alexoscar Posted October 11, 2003 Share Posted October 11, 2003 I have got CMBB and CMBO and i am waiting for the release of CMAK. I have been a fan of tactical games since the primitive Kampfgruppe (SSI in the 80,s) the three Steel panthers, the talonsoft games (west front, eastern front, divided ground...) and im sure that the best product in tactical simulation is the combat mission serie. Everybody who is interested in WWII, is interested in the first campaigns, when was developed the blitzkrieg tactic. When tanks, panzerdivisionen, and other weapons and lower units, were developed. When Guderian put in practice his ideas about the new kind of war. It was the beginnig of all. However, there isnt a combat mission game that let us to fight in Poland 1939, the west front in 1940, the balkans invassion in 1941.... anyone of you know why? I think it would be fun and different. Hitler wouldnt have got to conquest France in 4 weeks, or Poland in 25 days with panthers or tigers, slow and unreliable vehicles. These vehicles were adequated to de defensive war since 1943. Thanks to everybody. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted October 11, 2003 Share Posted October 11, 2003 Hello Alexoscar I'm sure a grog with a HD memory will come by and let you know when the early war period was discussed. I'm not certain what Cmx2 will cover. I would guess West Front after 1944. Early war? Cmak will cover that in North Africa. Depending on what forces are available in CMAK it might be possible to create an early war French vs German scenario. You can probably do a Brit vs German one also - again depending on what equipment is shown in CMAK. For 1939 Poland several designers created scenarios for that period. Listed below are the ones I did but I believe there are a number of others. These are at the Scenario Depot. Small Battles, Polish Spoiler Coming in a today or tomorrow Small Battles, Noose (Polish cavalry runs for the Hungarian border to avoid capture) Small Battles, Corridor (German recon battalion leads the attack into the Polish Corridor) Which are all 1939 Poland 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 11, 2003 Share Posted October 11, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: However, there isnt a combat mission game that let us to fight in Poland 1939, the west front in 1940, the balkans invassion in 1941.... anyone of you know why? I think it would be fun and different.BFC is mum about their plans for CM4 at the moment, but it had been earlier discussed that it would cover the Blitzkrieg Years. We'll just have to wait and see. BTW, from the time of the opening of the campaign in the west on 10 May until the capitulation of France on 22 June was just over six weeks by my reckoning. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoscar Posted October 11, 2003 Author Share Posted October 11, 2003 Originally posted by Michael Emrys: BTW, from the time of the opening of the campaign in the west on 10 May until the capitulation of France on 22 June was just over six weeks by my reckoning. In four weeks the west campaign was over, because since 5 June, BEF had been evacuated from France through Dunkirk, the French Army hadnt armoured divisions (all cuirasee divisions were destroyed in the previous battles and counterattacks) and there wasnt any opportunitie against the german panzergruppen. Dont forget that a war ends when one side is defeated, no when the governments signs the armistice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted October 11, 2003 Share Posted October 11, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: Everybody who is interested in WWII, is interested in the first campaigns, when was developed the blitzkrieg tactic. When tanks, panzerdivisionen, and other weapons and lower units, were developed. When Guderian put in practice his ideas about the new kind of war. It was the beginnig of all. But Guderian never really was able to put his ideas into practice in full force. German victories were as much, if not more, of a result of how crappy their enemies were than how "good" the Germans were. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 12, 2003 Share Posted October 12, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: Dont forget that a war ends when one side is defeated, no when the governments signs the armistice. That's not a definition that I ever came across before. It is universally recognized that a war ends when armed fighting ceases. That is usually formalized by an an instrument of surrender is signed by the warring parties. For instance, WW II against Germany is recognized as May 8th. 1945, whereas by your definition one could say that Germany could have been considered defeated at any other number of earlier points. You can't just go around making up your own definitions and expect to be taken seriously. The war against France lasted six weeks, as is recorded in the histories of that period. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoscar Posted October 12, 2003 Author Share Posted October 12, 2003 Originally posted by Michael Emrys: [/qb]You can't just go around making up your own definitions and expect to be taken seriously. The war against France lasted six weeks, as is recorded in the histories of that period. Michael [/QB] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoscar Posted October 12, 2003 Author Share Posted October 12, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: we couldnt agree in anything. We could say for example, Germany lost the war on 22 June 1941, when Barbarrossa started. Sorry, on 22 JULY 1941. