Guest konrad Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by YankeeDog: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by lenakonrad: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Hannibal: Ok this may be a dumb question but what language is hungarian relaed to ? In Europe closest to the finnish(?),they a part (and only two of them) of ungro-finish group. I'm not sure if its proper english terminology, perhaps somebody can correct me.) konrad added:so its finnic,and they are not only two </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted February 7, 2003 Author Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by YankeeDog: My understanding is that Basque (as in the language of the ethnic group from the mountains between Spain and France) is also part of this language group, and that the theory is that they are the last living descendants of a family of languages that existed in Europe before the migration of the Indo-European languages onto the continent. No, no. Basque is separate from both Indo-European (this includes such subgroubs as Germanic, Romanic and Slavic) and Finno-Ugric. It is the remainder of a group that was eaten by the Indo-Europeans. The biggest languages in the latest group are Hungarian, Finnish and Estonian, but includes a horde of smaller languages such as Udmurt, Sami and Samoyed that can be found from northern Russia. But I don't know if Udmurt will be included in the patch? :confused: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest konrad Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Sergei: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by YankeeDog: My understanding is that Basque (as in the language of the ethnic group from the mountains between Spain and France) is also part of this language group, and that the theory is that they are the last living descendants of a family of languages that existed in Europe before the migration of the Indo-European languages onto the continent. No, no. Basque is separate from both Indo-European (this includes such subgroubs as Germanic, Romanic and Slavic) and Finno-Ugric. It is the remainder of a group that was eaten by the Indo-Europeans. The biggest languages in the latest group are Hungarian, Finnish and Estonian, but includes a horde of smaller languages such as Udmurt, Sami and Samoyed that can be found from northern Russia. But I don't know if Udmurt will be included in the patch? :confused: </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viceroy Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Lenakonrad, both Yankeedog and Sergei are largely correct! Basque is not related to Hungarian. But Yankeedog is right about many people thinking that Basque is perhaps the original "proto-IndoEuropean language". Basque is one of that small group of languages called "isolates" where nobody has found a connection to any other language. There are lots of unanswered questions about the Basque language. If you're really interested, look at the Encyclopedia of Language by David Crystal, which is in many Libraries and has a large section on Language families and discusses Basque. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soddball Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Viceroy: Lenakonrad, both Yankeedog and Sergei are largely correct! Basque is not related to Hungarian. But Yankeedog is right about many people thinking that Basque is perhaps the original "proto-IndoEuropean language". Basque is one of that small group of languages called "isolates" where nobody has found a connection to any other language. There are lots of unanswered questions about the Basque language. If you're really interested, look at the Encyclopedia of Language by David Crystal, which is in many Libraries and has a large section on Language families and discusses Basque. One of my archaeology books pointed out the similarity in language, material culture and lifestyle of the Basque people to that of the people in Britanny, Cornwall, and Ireland - they're very closely linked and until Roman times offered the Atlantic offered the best trading route from the Mediterranean to Britain. (Facing the Ocean - Barry Cunliffe) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest konrad Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Viceroy: Lenakonrad, both Yankeedog and Sergei are largely correct! Basque is not related to Hungarian. But Yankeedog is right about many people thinking that Basque is perhaps the original "proto-IndoEuropean language". Basque is one of that small group of languages called "isolates" where nobody has found a connection to any other language. There are lots of unanswered questions about the Basque language. If you're really interested, look at the Encyclopedia of Language by David Crystal, which is in many Libraries and has a large section on Language families and discusses Basque. I wasn't asking ,i know they are "largery" correct .just to trigger answer. but thanks for source regards konrad 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txema Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 It is very nice for me to see this discussion here, since the basque language is my mother tongue !!!! I think that Sergei is right: Basque is separate from both Indo-European and Finno-Ugric. In any case, I have heard people speaking Finnish or speaking Hungarian and their languages had nothing to do with the Basque, trust me !!! I am very glad to see that there is people abroad that is interested in our language. Bets regards, Txema 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soddball Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Txema: It is very nice for me to see this discussion here, since the basque language is my mother