Biltong's Campaign Rules

[Cabron66]

Originally posted by Scarhead:

Rule 1:

The quality decreases during the war

Rule 2:

In periods of heavy fighting (Stalingrad) or deadly weather (winter...), there is an additional penalty.

It helps quite a bit. Thanks for the time. BTW, in the end I couldn't get those bunkers to stick, but I don't think it takes too much away from the game. The small sacrifice is worth it to play the extended battles.

[uhu]

Hello again Scarhead and all Biltong's campaign fan!

I played many battles, here are the results (questions, rule modifications, battle group managing - hope, it will be not too long ).

Questions

1., Allied counter Assault/Att. - Is it also in such situation valid, if I didn't attacked? (the russians attacked before)

2., Support troops modifiers - in winter, both time and battle modifiers are valid (for example: dec'41 + Allied counter attack)? The time modofier is valid in all support troop category, or only at the infantry?

Battle group management

(First I played with Biltaid, but there were several bugs (for example with emergency reorganization, heavy tank xp, MG xp, etc.) At the Kiev battle pack, I learned the rules, and since than I play in that way. For Biltaid players: try the rules - they are not so hard! .)

What I missed, was the battle group table, where I can my little, nicey Kampfgruppe, how it earns xp-s, and so on. I found a solution for that: I made an Excel tabble for my Kampfgruppe, in the same way, as it is in Biltaid. Than made another table, where I wrote the battle results, favor earns. In another table my Kampfgruppe commanders. Than I copied them in the rules excel file. Why was it good? Because, it must not have always change between the several excel files! When somebody interests for it, I can send him.

Some rule modifications

1., Elite status: after 120 xp - maybe nobody will earn it, but why not ?

2., The defensive tools (barbed wire, mines, etc.) should be free choosable. It is very annoying, what the AI choose for us mostly. Allied attacks are very hard to repell, so I think the axis commander should have the choice, how he wants to strenghten the defenses. Otherway, it's always a great challange, to choose the right defensive tools, which are the most usable for the situation, enemy tpye.

Rules modificatons

1., Large battles

I think, for most players, it's not very challenging to command a big (many thousand pt) army: the computer thinks a lot of, the AI is mostly not very clever, our Kampfgruppe do nothing - we can even hide them, because, the other troops will do the job - I suggest to forget the 5x option, only leave the normal, 2x, 3x, where the chance for 3x is very low (10 die: 10, for 2x 7-9). There is a +1 modifier, if the previous battle was not large.

2., Winter temperatures

I play mostly extreme cold - choosen by me. I think, that winter in 1941, 42 were very cold, so the die with modifiers should bring out always extreme cold, or frozen.

3., Ammo problem

Because the game often ends the battle at low ammo level (and, othrway, it is also not very great, if the AI attacks with 10-20% ammo). So, for axis forces, the lowest ammo-level is 40% (what you can increase with your favor) and for the AI, at attacking is also not lower, than 50%.

4., The allied attack should have in higher percentages combined arms. It's mostly boring and very easy, if the russkies attacks with infantry only, or mech because, they can not do anything again my armoured forces. Inf only should be very low, mech should be also low.

5., Minor nationalities in '42

It would be much more realistic/historical, if in one month, we could meet only the same minor nationalities. There were far from each other. (All right, the hungarians and italians were besides, but the romanians were far souther from that.) Maybe, the percentage for them could be also raised, because in '42 fought much more axis nationalities as in '41.

That was .

bye,

Uhu

[Joachim]

Originally posted by uhu:

Hello again Scarhead and all Biltong's campaign fan!

I played many battles, here are the results (questions, rule modifications, battle group managing - hope, it will be not too long ).

Questions

1., Allied counter Assault/Att. - Is it also in such situation valid, if I didn't attacked? (the russians attacked before)

Yes. A 2nd wave is coming. Just like your immediate assault - if you were successful, widen the gap. If you lost, next try.

