Sneak or crawl?

[Captain Wacky]

Can someone please tell me the advantages of sneaking or crawling or a situation in which you would use one. The manual does not explain it well. I assume that sneak is supposed to be the most stealthy movement, but isn't it harder to see a crawling enemy? Also the manual states that crawling soldiers stick to the best cover. What gives?

[Pak40]

Sneak is more like the Move command, only your troops wont fire at any enemy units that it can see (unless they are dangerously close). The whole purpose of the sneak command is so that you can move a unit to a location under secrecy. It wont fire shots, thereby giving away it's location. Obviously, this command is also good for conserving ammo.

The Crawl command is safer for a unit because the unit is considered prone. But this command is very slow and isn't very much use if your unit is trying to get to another location. I only use this command if a unit is under heavy fire and I want to move him out of LOS of the enemy units. I also only use this command if the unit is in some sort of cover.

Do NOT cross open space with the Crawl command. Enemy units will be able to spot your crawling men easily and your men will be shot to pieces because it will take an entire turn to cross 20 meters.

If you need to cross an open space that you KNOW is being watched by enemy units then use the FAST command. It's the safest way to cross because it will get your men into cover quickly.

[Michael Emrys]

Also, crawling units tire more quickly than units given any other non-run movement order.

IIRC, rested units do sneak movement more effectively than tired units.

Michael

[CombinedArms]

Good points above. One way to think of it is that crawl is a specialized command to be used in the right circumstances: when moving over short distances when it's important to remain really low. (You can crawl behind a wall or hedge & not be seen). But most experienced players, I would venture, don't use "crawl" very often.

Sneak, on the other hand, is a standard command that I use constantly, perhaps more than any other infantry movement command. It's a little slower than "Move", so I don't use it if I need to cover some ground and don't expect to make contact with the enemy right yet. And I "run" if I need get there fast in a short spurt (it's tiring) or to cross open ground under fire. But moving through woods or scattered trees and expecting to shortly make contact, sneak is the command of choice, IMHO. A sneaking unit also spots well and is most likely to fire when firing would be advantageous, but not otherwise. It's a good technique to run toward an occupied building, then enter it in sneak mode. This seems to me to mirror real life.

[Chad Harrison]

not much can be said to add to the above mentioned tactics, but when im moving my men into a flanking position, i will always sneak them through the woods and even sometimes through the open. this is because they spot the best when sneaking ,move the slowest, and it harder to spot them than if they were moving/running. this way if the spot a far off tank or infantry, there is a chance the turn will end before shots are fired and i can change my tactics the next turn. this is a good tactic so long as time is not off the essense.

[PiggDogg]

It seems to me the following: Sneak - unit moves carefully with some stealth and if fired upon, will stop & return fire. Crawl - unit crawls (duh, really ??), but when fired upon, the idiots continue to crawl and don't immediately return fire. Sneaking seems to impart a quicker, return fire ability than does crawling.

Has anyone else had similar experiences? Correct me if I am wrong. :confused: :confused:

Cheers, Richard

[JasonC]

The only time to crawl is when you are behind a wall. Easy to remember, because it rhymes. Walls give 100% protection to anyone flat on the ground behind them, hiding or pinned - or crawling.

Don't use crawl to break LOS while under heavy fire. Use "withdraw-run"; it is much faster and speed is more essential than cover when breaking LOS.

Run in the open and move in woods or buildings, as a rule. Running through non-open terrain is particularly tiring and gains you little. Also, you are more likely to run into enemies in such places, and a unit with "move" spots and shoots better than one running.

Sneak is the command of choice for the last 20 meters of movement in cover. When you are deep in cover and out of LOS, and are ready to move to the forward edge of cover, expecting to get LOS to enemies once you do - sneak. Note that only units capable of fast movement can sneak. You are much more likely to avoid being seen. The speed difference over such a small distance is trivial.

If you add a "hide" after the sneak, the command will become "sneak and hide", and your unit will not give itself away even if a target is visible. This is perfect for setting up ambushes, positioning AT teams without drawing infantry fire, etc.

It is worth learning the technique of "sulking" in a large body of cover with a large body of infantry. This is a tactic for several units rather than one, making use of some of the above. The idea is to originally position the men deep enough in the cover - I'll use woods to illustrate the principle - that they cannot be seen from the outside. Which naturally means they can't see out either - but they can cover the treeline.

Then, sneak one or two units forward to about 10m from the treeline, using sneak&hide. They are your eyes, to spot the enemy coming. Everyone else is still safe. When the scouts see targets, sneak roughly half the men up to the treeline (but not the HQs), and the following turn open up with everybody, stopping all the "hide" orders.

When you draw fire in response, withdraw all the forward guys back into the woods, completely breaking LOS. Sneak the rest of the rearward guys to the woodline in the gaps between the old set coming back. Soon you have a manned treeline again, but the enemy can't see you. He sees a whole cloud of leftover flag markers, but no solid targets. Your new guys open up again, and he sees a few "infantry?" markers in the see of leftovers.

Repeat, and he will never progress to full ID of your units. His direct fire will be much less effective. You can easily keep 1/3rd of your men covering the open ground beyond the treeline, and you will have time to rally men who took a bit of fire in their turn at the edge. Your HQs are untouched, to keep morale high. If he tries to come into your woods themselves, he will suppress only the forward guys, and encountered more men than he bargained for, less suppressed than he thought.

It is a very useful infantry tactic. The counter to it is HE (especially off-board artillery), which doesn't need direct LOS to hurt people - but no one can afford to dump HE everywhere forever. If you get hit by HE, shift positions back in the woods. Obviously this is easier in a larger forest. You can do the same thing in towns by using the back side and lower floors as the "interior", and the front windows and upper floors as the "treeline".

Just remember, when "sulking", you "sneak" forward and "withdraw" back. "Run" in the open and "move" in cover. Only "crawl" behind a wall.

I hope this helps.

[Chad Harrison]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Richard:[QB]Sneaking seems to impart a quicker, return fire ability than does crawling.

Has anyone else had similar experiences? [QB]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

if have noticed that also and seeme to be true. a tactic you can use (if you have the patience!) is to give the sneak order in very short intervals (1-3m). because they will not always stop to fire, but they are more likely to fire than with the move order. with the short distance order, they will stop at a turn point and fire.

[D'arcy Montague]

I must beg to differ with the strain of the above posts, I find that crawl is a most useful command. It allows small bodies of men to cross short distances (eg. 20m) using the slightest fold in the ground to avoid detection. Obviously elevations have to be taken into account when doing this.

When it is crucial that your units aren't seen, then crawl is often the better command. Some good examples are getting your troops into position before "jumping off" or getting that precious HQ unit foward to spot for your mortars. It is certainly useful for a great deal more than cowering behind hedges and walls.

[Walker]

JasonC, your 'sulking' tactic sounds extremely interesting and I'll certainly be trying it at the next occasion. It might even work well with HMGs positioned something like 22 metres deep in the forest. Also, instead of 'withdrawing' you could use a run command combined with a long pause (ideally 55-58 secs). Of course, if and when your opponent cottons on to this tactic he could area target the last known position with an appropriate HE weapen a minute later, so if the treeline is wide enough you'd be well advised to vary the system a bit.

Great post JasonC!

[Coach36]

JasonC's post is great advice. Thanks for sharing.