DesertMouse Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Been playing CMAK for a while now, and as a tactical simulator of the Med theatre, it's second to none. Then I started reading some of the history surrounding the scenarios I was playing. Especially Monte Cassino, and the Benedictine Monastery on that mountain. All I can say is, nice one allies. Blow up all of those historical documents - not cool. Blow up a monastery with no soldiers in there - not cool. Then allow the Germans to occupy perfect infantry holding environment - better than most urban rubble - not cool Many Brits, US, Kiwis, Poles, Indians and others dead - not cool. It's pretty shameful actually. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 True. I assume you've just viewed the documentary on SBS on the subject? Quite an interesting programme, especially when they highlighted that after bombing the absolute bejeezus out of the monastery there was no follow up attack on the devastated area until a few days later. This allowed the Fallschirmjager troops to occupy the ruins & fortify the position without being harrassed by an impending attack. Really poor planning one has to say and it beggars the question...why the hell bomb what was thought to be a critical part of the Germans defences but then not follow up with an immediate attack? A complete stuff-up all round it appears to have been. Regards Jim R. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Coulda, woulda, shoulda. Most decisions probably made sense before the event. *shrug* Mace 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hortlund Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Wasnt it Freyburg who insisted on the bombing? It was ages ago I read about Cassino, and I honestly dont remember. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParaBellum Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 For a seriously depressing read I recommend "Cassino - The Hollow Victory" by John Ellis. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Tons of HE was the way they attacked. As for not following up immediately, it is not exactly accessible. That was half the point of sending HE - it could get there, men could not. It was stupid because it was ineffective. The Germans were using the place, but only for spotting. And you can't make spotting go away with a massive fire mission or carpet bombing. Spotting only takes a few guys. Big HE missions need lots of enemy under them to be useful. I have no doubt a big part of the reason they did it anyway was the principle of hitting anything the Germans used. They were trying to be ruthless and determined, thinking it would help with effectiveness. A common idiocy in war. As for the overall fight for the position, that is another story. It was the key to a very strong German position overall. Allied attack methods against that whole line were not very effective, but in the end is was the relentless unimaginative attrition battering that did the job. The razzle dazzle end around at Anzio failed miserably. Not like they didn't try it, it just didn't work. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Originally posted by Leutnant Hortlund: Wasnt it Freyburg who insisted on the bombing? It was ages ago I read about Cassino, and I honestly dont remember. Sort of. He asked for it to be attacked, but was more than a little surprised when the heavies turned up. Use of heavies in direct support of ground operations was a very novel concept at this stage of the ewar, and it took quite a while (i.e., about another 2 years) before those involved worked the SWOT analysis on it. Not surprisingly, in the meantime there were quite a few cockups. (Cassino, Cassino again, CHARNWOOD, GOODWOOD, COBRA, QUEEN, etc) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunwinglow Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 None as big a cock-up as trying to take on the Russian winter though, thank goodness. Or failing to press home at Dunkirk. Or over-extending in the Western Desert. Or thinking all your agents were sending back pukka gen (they had all been 'turned'). Or getting your U-boat Kapitans to use radios willy-nilly so the Allies could get a fix on them with Huff-Duff. Or designing 4-engined bombers capable of dive-bombing (He177). Or not putting a 'jinker' in the controls of the V-1. I could go on.... Hindsight is 20-20. Tim P 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Bolt Posted May 15, 2005 Share Posted May 15, 2005 Originally posted by CousinPablo: Been playing CMAK for a while now, and as a tactical simulator of the Med theatre, it's second to none. Then I started reading some of the history surrounding the scenarios I was playing. Especially Monte Cassino, and the Benedictine Monastery on that mountain. All I can say is, nice one allies. Blow up all of those historical documents - not cool. Blow up a monastery with no soldiers in there - not cool. Then allow the Germans to occupy perfect infantry holding environment - better than most urban rubble - not cool Many Brits, US, Kiwis, Poles, Indians and others dead - not cool. It's pretty shameful actually. Where is "Karnack the Great" when you need him? Not cool. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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