2., Support troops modifiers - in winter, both time and battle modifiers are valid (for example: dec'41 + Allied counter attack)? The time modofier is valid in all support troop category, or only at the infantry?

Have to admit I usually ignored that modifier.

When coding this into an auto-parameters sheet, I added every little modifer (or re-wrote the rules )

Battle group management

(First I played with Biltaid, but there were several bugs (for example with emergency reorganization, heavy tank xp, MG xp, etc.) At the Kiev battle pack, I learned the rules, and since than I play in that way. For Biltaid players: try the rules - they are not so hard! .)

My words. Ignore any modifier you don't understand or use the worst meaning you can get out of the description. We're not at law school here.

Some rule modifications

1., Elite status: after 120 xp - maybe nobody will earn it, but why not ?

Hey, I have a PzIIIj(late) with 150+pts. 70mm frontal keeps you alive...

Crack is good enough. Though I twice faced elite T34s... and an elite KV1.

2., The defensive tools (barbed wire, mines, etc.) should be free choosable. It is very annoying, what the AI choose for us mostly. Allied attacks are very hard to repell, so I think the axis commander should have the choice, how he wants to strenghten the defenses. Otherway, it's always a great challange, to choose the right defensive tools, which are the most usable for the situation, enemy tpye.

You usually don't have a choice what is delivered... TRPs and trenches should receive a bonus.

I suggest you use what I read in the players guide (Don't have it here for quotes, but IIRC it is in there): Don't count minor support troops like small mortars, LMGs etc. You get one, you get many.

My interpretation: Do the same for fortifications: AI buys one TRP, buy as many as you like (within the points limit). Same with mines and trenches. Try to reduce the bean counting.

This is not valid for bunkers. They are expensive enough too keep track individually.

Rules modificatons

1., Large battles

I think, for most players, it's not very challenging to command a big (many thousand pt) army: the computer thinks a lot of, the AI is mostly not very clever, our Kampfgruppe do nothing - we can even hide them, because, the other troops will do the job - I suggest to forget the 5x option, only leave the normal, 2x, 3x, where the chance for 3x is very low (10 die: 10, for 2x 7-9). There is a +1 modifier, if the previous battle was not large.

Already changed that parameter in '42v1.3 (beta).

No modifier from last battle, lower chances in the die roll, an option to ignore x5 and a modifer for Allied attacks and Allied infantry or mech force. Plus the Minimum 200/300/500 rule is replaced by a minimum die roll of 4 or 5. Lower point totals with that.

Based on experience with huge AI attacks (6000+ troops).

2., Winter temperatures

I play mostly extreme cold - choosen by me. I think, that winter in 1941, 42 were very cold, so the die with modifiers should bring out always extreme cold, or frozen.

From the intro to '42 v1.3:

Weather & Temperature:

You’ll face less Thick fog, Blizzard or Extreme Cold. Even on rainy days, there are some hours where it is just overcast. Temperature is spread across 2 seasons, while the weather parameter uses a pre-roll.

I changed extreme cold cause it usually resulted in EC+Blizzard. Maybe I have a look at it and use EC but with less blizzards...

Probability of EC in Jan '42 is 40%. Frozen is another 40%. Dawn/Dusk add 10% to EC, Night 20%.

3., Ammo problem

Because the game often ends the battle at low ammo level (and, othrway, it is also not very great, if the AI attacks with 10-20% ammo). So, for axis forces, the lowest ammo-level is 40% (what you can increase with your favor) and for the AI, at attacking is also not lower, than 50%.

Very generous. If the AI stops the attack cause of low ammo, imagine some other shortages or problems that caused the attack to stop. It happened.

Ammo level now starts at 20% (1-2 is Full ammo). You can spend 10 favor for additional 20% of ammo - so you start at least with 40% if you want to.

4., The allied attack should have in higher percentages combined arms. It's mostly boring and very easy, if the russkies attacks with infantry only, or mech because, they can not do anything again my armoured forces. Inf only should be very low, mech should be also low.