tongue !!!! I think that Sergei is right: Basque is separate from both Indo-European and Finno-Ugric. In any case, I have heard people speaking Finnish or speaking Hungarian and their languages had nothing to do with the Basque, trust me !!! I am very glad to see that there is people abroad that is interested in our language. Bets regards, Txema Some of the Basque language's closest relatives are Welsh, Cornish and Gaelic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest konrad Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Soddball: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Txema: It is very nice for me to see this discussion here, since the basque language is my mother tongue !!!! I think that Sergei is right: Basque is separate from both Indo-European and Finno-Ugric. In any case, I have heard people speaking Finnish or speaking Hungarian and their languages had nothing to do with the Basque, trust me !!! I am very glad to see that there is people abroad that is interested in our language. Bets regards, Txema Some of the Basque language's closest relatives are Welsh, Cornish and Gaelic. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txema Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Don't listen to him,its that dirty celtic conspiracy... regards konrad Je, je, yes, it could be However I have heard also Gaelic and I couldn't identify anything related to the Basque language... Txema 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest konrad Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Txema: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Don't listen to him,its that dirty celtic conspiracy... regards konrad Je, je, yes, it could be However I have heard also Gaelic and I couldn't identify anything related to the Basque language... Txema </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Radley Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Txema: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Don't listen to him,its that dirty celtic conspiracy... regards konrad Je, je, yes, it could be However I have heard also Gaelic and I couldn't identify anything related to the Basque language... Txema </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soddball Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 I'll try to fish out a couple of my books on the subject. However, don't misunderstand me. I'm not saying that if you speak Gaelic, you'll speak Basque or Cornish. For example, for someone who learns English, learning French, German, Italian and Spanish is comparatively simple. They use similar grammar and sentence structure. However, if that English person tries to learn (for example) Finnish, they will struggle more because Finnish is descended from a language which grew up in central Russia. Basque, Gaelic, Breton, Cornish etc - they are scraps of a language of common origins which was used by those people commonly termed the 'Celts' before the Romans swept them aside. The languages persist in areas incompletely conquered or dominated by the Romans by virtue of their terrain or remoteness. [ February 07, 2003, 08:46 AM: Message edited by: Soddball ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 OK, I've been trying to remember this one for a while, so perhaps you language grogs can help me out! What is the name of the very obscure and "isolate" language in Switzerland? IIRC less than 50,000 people still speak it and it isn't related to the languages around it. Unrelated to the above, I once heard a piece on US Public Radio (NPR or PRI, I forget) that profiled Scottland's attempts to preserve its minority language. Don't know how to spell it, but it sounds like Irish "Gaelic" mispronounced. The report was about all sorts of things that were trying to be done to prevent it from winking out of existance. It doesn't look like that will happen, which is both sad and natural at the same time. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 I pronounce this thread: Officially Hijacked especially considering it's the officials that hijacked it. So, which of these proto non-Hungarianfingaelbasq languages are included in 1.02? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lou2000 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Battlefront.com: OK, I've been trying to remember this one for a while, so perhaps you language grogs can help me out! What is the name of the very obscure and "isolate" language in Switzerland? IIRC less than 50,000 people still speak it and it isn't related to the languages around it. .............. Steve Not sure if this is what you are seeking...... "1% of the people living in the eastern arm of the country speak Raeto-Romanic, an ancient language that contains traces of Latin." Speaking Swiss 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tero Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 Originally posted by Soddball: However, if that English person tries to learn (for example) Finnish, they will struggle more because Finnish is descended from a language which grew up in central Russia. In linquistic terms: Finnish is totally diffrent from the Romanic languages. Nothing to do with the place of origin. For one the vocabulary is totally different. You can not even guestimate what a Finnish word is in English from its appearance. With French, English, Spanish and German you are in the ball park. You can even actually understand Russian based on the Romanic vocabulary. The conjugation is totally different. One full page of Finnish text can fill up three pages when translated into English. And so on.... [ February 07, 2003, 02:27 PM: Message edited by: Tero ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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