Red Orchestra: Heroes of Stalingrad preview

[noxnoctum]

I'm not sure if this qualifies as a "commercial link", if it does just close it. Figured it was ok since there's a thread on the pacific and other stuff on here.

http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/features/53728/GDC-2010-Tripwire-Talks-Stalingrad

[Other Means]

That looks excellent.

[Moon]

You've linked to an article, not, say, the publisher's product page, so it's not a commercial link.

[blackbellamy]

Oh goddamn it, that article was hard to read. Is Peter Eykemans a non-native English speaker or was that article directly translated from Slobodovinangian?

[Elmar Bijlsma]

I didn't have much trouble with it.

[MeatEtr]

Long time RO fan and am very much looking forward to this. Thanks for posting the article, I hadn't read it yet. Which seems fine to me, no trouble reading it.

[JoMac]

I have only started playing RO: series for a few months now.

RO: is the only 1st person shooter game I play ( did play alittle PS2 'Call of Duty' several yrs ago ).

RO: seems the most realistic to date. However, in saying that, there are some things which I like and others that I dont like.

Some things are probably engine related while others are by design.

I have only listed a few examples below, but I am sure there are others:

-In general, I still like the graphics, but content is still more important.

-I like the forward motions that characters have ( very natural looking ). I do not like the very fast body motions ( un-natural looking ) characters have when 'crawling' or going from one posture to the next. You think you are hidden, but the slightest movement will give your position away, even in cover.

-I really like how the suppression from small arms, and explosions are handled. It really gives a realistic 'Blur' feel to the battle, making it harder for you to hit the enemy in return.

Now, they should also add a 'Shaken' and or 'Panicked' type 'Blur' to the battle. Troops in this state, like above will have a more difficult time aiming at the enemy.

-There is just way to much light reflection from characters, they dont seem to blend in with the surrounding terrain as much. This also makes them much easier to spot.

-I do not like the way mounting/dimounting is handled.

It should take several seconds for a character to mount/dismount a vehicle, and properly operate it. Juming in and out of a vehicle and operating it in one second is just to rediculous.

-Slow down the turret rotation and ROF of the JSII.

-JSII should destroy any vehicle on the map with one hit.

-Stop vehicles from slowly rolling down on a small grade.

-There should be more flank penetrations of tanks. Just to many instances of "why the H did I not penetrate that T-34 with my PZIV Long at 250 meters even at 30 degrees"

-Troops should not be able to pick up and use enemy combat arms during combat. If this must be allowed, it should only be done if your own combat arms are lost or out of ammo. There should also be negatives combat modifiyers applied if using enemy weapons.

-Charaters should also tire when 'crawling' like they do when 'Running' or 'jumping'.

I just hope they change some or of these in RO: HoS.

Joe

[noxnoctum]

In general most of the things you mentioned have to do with the admittedly dated engine. (animations, etc.) Remember this was based off of Unreal Tournament

Most of the realism related issues though (penetration, suppression etc.) have been brought up by the community numerous times and will hopefully be added in to ROHOS.

I do know for a fact that the devs said that they will resolve the somewhat ridiculous recoil from SMGs, especially the PPSh. At the time they were making the mod (it started as a free mod, but then became a full fledged stand alone game later on), they hadn't really handled WW2 SMGs and so thought that that was how they performed. IIRC they got their hands on a bunch of historical guns, uniforms etc. so we should be able to expect a more accurate representation.

The only thing I disagree with you about is this:

-Troops should not be able to pick up and use enemy combat arms during combat. If this must be allowed, it should only be done if your own combat arms are lost or out of ammo. There should also be negatives combat modifiyers applied if using enemy weapons.

Why do you think this? I can't count how many times I've seen German troops in old WW2 pics and footage carrying PPShs and I'm sure the Ruskies did the same as well with German weapons (I know I've seen pictures of US troops operating MG42s in combat on the West Front).

As for suppression, you should try Darkest Hour, a mod for Red Orchestra. It actually has way better suppression effects, more blurr, and an involuntary "flinch" effect when under heavy machine-gun fire to make it hard to pull of a shot when you've got several hundred rounds a minute spewing at you.

[JoMac]

I figured many of the issues are engine related, and hope are improved in RO: HoS.

I also think in general vehicles were an after-thought and simplified rather then being thoughtfully designed into the engine.

Yes, I understand your point regarding the use of enemy weapons & ammo.

In general thou, foreign weapons and ammo are used before a battle starts or picked up after a battle has ended.

In RO: However, to scavenge the enemy for these items ( and use them ) in mid battle should be limited or just not allowed. If allowed, maybe one weapon and its ammo per squad max.

Personally, I would rather see enemy weapons dissapear the second he dies, and be done with it.

I just have seen to many times where a whole squad of characters online are scavaging enemy weapons and ammo and throwing away their own for the fun of it.