Well, if the human wave is big enough, they will overrun you once your MG ammo for the tanks is gone. I'm in a good mood today. Maybe I'll decrease infantry a bit more than I did (note it only affects '42 or later...).

5., Minor nationalities in '42

It would be much more realistic/historical, if in one month, we could meet only the same minor nationalities. There were far from each other. (All right, the hungarians and italians were besides, but the romanians were far souther from that.) Maybe, the percentage for them could be also raised, because in '42 fought much more axis nationalities as in '41.

That was .

bye,

Uhu

The bulk is still German, and a German KG would expect to fight along Germans. 10% for each minor nation is enough.

Keeping track of who you fought in the last battles is a major programming or bookkeeping issue, so I won't change the rules here.

Thanks for your comments.

Are you still in '41 or already in '42?

If in '42, I'll send you the new rules for testing...

Gruß

Joachim

[Christian Knudsen]

Hi guys - It appears that the link to Supersuolo's site is broken - Anyone else finding this?

[SuperSulo]

It has a new URL :

http://home.swipnet.se/supersulo/biltong/

[uhu]

Thanks for the reaction!

Yes. A 2nd wave is coming. Just like your immediate assault - if you were successful, widen the gap. If you lost, next try.

Yes, I figured meanwhile out, how great is this 'feature'! Whole stories can be made over that. Maybe I will write one of my AAR, which took place in a big city at a bridgehead in 5 battles...

Have to admit I usually ignored that modifier.

When coding this into an auto-parameters sheet, I added every little modifer (or re-wrote the rules )

Really? What a cheater

Well, I played with the -5 modifier in the late weeks of dec 41, in all support types (expect defensive tools of course) Mostly I Didn't got much, but I think, it was quite realistic for the horroristic russian winter conditions

My words. Ignore any modifier you don't understand or use the worst meaning you can get out of the description. We're not at law school here.

I would let for any 'help-program' to make the emergency reorg. It is always my job or duty

Hey, I have a PzIIIj(late) with 150+pts. 70mm frontal keeps you alive...

What??? I never can long enough survive my panzer. When I'm lucky, than I come with them about to 33-35, very rare to over 40, but than a knockout, and everything begins from the start...

I changed extreme cold cause it usually resulted in EC+Blizzard. Maybe I have a look at it and use EC but with less blizzards...

Probability of EC in Jan '42 is 40%. Frozen is another 40%. Dawn/Dusk add 10% to EC, Night 20%.

I agre with you: with EC it is almost always snow, or blizzard. But EC should be left.

Very generous.

Ammo level now starts at 20% (1-2 is Full ammo). You can spend 10 favor for additional 20% of ammo - so you start at least with 40% if you want to.

What? Is the price for 10% ammo 10 favor?

Or rule changed?

Well, if the human wave is big enough, they will overrun you once your MG ammo for the tanks is gone. I'm in a good mood today. Maybe I'll decrease infantry a bit more than I did (note it only affects '42 or later...).

Yeah, sometimes the wave is very big (it is called: Tsunami ) but that happens quite rare. Otherways, if enemy force is unknown, it doesnt metters, what we plan for the force type sheet I made such a sheet, maybe I can send you, if you are interested.

Are you still in '41 or already in '42?

No, yesterday I passed '41 and slept almost one month - qiute lucky my KG was

If in '42, I'll send you the new rules for testing...

Please do so!

Tschüss,

Uhu

[Joachim]

Originally posted by uhu:

Yes, I figured meanwhile out, how great is this 'feature'! Whole stories can be made over that. Maybe I will write one of my AAR, which took place in a big city at a bridgehead in 5 battles...

You're welcome.

Really? What a cheater

Well, I played with the -5 modifier in the late weeks of dec 41, in all support types (expect defensive tools of course) Mostly I Didn't got much, but I think, it was quite realistic for the horroristic russian winter conditions

With large battles it does not apply anyway . The only good thing in the winter were ATGs - and my 150mm sIG. Vehicles or armor were useless...

