Fire and floors...

[Peter Cairns]

Is there any indications yet about how fire and it's spread will be treated in CMx2.

With the smaller grid this could be done in a more realistic way especially within buildings.

(I think it's about as good as the system allows in CM1).

Will individual floor be able to burn trapping people above if there is fire on the stairwell ( I read, stair positions within buildings can be modelled).

Will fire spread out along walls or across rooms at different rates, and will it move up floors faster than it moves down.

Peter.

[Peter Cairns]

I am posting to my own thread to get it back to the top because Iam in the HUFF about no one talking to me...

So there...

Peter.

[flammenwerfer]

Peter, are you a Pyro?

[stoat]

He probably gets Shermans just to watch them burn.

[juan_gigante]

Is there any other reason to?

[stoat]

They are aesthetically pleasing.

[hoolaman]

Originally posted by Peter Cairns:

I am posting to my own thread to get it back to the top because Iam in the HUFF about no one talking to me...

So there...

Peter.

Well its an excellent question, and it would be super if fire did behave realistically like that, but none of us lay-folk can really answer your questions. I don't think there has been any bones about this since Steve started throwing them.

[Soddball]

I would like to see CMX2 implement fire in the same way that The Sims did.

[Baneman]

Originally posted by stoat:

He probably gets Shermans just to watch them burn.

Shermans burn ? :eek:

Those uber-tough-as-nails-instant-kill-devices ?

I'd love to see one burn in the game. Right now if my oppo buys one, I'll know to flee the battlefield immediately.

[lucero1148]

I know nothing about programing but wouldn't that kind of detailing put a strain on the graphics engine and slow the game down? If that's so I wouldn't put a high priority on fire in buildings.

Patrick

[Peter Cairns]

In CM1 when abuilding filled a full box, fire was either on or off and worked ok. But now we are talking about buildings and parts of buildings less than 25 ft across, exactly where the fire is and how it spreads will be more significant.

It could be a key factor if you are dealing with buildings of four or five stories. When that HE shell hit and started a fire, was it the floor above or the one below.

We've been told that doors windows and stairs will be modelled, so where in the building a fire is could have a real effect.

Then there is smoke. it tends to spread internally first, then out windows and then up. This could effect LOS high on one side of a building but not low on the other.

In some respects smoke and it's effects may well be more important than fire, because of it's effect on LOS, although how the new morale system deals with mans greatest fear, will be another issue.

Because I think that 1:1 represntation and a more detailed grid will make close combat a more intense and rewarding experience, I think how building (and indeed woodland) fire is simulated could become a big issue, which is why I started this thread.

Obviously from the few responses not many others seem to see it as a big issue.

I think it is, and maybe i am nieve, but I believe that BF actually takes on board what we put in.

[Lee_DiSantis]

I think it is, and maybe i am nieve, but I believe that BF actually takes on board what we put in.

you are, because it's spelled 'naive'.

[Peter Cairns]

No I meant maybe my name is Nieve, and not Peter at all.

(or i could just admit I can't spell).

Peter.

[YankeeDog]

I can remember, back when CMBO was the only BFC game, having discussions about fire and, among other things, the way it spread in buildings.

I have a friend who is the fire marshal for a town in Connecticut. So I called him up and asked him some questions about it.

I got a whole bunch of information from him, a lot of which went right over my head. But one important piece I got, which is a big part of firefighter training, is that even a very small uncontrolled fire generates enough smoke and toxic fumes to make an enclosed structure uninhabitable VERY quickly -- usually, within seconds. What's more, depending on exactly what is burning, some of the toxins created can be heavier than air, so fires on upper floor can lower floors, too.

Based on the information, I think a unit being able to continue to fight from one part of a building that had even a small uncontrolled fire burning in it would be very rare, unless the building were very large.

However, there might be things about fires on the tactical battlefield that would change this somewhat. For example, many of the things that create fires in buildings also create large holes (as in big HE shells), and such holes might vent most of the fumes out of the building. But this is speculation on my part.

Oh, another thing he said: While toxicity from smoke builds up very quickly, actual killing heat takes much longer. I asked him the question because people creating "fire barriers" with Wasps was a common tactic in CMBO. His point was that often, so long as you're wearing decently heavy shoes and clothing, you can run right through a recently started fire for as long as you can hold your breath, with little more injury than singed eyebrows.

So I think a unit getting caught on an upper floor due to fire on the stairwell would be unlikely, except perhaps in the case of flamethrowers, which could start a large fire very quickly. Otherwise, the fire would have to burn for several minutes before it really became impassable. Units on the upper floors would be forced to move out by the smoke long before the fire became hot enough to truly trap them.

Of course, they could be trapped if the stairs were simply be blown away by HE. . .

Cheers,

YD

Cheers,

YD

[Peter Cairns]

YankeeDog

What you say about the effect of smoke and the speed it moves at could be the best way to go, with even small fires forcing people to abandon buildings fairly quickly.

That way the dynamics of fire spread needed by as detailed or as processor demanding, because by the time it started to spread , almost all units would have moved on.

Peter.