In RO: HoS, I Just hope they change this to some degree.

This would be better suited for a mini-campaign, where you pick up enemy weapons & ammo in one game and use them in another. This agian, in small numbers ( maybe one weapon & ammo per squad max ).

Yes, Darkest Hour Mod does a good job on taking 'blur' effects to the next level, and hope some are implemented in RO: HoS

[JoMac]

My computer is over 5 yrs old ( with no plans as of yet to get a new one ), and works well with RO. If RO: HoS requires a newer puter, ( due to newer game engine, etc ) I may have to wait to purchase it until that day comes for a newer puter.

How many here still play RO, and do you play solo or part of a group online ?

I live in Virginia and play it on weekends or every other weekend ( depending of family matters ) including Fridays. My handle names include 'JoMc67' 'MAC0766', but usually use the former.

I cant seem to register with Tripware, because my AOL account doesnt work with them. This does not allow me to join the forums and to read & discuss RO.

Basically, I am looking to get to know others here ( and from other sites if you know of any ) by using email exchanges, or online chats ( I use AOL ). I would like know who is playing, what channel you use, and at what times you play.

I would like to eventually join a group ( already in existance ) or form one of our own.

If interested, please reply back here ( or PM, Email me with topic heading Red Orchestra )

Thanx, Joe

[noxnoctum]

I figured many of the issues are engine related, and hope are improved in RO: HoS.

I also think in general vehicles were an after-thought and simplified rather then being thoughtfully designed into the engine.

Yes, I understand your point regarding the use of enemy weapons & ammo.

In general thou, foreign weapons and ammo are used before a battle starts or picked up after a battle has ended.

In RO: However, to scavenge the enemy for these items ( and use them ) in mid battle should be limited or just not allowed. If allowed, maybe one weapon and its ammo per squad max.

Personally, I would rather see enemy weapons dissapear the second he dies, and be done with it.

I just have seen to many times where a whole squad of characters online are scavaging enemy weapons and ammo and throwing away their own for the fun of it.

In RO: HoS, I Just hope they change this to some degree.

This would be better suited for a mini-campaign, where you pick up enemy weapons & ammo in one game and use them in another. This agian, in small numbers ( maybe one weapon & ammo per squad max ).

Yes, Darkest Hour Mod does a good job on taking 'blur' effects to the next level, and hope some are implemented in RO: HoS

But surely if you were in a battle with a rifle in close combat with the enemy and saw an enemy SMG lying on the ground, you'd pick it up right?

The vehicles were indeed added later. Initially it was infantry only. Even though it's hardly a "tank simulator" I'd rather have them in then not, it really adds to the gameplay IMO. I really love the maps that have all infantry and 1 or 2 tanks per side, it really adds to the chaotic nature of everything.

I still play RO and DH all the time. Pretty much the only games I play consistently are RO/DH, IL-2 and various turn based games (Combat Mission among others). I'm actually in a "clan" that plays competitively usually ever weekend. Smaller battles as it's 8v8 but it's quite fun.

[JoMac]

I read the HoS preview, and wonder how its possible to become even close to making it to 'Hero' level.

In RO ( as apposed to RL ) You are certainly going to die rather quickly, and several times over at that.

I instead wonder if the developers are planning on using some sort of experience points based on how well you play ( no matter if you die several times ). That experience is what is going to bring you to the next level, and so on, and possibly making it to 'Hero' ( even if it takes several months of playing ). I can see it now after a year of playing, the server will have nothing but Heroes or Vets at a minimum.

[Wengart]

IIRC Tripwire is implementing the perk system from Killing Floor into RO:HOS. So you will either have an experience pool, or have experience for each individual class.

In RO: However, to scavenge the enemy for these items ( and use them ) in mid battle should be limited or just not allowed. If allowed, maybe one weapon and its ammo per squad max.

Personally, I would rather see enemy weapons dissapear the second he dies, and be done with it.

I think that fun and verisimilitude of the users experience need to be balanced with what would realistically happen in the situation. Everyone can understand the concept of suppression, and the enhancement of the simulation in that direction would be accepted, but being unable to pick up enemy weapons to many would just seem arbitrary and confusing.

And I also believe in the firm need for allowing player to be "the hero", and if that means letting him pick up a Panzerfaust to knock out that troublesome panzer then so be it.

[MeatEtr]

A new interview is up from E3. Check it out here:

http://news.bigdownload.com/2010/06/17/e3-2010-we-get-more-info-from-tripwire-about-red-orchestra-her/

The new MP gamemode Countdown sounds interesting, one life per objective. The MP Campaign mode sounds kool too. Always wondered why FPS MP games never made a map interface to tie-in the battles for an overall plan/conquest.

Also they already got a mod team working on a Pacific mod/expansion.