I would let for any 'help-program' to make the emergency reorg. It is always my job or duty

Great. This is one big unsolved mystery in the auto-rules spreadsheet I'm doing. I finished the battle parameters, will use Jim Lowerres Battlegroup sheet - but I don't know how to do an automatic optimal emergency reorganization yet. Maybe it is best to allow for some manual input and offer an automatic solution that starts with the most depleted units (attachments first, of course).

Hey, I have a PzIIIj(late) with 150+pts. 70mm frontal keeps you alive...

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />

What??? I never can long enough survive my panzer. When I'm lucky, than I come with them about to 33-35, very rare to over 40, but than a knockout, and everything begins from the start...

</font>

[OBJ]

Hi Scarhead etal-

Sorry I've been away so long. RL and my kid's soccer season has limited my BCR time.

Scarhead, I did add a number of macros to make the BCR autosheet even more automatic, such things as updating experience, taking regular replacements, resetting favor, introducing replacement leaders and units, but haven't added all of them yet.

I don't have a good answer for the emergency reorg question Uhu asked about, mainly because everyone's attachments are apt to be different, therefore have a different number of men to reinforce the core force with.

All for now.

[Robert Olesen]

Hi,

I just wanted to say thanks. Mostly to Biltong (if he reads this), but also to everyone who keeps BCR alive.

BCR was what set me on the path towards ROQC. I played BCR and found that while it was fun and interesting, it wasn't quite what I wanted. The fact that BCR could be done inspired me to do a campaign to suit my own tastes. So I did.

Scarhead, check out my spreadsheet if you haven't done so already. It's quite nifty and might provide some inspiration to yours. Which reminds me - I should check out yours. Is it available?

[Joachim]

Originally posted by Robert Olesen:

Hi,

I just wanted to say thanks. Mostly to Biltong (if he reads this), but also to everyone who keeps BCR alive.

BCR was what set me on the path towards ROQC. I played BCR and found that while it was fun and interesting, it wasn't quite what I wanted. The fact that BCR could be done inspired me to do a campaign to suit my own tastes. So I did.

Scarhead, check out my spreadsheet if you haven't done so already. It's quite nifty and might provide some inspiration to yours. Which reminds me - I should check out yours. Is it available?

It is not yet finished. Currently it can generate new battles, but I want to have the Battle group sheet and the favor sheet working with it.

Guess I'll send the preliminary results to you guys tonight. To Rob for some ideas, to Jim to decide how we can put his battlegroup sheet (which I started copying and toyed around a bit) and my rules sheet (plus the favor sheet, but this is minor work) together to create a solution.

Biggest problem as of now for the rules sheet is how to add favor (for more ammo or different troops). Maybe I'll change the rules to ease that...

General Design:

I have a "Calcs - Battle" sheet where the random effects and the rules are. Another sheet sees the ouptut, the "Roll Battle Button", probably (ToDo)some "add favor here" buttons plus finally the "Roll After Battle Button", which copies the "Calcs - Battle sheet" to a "Calcs- Last Battle" sheet.

@Rob: Thanks for allowing me to copy ideas from your sheets . I avoided looking at it too closely for fear of copyright violations.

Gruß

Joachim

[ October 27, 2003, 04:45 AM: Message edited by: Scarhead ]

[Robert Olesen]

Originally posted by Scarhead:

@Rob: Thanks for allowing me to copy ideas from your sheets . I avoided looking at it too closely for fear of copyright violations.

Don't worry. I have no intention of copyrighting this. It doesn't feel right.

[Haohmaru]

Hi there,

I've just downloaded Biltong's rules and am starting to get into it for the first time. I have a question about the map packs though. For my first battle I am supposed to play a medium sized map, but my force size multiplier is x5. Should I choose a medium map from the list of available ones, or should I choose something bigger to compensate for this?

