaface]

I can help

They say they have developed it for the CV9035 and there was a demo model (using a CV9030 mk2) displayed in belgium, as an example for the possible Dutch armour upgrade for the CV9035NL. Nothing is said regarding it's actual usage.

[__Yossarian0815[jby]]

doh

anywho, pics of the demo model:

http://www.panzerbaer.de/types/nl_ifv_cv90-a.htm

[Lethaface]

Correction, I thought havelte was in Belgium but it is in The Netherlands (lol) and the ERA model was displayed on the 'Dutch army days'.

[c3k]

Sure, the Shilka is a bucket full of fun, but something's missing from it....

Ahh, I believe the one ingredient missing is the veritable rain of shell casings being ejected along the ejection rails! C'mon, imagine the pile of brass which would build up! One of the cool details BF.C has crafted is the brass flying through the air when your troops fire. Any way we could get that for our Shilka's? (Also for that sweet 20mm on the Marder?)

Ken

[Damian90]

The dynamic protection package was presented on CV9030 Mk.2, not on the CV9035 Mk.3 presented in game. So no, there is no package for CV9035 Mk.3.

[Rayak47]

If you think poppong smoke to throw off visually ATGMs is low tech, we used to paint coffee cans black and put them on a stick with a block of C4 nearby to dstract the sovs from our real TOW's, so they put fire on them and not us! (Luckilly never got to try this in real life!)

[Alan8325]

Heh... AKD just mentioned my favorite... the 20mm Wiesel. And like AKD, I haven't figured out how to use it yet. Well, at least when the Syrians have anything stronger than a spitball to toss at it

Steve

The Wiesel is very lightly armored, has only 2 crew members to spot targets and its optics are not that advanced. It does have good firepower and small size though, so in an offensive role I would use it primarily as an area-fire weapon, since that doesn't require the vehicle crew to spot targets themselves. You locate targets with infantry dismounts and then when there is an area that needs blasting with 20mm you move the weisel out of its protective hole and do an area fire on the target. Its small size can help maneuverability in urban areas as well.

In defense I would use it like any other vehicle in a hull down position overlooking an avenue of approach.

[Lethaface]

The dynamic protection package was presented on CV9030 Mk.2, not on the CV9035 Mk.3 presented in game. So no, there is no package for CV9035 Mk.3.

The one presented on the Mk.2 is portrayed as an option for the Mk.3. That was why they showed it on the Defence days. Anyways, it is not ingame so on that point you are right.

[TwistedPretzel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKdwuOxYRI4&feature=related

Amazing presentation on the CV90. I had to do some research on it after absolutely devastating a Syrian attack with several of them on the mission Team Work Required.

Phenomenal weapon.

[Erwin]

Impressive. And it transports inf. Who needs tanks?

[ZPB II]

The CV90 is an excellent tool, but most of the fancy rounds are designed for the 40mm Bofors cannon. Because the CV is made by BAE Systems AB, of which Bofors is a part of.

Do take a while and listen to that impressive exhaust note, one I wish a modder would implement in the game.

[Praetori]

I also say the CV9035N.

I played around with one of my own missions the other day and tried exchanging the marines with Dutch. I got a whole platoon of CV90's and was shocked when they just ate two companies of Syrian mech inf, down to a man, in less than 5 minutes in half open/broken terrain.

They were all out of 35mm HE by the end of it (which is the major drawback with the 90, little ammo and high ROF means that long missions will cause issues since there are no FARPs in CM). The simpson/futurama "The monster that ate EVERYBODY" came to mind.

[Thelamon]

The 20mm of the Marder... or in fact the entire vehicle. It's a true infantry killer with the 20mm + coax MG3 + lots of ammo.

In the last leg of it's service life (The first production Puma IFV's have been given to the Bundeswehr) the Marder proves what it's worth very successfully in Afghanistan and has seen some very intense fighting.

The number of fielded Marder 1A5's has risen over the last year from 10 to 25 (30) vehicles and every Infantry company (mostly Gebirgsjäger, Jäger and Fallschirmjäger) now has one heavy platoon of Panzergrenadiere attached.

20mm in action covering US troops:

[Sakai007]

Hmmmm, favorite new NATO weapon, that's a difficult one, there are so many. For infantry weapons, the G3 is my new favorite assault rifle. The MG3 my favorite new machine gun. The PzFaust 3 is my favorite new un-guided AT weapon. The german hand grenades are neat too, I don't know if it's modeled, but they are basically offensive grenades with a sheath that can be slid around them to make them defensive grenades, very neat stuff. For IFVs, the Marder is excellent, but my favorite is the CV9035. It has the largest useful IFV gun in game, enough to shred BMP and BTR vehicles, and dangerous to tanks from the flanks. The lack of an ATGM is a serious weakness, but they are not tank destroyers, they are IFVs, so when used for what they are meant for, that doesn't become an issue. The only place where it's helpful in it's designed role is taking out hardened bunkers or houses, but the 35mm cannon does that well anyways. I know the 73mm gun on some BMPs is larger caliber, but not as accurate or useful as the 35mm. For armor, well, the options are limited, lol, but the 2A6M+ is a real treat, must be careful tho, cause like all tanks, the AT14 can punch a hole in it an any angle.