SirReal Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Is it common practice to use the area fire command close to a target that is just out of LOS, in order to have the normal hit deviation affect the target? I'm not talking splash damage, I mean actually counting on the fact that "we miss a by a little in all directions" does not take into consideration if the impact point is actually targettable or not. The most obvious use of this is to subvert the use of forests as cover. A forest won't block a shot, just LOS, so a target just out of LOS can still be reached with direct fire. This seems like a contradiction to me. "I can't see it because there's too many trees in the way, but no matter, tree's won't cause premature detonation of my rounds. In this game, anyway." Thoughts on this? /SirReal 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Keep in mind that leaves, light twigs & c. won't necessarily trigger the contact fuse on an HE round. A significant part of a woods' ability to block LOS is from this kind of light vegetation. Therefore, an HE shell can sometimes travel farther into cover than the firing unit can see before detonating. So if Hans the Panzergunner can't see through the thick leaves of yon oak tree, he can still fire an HE shell at the leaves, and quite often the shell will pass through the leaves and detonate farther into the forest when it hits something more substantial (like a tree trunk). Cheers, YD 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hensworth Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 I sometimes do this to try and knock out a gun. Anything else would be a waste of ammo, I reckon. It depends very much on how far the target is out of LOS of course. If it's just past where the line changes color, it's worth giving a go, especially when the target is down along the line of fire from the spot you CAN target (spread from both guns and mortars is mainly linear). What I do use is area fire on a gun which you can actually see and have LOS to. This makes sure that your tank (or whatever it is) keeps firing even when the gun crew takes cover and the target becomes a general marker. Avoids having to re-spot the gun by seeing it fire another round. Can also be used against units which you want to break rapidly, at the risk of wasting a few shells of course. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirReal Posted June 24, 2003 Author Share Posted June 24, 2003 Originally posted by YankeeDog: Keep in mind that leaves, light twigs & c. won't necessarily trigger the contact fuse on an HE round. How common was it for a HE round to ignore impacts against twigs and leaves? I was told by an instructor that the "modern" HE round fired by the Carl Gustav recoilless rifle does trigger on leaves and twigs. I have no idea how sensitive the WW2 HE rounds were, though. /SirReal 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 I think the sensitivity of the fuse varied somewhat depending on the specific shell. I do know that some shells were designed with a VERY sensitive fuse - many makes of Anti-Aircraft shells were designed this way, I suppose because most WWII aircraft had very thin aluminum skins, which didn't offer much impact resistance to set of the shell in the event of a direct hit. Unfortuately, I don't know just how sensitive the fuse was on your average WWII-era HE shell. The AA rounds were clearly unusual becuse they're mentioned as such. I have read numerous AARs and anecdotal accounts of shellfire penetrating quite far soft vegetation before detonating, though, which leads me to believe that most shells were somewhat less sensitive. Where's an Arty grog when you need one?? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakovski Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Once I used this tactic to great effect: 2 150mm IGs were near the back of the map, a ridge in the middle, and some woods a few hundred meters beyond the ridge. As I was shelling near the ridge, it looked like the arc of the shells was just about right to land on the woods, if the ridge weren't there. Well, after I took the ridge, I found the woods full of enemy infantry. I targetted the very, very top of the ridge, just before I lost LOS...and watched with great pleasure as 3 of every 4 HE shells overshot and landed in the woods. Obviously this only works with low velocity shells, and only if there's a ridge in just the right place, but it can work, especially if you've got great big shells to use... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Originally posted by Malakovski: I targetted the very, very top of the ridge, just before I lost LOS...and watched with great pleasure as 3 of every 4 HE shells overshot and landed in the woods. Obviously this only works with low velocity shells, and only if there's a ridge in just the right place, but it can work, especially if you've got great big shells to use... Used this with great success on a night battle. Targetted the very top edge of a light building 60m away (viz 65m) almost completely hidden behind another building. Most 150mm shells landed well behind the target building - until it came down. The few shots till then helped stop a partisan assault and took some 100+ casualties Gruß Joachim 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 It depends on how the HE round is fused as to wether twigs etc. will set it off. To detonate on impact, The round will need one of two fuses; Contact or Impact (Not sure if that's the correct term. Contact will detonate the round as soon as it hits something, so this is the fuse of choice for shaped charge rounds, as they need as much stand off as reasonably possible to give the jet time to form. However, this means that it is vunerable to small items such as twigs or thin plate. Most modern HEAT rounds feature are 'foliage proof'. Impact (or whatever it's called) is set off by deccelaration. It's a weight held off the percussion cap by a spring, which isn't sufficient to stop it shooting forwards under heavy decellaration. As twigs and foliage cannot retard the shell by any great amount, they will not set it off. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie the Toad Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 In a recent BO game the enemy had an AT gun that was putting the hurt on my guys. I had a Schrek team nearby. It could only see the foxhole the gun was dug in to, but not the gun itself. In an act of desparation I targeted the foxhole with area fire, hoping for the best. I got the best! Well, except that the Schrek used up its ammo even when the gun was Kayoed. Ok with the price tag of Area Fire.... Toad 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie the Toad Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Just after my last posting I realized something in my use of 'Kayoed' for knocked out. Another way to state it would be of course K O . The opposite of knocked out, is okay or O K . Since O K doesn't seem to really make sense as a term or phrase, could O K have derived from Knocked Out ? Does anyone know? Or is this like a duh!? where have you been Toad? Its either !! or ?? ... Toad 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt. Ryan Posted June 25, 2003 Share Posted June 25, 2003 Okie Dokie 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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