Cheers,

Haoh

[ November 02, 2003, 09:20 PM: Message edited by: Haohmaru ]

[Joachim]

Originally posted by Haohmaru:

Hi there,

I've just downloaded Biltong's rules and am starting to get into it for the first time. I have a question about the map packs though. For my first battle I am supposed to play a medium sized map, but my force size multiplier is x5. Should I choose a medium map from the list of available ones, or should I choose something bigger to compensate for this?

Cheers,

Haoh

The map size (large, med, small) in the map packs does not correspond to the map size in CM.

Be warned that some custom maps play different than generated maps. Depending on terrain, flag positions and setup zones. (The AI might find better places to defend or avenues of apporach on custom maps.)

Take something big (except if it is a city battle).

Remembers me that I had started a list on map sizes for different force sizes. IIRC the battle type did not matter... Now where have I put this... Probably accidentally found its way to the round file :mad: ...

Oh... if you select a map with dynamic flags. These don't work in QBs. The real flag is randomly choosen.

BTW: Have fun!

Gruß

Joachim

[Haohmaru]

Thanks for your reply. I've already gone ahead and chosen a "medium" sized map from the list, but in future I will choose something bigger if I get a force multiplier. I look forward to playing some maps which improve the ai's performance, just as in the discussion in the other thread about ai, I really want to have more of a challenge against it, that's why I'm looking forward to trying this campaign. I spend so much time playing combined arms in qb, it'll be good to have some variety.

Haoh

[Joachim]

Originally posted by Haohmaru:

Thanks for your reply. I've already gone ahead and chosen a "medium" sized map from the list, but in future I will choose something bigger if I get a force multiplier. I look forward to playing some maps which improve the ai's performance, just as in the discussion in the other thread about ai, I really want to have more of a challenge against it, that's why I'm looking forward to trying this campaign. I spend so much time playing combined arms in qb, it'll be good to have some variety.

Haoh

IMHO the easiest way for a better attacking AI are dynamic flags at 2000 points. You have to hold any flag as favourable exchange rates at half the flags held won't win the battle. Or have mobiel reserves. Some of the maps have dynamic lags, other can be adjusted.

Gruß

Joachim

[Haohmaru]

Sorry for the newbie questions but I have another one. I am a bit confused about allocating after battle experience. According to note 5 regarding casualties inflicted by armor:

Note 5: All the Units listed below gain 1 Experience Point for Allied Casualties caused from and including the first number below and an additional Exp. Point from and including the 2nd number: Armored vehicles with armament smaller than or equal to 35mm as well as armored vehicles such as half tracks, armed with MG's only: 3+ / 10+ Casualties Armored vehicles with armament from and including 35mm up to and including 50mm as well as all flak vehicles and flammpanzers: 6+ / 20+ Casualties

So from what I understand of this, a tank may only get experience if a minimum number of casualties greater than 1 is reached. However, the example then contradicts this:

A tank knocks out a pillbox (+1) causing 2 enemy casualties (+1), but then gets knocked out itself (-1) and the crew are 'Rattled' (-1). Luckily they get Overall Exp. Gain of +1. Total Experience Gain for the crew: +1.

I am confused because according to the above note #5, 2 casualties should not be enough to gain +1, (min. 3) so there should only be +1 for the pillbox, not the casualties. Am I correct in assuming this is a typo here or am I interpreting the rules wrong?

Cheers,

Haoh

[Joachim]

Originally posted by Haohmaru:

Sorry for the newbie questions but I have another one. I am a bit confused about allocating after battle experience. According to note 5 regarding casualties inflicted by armor:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Note 5: All the Units listed below gain 1 Experience Point for Allied Casualties caused from and including the first number below and an additional Exp. Point from and including the 2nd number: Armored vehicles with armament smaller than or equal to 35mm as well as armored vehicles such as half tracks, armed with MG's only: 3+ / 10+ Casualties Armored vehicles with armament from and including 35mm up to and including 50mm as well as all flak vehicles and flammpanzers: 6+ / 20+ Casualties

So from what I understand of this, a tank may only get experience if a minimum number of casualties greater than 1 is reached. However, the example then contradicts this:

A tank knocks out a pillbox (+1) causing 2 enemy casualties (+1), but then gets knocked out itself (-1) and the crew are 'Rattled' (-1). Luckily they get Overall Exp. Gain of +1. Total Experience Gain for the crew: +1.