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted October 12, 2003 Share Posted October 12, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by alexoscar: we couldnt agree in anything. We could say for example, Germany lost the war on 22 June 1941, when Barbarrossa started. Sorry, on 22 JULY 1941. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoscar Posted October 12, 2003 Author Share Posted October 12, 2003 Originally posted by Sergei: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by alexoscar: Disagreeing with yourself now? It began on 22nd of June, not July. [/QB]</font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 12, 2003 Share Posted October 12, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: When i said that France was defeated in four weeks, i wasnt giving an exact date, i only wanted to explain that the French Army, the best considered before the war, had losen all opportunitie to win the war because the new blitzkrieg strategy in that period.I think you are quite right about that. After the Northern Armies had been cut off, surrounded, and forced to evacuate without their heavy equipment, there was virtually no chance whatever that the Allies would succeed in resisting the continued German onslaught. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wisbech_lad Posted October 13, 2003 Share Posted October 13, 2003 Maybe some grog will be able to tell me what (if any) difference there would be between May '40 BEF and May '40 CW troops in Egypt? An Arras operation should be doable... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexoscar Posted October 13, 2003 Author Share Posted October 13, 2003 Originally posted by Wisbech_lad: Maybe some grog will be able to tell me what (if any) difference there would be between May '40 BEF and May '40 CW troops in Egypt? An Arras operation should be doable... Im not sure about the meaning of your question. Is it about equipment or kind of units? The BEF (British Expeditionary Force) was created to send a British Army Corp to France to support the French Armies like in the WWI. It was deployed near Lille with ten divisions, and its commander was Gort. The Army in Egypt on May 1940, was a garrison army until the italian attack on 13th September 1940. Then it was reinforced with Australian troops and with the 7th Armoured Division. British started the counterattack on 8th December 1940. Alex. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wisbech_lad Posted October 13, 2003 Share Posted October 13, 2003 Sorry, what I meant was that if the BEF TO&E (and Rommel's Panzer div) TO&E were similar to their desert counterparts, then by playing with the editor it should be possible to recreate Arras - using Italian scenery, even if the date looks wrong in the toolbar. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firefly Posted October 13, 2003 Share Posted October 13, 2003 Originally posted by alexoscar: The Army in Egypt on May 1940, was a garrison army until the italian attack on 13th September 1940. Then it was reinforced with Australian troops and with the 7th Armoured Division. British started the counterattack on 8th December 1940. Alex. Not quite, the basis of 7th Armoured was already there before the war in the Mobile Force, or the Immobile Farce as it was initially nicknamed, before Maj. Gen Hobart arrived to reoriganise it. The first skirmishes against the Italians were conducted by 11th Hussars in their Rolls Royce Armoured Cars. Hobart, as usual, fell out with his superiors and was replaced before the fighting started and returned to Britain, where he spent a few months serving as a Lance-Corporal in the Home Guard, before Churchill found him a job more suited to his talents. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berlichtingen Posted October 13, 2003 Share Posted October 13, 2003 Originally posted by Wisbech_lad: Maybe some grog will be able to tell me what (if any) difference there would be between May '40 BEF and May '40 CW troops in Egypt?Matilda Mk1 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 13, 2003 Share Posted October 13, 2003 Originally posted by Wisbech_lad: Sorry, what I meant was that if the BEF TO&E (and Rommel's Panzer div) TO&E were similar to their desert counterparts, then by playing with the editor it should be possible to recreate Arras - using Italian scenery, even if the date looks wrong in the toolbar. I can't give you detailed TO&Es, you'll have to look elsewhere for that, but they were significantly different in both cases. Whether you can manage to cobble together something convincing or not will depend on just what is included in CMAK, but I am not optimistic. Arras, and several other battles during the Battle for France and the Low Countries, will be interesting to model, but I think we will have to wait on CM4 (or whatever number) to do it properly. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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