Anybody got cover/concealment values?

[Other Means]

Are these available anywhere i.e. Brush = 50% cover, 40% concealment etc?

I've got rule of thumb ones which everybody uses and I assumed everyone assumed the same. But I've recently taken over a game from someone and I can see that it can be played quite differently from the way I've been playing, so I'd like to at least ground some of my assumptions in fact.

Cheers.

[MikeyD]

I recall seeing cover values for CMBB a long looong time ago, even did my own tests for concealment in wheat fields, but it's too far back for me to recall the specifics.

The trick is, the concealment number's aren't static. A green squad set 3 meters back into scattered trees in autumn will have much different concealment values than a crack squad set 8 meters back in summer - on an overcast day.

...And if your opponent has binoculars the number s will change again!

[Jim1954]

Other Means,

Look towards the bottom for cmbb and cmak xl files. There are exposure tables inside.

http://users.erols.com/chare/cm/

[JasonC]

Strong cover - trenches 9%, heavy buildings 11%, woods or pines foxholes 11%, woods or pines no foxholes 14%. Good enough for primary defensive positions.

Decent cover - scattered trees 25% (with foxholes similar, but better vs. HE), wood building 25%, rubble 25%, rough 25%. Exposed behind a wall 30% (heads down 0%). Good enough for attackers to firefight from. Secondary defensive positions, LPs, infantry AT etc.

"Approach" cover - foxholes alone 45%, shellholes 45%, brush wheat rocky or cemetary 50%. Better than open ground, but not strong enough to firefight from. Negates cover panic against light fire but not against pinning strength fire. Use for advances and to conceal moves between better types, coupled with range ("and hide") and time to rally. Do not try to use to firefight from. Hedges and fences are marginal versions of this, but if otherwise in the open are poor cover.

Open types - steppe 65% (the best of them, some concealment at 500m ranges), pavement 70%, open or soft 70-75%, marsh 65% but very slow movement. Poor, cross on advance or short "fast" dashes, always with a cover waypoint ahead. "And hide" can be used with steppe at long range. Defenders should cover with arcs 20m or more away from cover.

Hazardous movement - wire 100%, rail lines, bridges. Avoid while covered by fire, dash move across them by single units at a time, never overpacking the route. Defenders should incorporate into fire schemes.

[Other Means]

Jason, thank you.

Jim1954 - thanks, that's the kind of thing I was hoping for, but the CM3_EXP.XLS spreadsheet is empty. I have a full version of Excel, does anybody else have this issue?

[Jim1954]

Read the little notes at that website under the down load. For some goofy reason, you have to highlight the entire excel page and then choose a font color from the buttons on top. THEN the page will be legible.

[zmoney]

With the excel sheet, just click the topic left box, which will high light the whole page, then click on what ever color you wish to read in.

[Other Means]

Originally posted by Jim1954:

Read the little notes at that website under the down load. For some goofy reason, you have to highlight the entire excel page and then choose a font color from the buttons on top. THEN the page will be legible.

Oops, RTFM. Thanks.

[Erik Springelkamp]

Originally posted by JasonC:

Defenders should cover with arcs 20m or more away from cover.

Sorry, I don't understand what the 20m means?

[JasonC]

Ah, a fine question.

Defenders often want to ensure they shoot at attackers only while they are in the open. Because firefights with more numerous enemies while they are in cover can be hazardous to your health, and because defenders seldom have the ammo to break larger bodies of attackers in good cover, especially at long range. Either you don't shoot at all at long range, or you have to arrange to hit them while they are at their most exposed.

What the 20m refers to is a buffer of open ground around your covered arc area. The idea is to let the target get well out into the open before opening fire. If you hit them the instant they step into the open, they hit the dirt, crawl for 10 seconds, and are back in cover again. Instead you want them far enough out that you can hit them repeatedly while they are in the open, hopefully force them into "cover panic" (sneaking in the wrong direction), and the like.

The following turn you can of course extend the arc if you like.

What you want to avoid is (1) firing at men in good cover at long range and (2) "herding" the attackers into great cover with LOS of your men, by brushing them back into it helpfully, the minute they step out. Instead, let them get well and truely into the middle of a wide patch of no cover, and then let them have it.

[Erik Springelkamp]

Clear.

This brings up another question which that I wondered about several times: how far away do I put covered arcs for infantery defenders when the terrain itself doesn't give a direct clue?

Now I take about 100m for squads and a zone close around my frontline squads for HQ's, but this is more a wild guess, putting the tresshold at about 50% maximum firepower.

I am sure there are more scientific ways of choosing these distances

[JasonC]

At 75m, much of the firepower comes from the lesser automatics, like SMGs. At 150m, those are basically worthless, while the MGs and rifles are fully effective.

So I usually pick my ranges depending on my weapons load out and what I expect the enemy's to be. Sometimes terrain enters, too. You can afford to shoot farther into open ground. The last factor I consider is ammo load. Squads with only 30 or so shots do not want to open up at long ranges.

My HQs frequently have 75m covered arcs as a result, sometimes only 30m if they are trying to stay hidden instead of trying to help out. SMGs generally get 75m. Rifle and LMG squad types frequently get 150m arcs, cut down to 125m or so for the lower ammo types. The idea being to stop e.g. a PPsH equipped squad before it gets close enough to be deadly. HMGs I will often let fire at ranges as long as 500m. In open steppe, rifle squads with mid 40s ammo or better will get 250m arcs.

I make use of uniform shorter arcs like this more as the attacker than as the defender, though. Typically 180 degree and the above distances. On defense I will vary the arcs much more, unit to unit. Including narrow long ones for some MGs, short ones into open only, stopped by the nearest cover the enemy is likely to reach and padded 20m or so as described, etc. Then I also will change them on the fly, as I see the attackers coming. Shortening arcs to let the first scout by then lengthening them to catch the main body, is a typical defender tactic.