I am confused because according to the above note #5, 2 casualties should not be enough to gain +1, (min. 3) so there should only be +1 for the pillbox, not the casualties. Am I correct in assuming this is a typo here or am I interpreting the rules wrong?

Cheers,

Haoh </font>

[Haohmaru]

Thanks for the reply Scarhead, I've got it now. Just finished my first battle, it was surprisingly difficult when you cannot necessarily choose an optimal force. The soviets had a large armor force and I was forced to spend 1000 points on vehicles. In the end 21 vehicles dead on the soviets side, 25 on mine, for an overall result of draw and loss of favour points for me. My second battle is at night in the fog, argh! But fully supplied and fit crack troops versus green soviets with 50% casualties and 30% ammo, should be good fun.

Haoh.

[Sleeping Giant]

I am having a problem accessing the website that is shown in the thread's first comment. Is anyone else having issues??

[Sardaukar]

That's probably because SuperSulo's site changed to:

http://home.swipnet.se/supersulo/biltong/

Cheers,

M.S.

[ November 10, 2003, 03:43 PM: Message edited by: Sardaukar ]

[Christian Knudsen]

Bump-o-Rama

[88mm]

Hi Scarhead.

Just started a new 41' campaign, the jump off scenatio went fine but i am confused about the 2de battle. It's 3 days later (no immidiate assault), the first battle was a total victory with only 2 men loss of my core. I have a assault mission, so according to the rules (excel-sheet) i recieve 653p for the core, and diced 175inf/support/200 vehicle/250 armor and 95 art for the fight = 1373 points. Since it's a assualt i use the x 1.72 modifier, right ?

That totals about 2300p so i use the 3000p .

Sofar oke? Well, the struggle gets here; do i modify the each number seperatly, so i get 1.72 x 175 inf/sup, 1.72 x 200 vehicle etc.etc.

or do i stick with the max numbers i diced ?

If not, what is it then i should do with the extra points ?

question 2: how do i edit the ammo and exp of the forces, dunno where to find it.

Keep up the good work, it's lookin good !

ps: Noticed this, and following you reply the "official" example is thus wrong or outdated:

A tank knocks out a pillbox (+1) causing 2 enemy casualties (+1) , but then gets knocked out itself (-1) and the crew are 'Rattled' (-1). Luckily they get Overall Exp. Gain of +1. Total Experience Gain for the crew: +1.

since there are only 2 cas, no point is given as you say the minimum=5

Total exp gain= 0 , right?

[ November 18, 2003, 02:07 AM: Message edited by: 88mm ]

[Joachim]

Originally posted by 88mm:

Hi Scarhead.

Just started a new 41' campaign, the jump off scenatio went fine but i am confused about the 2de battle. It's 3 days later (no immidiate assault), the first battle was a total victory with only 2 men loss of my core. I have a assault mission, so according to the rules (excel-sheet) i recieve 653p for the core, and diced 175inf/support/200 vehicle/250 armor and 95 art for the fight = 1373 points. Since it's a assualt i use the x 1.72 modifier, right ?

That totals about 2300p so i use the 3000p .

Sofar oke?

Well, the struggle gets here; do i modify the each number seperatly, so i get 1.72 x 175 inf/sup, 1.72 x 200 vehicle etc.etc.

or do i stick with the max numbers i diced ?

IIRC the modifier should be 1.6 now. You can find out easily by selecting a 1000 pts QB, no casualties, Axis assault. Check the points you have available, divide by 1000. That is the correct modifier. The assault modifier is given as 1.6 in BCR '42. Dunno the exact modifier for CM, don't have access to it right now.

