Panzer II : what use in mid/late war ?

[Thin Red Line]

Their armamant is so ridiculous and obsolete starting from 42 i really wonder what is the best use for those light tanks ? And their ammo stock is quite low, emptied in a couple of turns.

Any suggestions ?

Recon, infantry hunting ?

[Tigrii]

They're a good sort of expendable recon unit.

[Redwolf]

The weapon wasn't adequate when they started building it.

It is a really a tracked scout car on the eastern front.

The problem with these things on the eastern front is that the Soviets never really bothered with thinly armored vehicles for frontline purposes, so the 20mm cannon doesn't have good targets.

On the Western front you would find more victims and the high ammo load and the high hit probablity kick in.

Now, if the Soviets start using 20mm autocannon vehicles, much of the German armor fleet can run for the hills. When comparing to the Soviets, it is amazing to see how much thin crap the Germans fielded.

[NewSocialistMan]

The only thing this useless piece of fascist crap is good for is sniffing out AT guns.

[flamingknives]

And killing pillboxes, halftracks, especially those damned M17s, early war Soviet tanks such as the BT5s and T26s. The high rate of fire is also good at messing up infantry. They kill T60s quite well too.

Late war, it is the absolute bane of any pillbox.

[Silvio Manuel]

I would think that they would serve well as mobile MG/20mm nests esp. in poor ground conditions. They shouldn't be quite so vulnerable to ATRs as the HT's are. They won't be too useful in the "guard the J-Tiger's flank from Hellcats/M10's" role, since Soviet TD's are thick, and they barely need them b/c T34s (any flavor) aren't much more exp. than SU's.

[Nippy]

Originally posted by Thin Red Line:

Their armamant is so ridiculous and obsolete starting from 42 i really wonder what is the best use for those light tanks ? And their ammo stock is quite low, emptied in a couple of turns.

Any suggestions ?

Recon, infantry hunting ?

The PZII was obsolete in 1940, let alone 1942. Use some mission builder magic and have early era PZII go up against captured French R-35's

Not pretty...

AS for your question. They make good scouts, Transports (Light Mortars and HMGs), and infantry support tanks. That is about it.

(Ah, this brings back memories from my WWII Online days. The French get the S-35, the Brits get the Matilida II, and the Germans get the PZII. Fun times indeed. )

[Sgt. Schultz]

Pillbox killer, infantry ravager, HMG hauler. Half Tracks and MG carriers cry in fear upon the sight of the versatile PzII.

It is cheap, well-armored for the tasks you set upon it, and has that high rate of fire.

Think of it as a Puma that survives longer at the cost of road speed.

If the rarity price allows, I would pick PzIIs over just about any scout or armored car in the german inventory. I don't get stupid and buy them no matter what, but if they are affordable, they have plenty of uses.

[Wilhammer]

The first German tank I 'liked' and could identify, was this thing called the PZKW II.

My first sight of one was a "Ghost Tank" comic book, circa 1972.

A couple of years after that, I found the Bandai 1/48 scale tank series, and the first one I bought was the Pzkw II. It was the catalog in that model that got me into the other tanks, and strangely, the models of everything Bandai had in 1/48 were in a local drug store (in those days, the local drug store was a great hobby supply house), and they had them dirt cheap. I still have a Wespe unbuilt and a Hummel that is partly built. The rest vanished with my childhood

Fine models; shame Bandai does not make them anymore. The last thing I sam a Bandai label on was Power Ranger toys.

[Thin Red Line]

Thanks for your replies, plenty of useful stuff as always.

I bought 2 of them in a 1500pts combined QB and i realized my mistake quickly.

But in a very large armor scenario i get 2 platoons of them ; i think they will be useful for the reco role and i'll try to make them survive.

[JP Jones]

a bit off topic, but you can get a lot of those awesome bandai 1:48 scale models on eBay. You can also still buy them in some hobby shops here in Japan too.

[ November 28, 2002, 06:49 AM: Message edited by: JP Jones ]

[Nippy]

Pillbox killer, infantry ravager, HMG hauler...

Soviet Players justification for buy AT rifles.

In all seriousness though, they do make much better scouts and inf support that any Armored car or HT.

[Andreas]

Panzer IIs were quite prominent in the Wolchow counteroffensive spring/summer 1942, because they were the only tanks that could negotiate the terrain.

[Thin Red Line]

Because they are lighter ? Is that modelled in cm by the ground pressure and low risk of bogging ?

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by Wilhammer:

...in a local drug store (in those days, the local drug store was a great hobby supply house), and they had them dirt cheap.

Same for me in the '50s. You could get a fairly wide variety of models and most kits cost about a buck back then. Paint and glue extra.

Michael

[Olle Petersson]

Originally posted by redwolf:

The weapon wasn't adequate when they started building it.

It is a really a tracked scout car on the eastern front.

It was a recon vehicle when they started building it...

Design purpose:

PzKw I - Training tank, not meant for combat.

PzKw II - Recon vehicle for the tank battalions.

PzKw III - Breakthrough tank, mainly for AT use.

PzKw IV - Support tank with good HE capability.

PzKw VI - Heavy tank to aid assaults.

PzKw V - Medium tank to replace PzKw III and PzKw IV.

The only reason PzKw I and PzKw II saw combat was shortage of tanks.

PzKw IIF was used for recon from '41 to mid '43.

'41 to '42 it was also used to fill gaps in the tank companies.

Cheers

Olle

[Thin Red Line]

Originally posted by Olle Petersson:

Wow. I can imagine the enthusiasm of the crews supposed to face the T-34s.

[xerxes]

For what it's worth, I just had an opponent take out my T34 (frontally, early model of T34) with a pair of PzIIs. The PzIIs were hulldown and about 400m off.

[Nippy]

Originally posted by xerxes:

For what it's worth, I just had an opponent take out my T34 (frontally, early model of T34) with a pair of PzIIs. The PzIIs were hulldown and about 400m off.

Not to mention they rip early war BT-7s and T-26s to shreads...then again so do water ballons, cotton balls, and random air particals.