So with a 1.6 modifer you have 1373 points divided by 1.6 = 858 or a 900 points battle.

With a 900 points battle, you are able to buy at least 900*1.6 = 1440 points in CM. BCR allows for only 1373.

(A 1.72 modifer would result in 1373/1.72 = 798 pts = 800 pts battle)

Thus you can spend those points you diced. No need to multiply them.

If not, what is it then i should do with the extra points ?

Extra points are an extra bonus for the AI. It gets really tough if you have 3001 points, have to select a 5000pts battle and the AI has a 100% bonus. In an assault, that's like 5:1 odds.

question 2: how do i edit the ammo and exp of the forces, dunno where to find it.

Ammo is somewhere in the QB menu. IIRC just above the Sewer movement setting

Average experience of the whole force is there, too - albeit only hig, medium and low.

Experience of units is specified in the unit buy menu. IIRC in the middle of the top line.

Experience of individual units that are part of formations works with the scenario editor only.

You can not buy a regular company or plt and change the experience of a single squad in a QB (the generator disturbs the experience a bit for more interesting gameplay)

If you want to change the experience of some of your squads, do the following:

Instead of firing up a QB, first create a scenario:

First Thing: Maps

I suggest using a map from the map pack. Just load the map as you would load a complete scenario. You can also load any other scenario, clear the troops, change the date and use the map. Maybe adjust the setup zones and the flags. Note that snow is a seasonal effect, so a winter map can be used in the summer.

If you want a random map, start the QB deciding which units you get, note the flag points, the size of the map and the size of the setup zones. Create a random map in the scenario editor using that size, then increase defender's setup-zone to about 40% of the map and set the flags to defendable clusters.

I prefer dynamic flags, especially when on defense. The AI attacks a single flag much better than several of them. Having at least 3 of them forces you to spread you troops. Note that you as the attacker can not select which dynamic flag you want to attack in a QB or a scenario turned QB, only in a real scenario! In QBs, the computer does that for you.

Parameters

Set the date and the friendly map edges (should be those edges behind the respective setup zones)

Troops

Now buy your core troops (including attached forces). IIRC click or double click unit in the unit list in the "buy units menu" to edit them:

Set their ammo to zero. The QB ammo setting will take care of your ammo level. Set the experience as noted in your battlegroup sheet. Set leader bonus etc.

Save Scenario and end Editor

Start QB

When asked for the map, select "Custom map" (Dunno if that's the exact button designation. I've got the German version). Then load your scenario as the map. Import the troops when asked by just pressing "Yes".

When the "buy units" menu appears, your unit roster should already include your core. Now only buy the support forces.

Then continue like a standard QB.

Keep up the good work, it's lookin good !

ps: Noticed this, and following you reply the "official" example is thus wrong or outdated:

A tank knocks out a pillbox (+1) causing 2 enemy casualties (+1) , but then gets knocked out itself (-1) and the crew are 'Rattled' (-1). Luckily they get Overall Exp. Gain of +1. Total Experience Gain for the crew: +1.

since there are only 2 cas, no point is given as you say the minimum=5

Total exp gain= 0 , right?

Yes! Have to fix this! :mad:

Though the minimum depends on the gun size. a PzIV or StuG will need 10 cas for the first point.

PS: If you get any attachment points, spend them!

Add the spent points to your core force points. (If you spent 22 attachment points, you will have a core of 675 points. Calculate the force size based on this number. In the example above there would be 1373+22=1395 points)

Gruß

Joachim

[ November 19, 2003, 06:44 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

[88mm]

Thanks for the explenation. Sorry to tell but know i am more confused then before

Thought the 1.72 was a multiplier instead of a divider, and then you come up with a 1.6 divider or is it a multplier too. I know, i am hopeless :eek:

Plz. stay with 1 version, i want to use the excel-sheets. Anyway, if i understand you right the total purchase points is more favorable for the enemy then it is to me. How does it work with the other two divider/multipliers :confused:

Examples, plz. More examples

ps: Tried the other guys campaign, seems more logic to follow the rules so maybe i skip BCR and go along the other campaigne. Not that i don't like BCR, but it's so tough to get "the picture". you loose fun easaly after 6 hours of trying to get things going, reading the rules, re-reading the rules, trying to understand it all and then after all that work done; hope you done it 90% correct.

[Joachim]

Originally posted by 88mm:

Thanks for the explenation. Sorry to tell but know i am more confused then before

Thought the 1.72 was a multiplier instead of a divider, and then you come up with a 1.6 divider or is it a multplier too. I know, i am hopeless :eek:

It is a divider. I just had the files for '42 available where it is changed from 1.72 to 1.6. In '41 it is 1.72, so you can use 1.72.

Edit: It is a divider and a multiplier - depending on which direction you calculate!

Plz. stay with 1 version, i want to use the excel-sheets. Anyway, if i understand you right the total purchase points is more favorable for the enemy then it is to me. How does it work with the other two divider/multipliers :confused:

There are 3 factors - 1.3 for probes, 1.5 for attacks and 1.72 for assaults.

The formula given in Note 10 ensures that you have the smallest available QB setting to fit your force size.

You have a core force and the support units, resulting in a given numbe rof points you want to spend. To acheive this, the formula does

kind of the reverse what CM does.

If you start a 1000 pts attack with 20% initial casualties in a QB, you can spend

(1000 * 1.5) * (1/(1-0.2) = 1875 points

on your force.

Edit: Here it is a multiplier. the bonus for the attacker

CM automatically rolls for 20% losses, so your actual force on the battlefield is worth about

1875 * 0.8 = 1500 points

This is exactly a 1.5:1 advantage for the attacker

In your battle you have 1373 points in an assualt and no casualties. As you get

(1372 / 1.72) / (1/1) = 798 points.

Edit: Here it is a divider - we want to calculate the QB size from the actual points that must be available

Note that with 20% losses you get

(1372 / 1.72) / (1/0.8)

= 798 * 0,8 = 638 points

You select an 800 points battle and are able to spend 1376 points in CM, but BCR only allows for 1373.

BCR tries to get as close to the modifiers inherent in CM as possible, but is always lower than them.

In large battles there is a "problem" with the rounding error - it gets really big. If your force size is 3001, you could select a 3000 points battle, but you could not spend all of your points. So BCR says it is a 5000 points battle. You can spend 3001 points - but in a Meeting engagement, the AI is able to spent all of the 5000 points. Tough luck for you. Whenever there are many points left in the purchase menu after buying all what BCR allowed, you know the AI got an additional bonus.

The AI is good, but it is no match for a player with a brain. When the AI gets more troops, you have to apply better tactics to beat it. That's much more fun than winning every time. If you loose to often, you might consider starting as conscript or green. Depending on player experience, the normal bonus for the AI is lower.

BCR is a campaign where you have to take care for your men. Losses are bad - usually worse than a lost battle. You have to change the way you play. No all out attack, where your last men grab the last flag after killing almost every enemy. You need to plan attacks where you maybe grab just a few flags, but preserve your men's lives. It is very rare for me to achieve a total victory. I often withdraw or stop the attack when I see it gets a slaughter. There is not much sense in pressing every attack. Just imagine what would have happened if the Germans pulled out of Stalingrad in August...

Examples, plz. More examples

ps: Tried the other guys campaign, seems more logic to follow the rules so maybe i skip BCR and go along the other campaigne. Not that i don't like BCR, but it's so tough to get "the picture". you loose fun easaly after 6 hours of trying to get things going, reading the rules, re-reading the rules, trying to understand it all and then after all that work done; hope you done it 90% correct.

90% correct is ok. Sometimes I find that even I forgot to apply a rule. The most important rule is to have fun with those campaigns, not applying every rule. The force size is maybe the most important rule - all others are less important.

Good luck with Rob's campaign!

Gruß

Joachim

[ November 19, 2003, 06:41 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]