Hannibal Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 In one on one fight what 2 tanks in CMBB do you think are the most evenly matched ?I find the t-34 85 and the late model PIV are pretty closely matched . [ April 19, 2003, 12:49 AM: Message edited by: Hannibal ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigadier Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 Funny you should mention that hannibal! As I was reading the subject, before selecting your message they were the first tank combo that popped into my head! IS-1 and a late Tiger aren't bad either ,if my memory serves me correctly? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xerxes Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 V ickers vs. BT5 Romanian R2 vs. BT7 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amedeo Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 T-34 vs. captured T-34 Amedeo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 T-26 against a 15-year old armed with a particular rusty musket 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannibal Posted April 19, 2003 Author Share Posted April 19, 2003 t-34 vs t-34 good one.How about captured T-34 vs Sherman ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Tondu Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 Originally posted by Amedeo: T-34 vs. captured T-34 Amedeo I too wanted to know the answer to this question -once. I have done a lot of tests where it was found that the axis had a clear advantage with your T-34 vs. captured T-34. There were over 400 tests (in the open on a flat surface at different ranges) done to determine this. (Better ammo, I think it was decided.) Sorry, that really isn't even at all. With the same vigilence, I tested captured Panther A (early war) against axis Panther A (early war) and I found that them be a nearly even match. IIRC, it was June 1944. The Soviets had only a very, very, very slight advantage with (yes) another 400 tests being done. Good luck. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagdwyrm Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 I think the M4a2 75mm vs cap. t34/76 is a decent matchup as is the M4a2 76mm vs the cap. t34/85 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CombinedArms Posted April 19, 2003 Share Posted April 19, 2003 The fact that we've got to go to captured tanks seems to validate the claim I would instinctively make--that there really aren't a lot of fairly even tank one-on-one matchups in CMBB , at least between normal Allied and Axis AFVs. A few examples, with my personal impressions--mostly validated at various times by others on this board: In the early war environment, KV-1's rule over PzIII's, PzII's, short Stugs, and whatever else the Germans bring to the table. T-34/76's tend to rule, not quite as dominantly but still pretty clearly, over the same Axis mix mentioned above, plus the short PzIV when it begins to appear. T-34/76s, however, basically suck eggs against the long PzIVs (at any kind of range, anyway), plus the Tiger, long Stugs, and Panther. T-34/85s are better than long Stugs--should be, since they're faster, have a turret, and a good gun--but they have trouble one on one vs. the late war German heavies. They need a number advantage (which they correctly get, based on cost) to win those battles. IS-2 has trouble vs. Panthers, Tigers (I think, anyway) and KTs, at least one-on-one. Again, they need a number and positional advantage to succeed. So, among the major tanks, that doesn't leave a lot. I agree that the T-34/85 and PzIV longs should match up pretty evenly---with maybe a slight edge to the Ruskies due to better armor an manueverability, counterbalancing the Russians' heavier but slightly less accuate gun. I'm not sure about the Sherman 75 vs. PzIV long. It was a fairly even match in CMBO--though it got tougher for the Sherman as the range increased and easier as it decreased. I haven't played this pairing a lot in CMBB, but I'm guessing the PzIV would have a measurable edge, based on the better long range gun and optics. All in all, there seem to be few reasonably even matchups in the game, with the T34/85 vs late model PzIV being probably closest, though even there the T34 has a slight edge. The Sherm76-PzIV long matchup might also be pretty close. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted April 21, 2003 Share Posted April 21, 2003 The best one to one (If you want absolutely equality) is to build a scenario using the Axis Romanian tanks vs Allied Romanian tanks, you have several to choose from including the Pz IV. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laxx Posted April 21, 2003 Share Posted April 21, 2003 hi, interesting topic. i played a recent scenario with 14 t-26! against 5 panzer III long nose (regulars vs regulars). the t-26s died horrible deaths to NO detriment to the Pz III (i think they were J models). These were at most 300-400 ranges. This game was supposed to be "balanced" with 600 points each. So i thought I would upp the T-26 to a late model with better armor. They too died easily. Only when I scrapped the T-26s and went with 2 x t-70 and 2 x t-34 did I managed to get decent results. an off-topic question: anyone here like the Pz II Lynx ? It appears only in later part of the war but the 20mm is usually relegated to anti-personnel roles. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted April 21, 2003 Share Posted April 21, 2003 C.A. hits it on the head. The fact that there are no real even Axis v Allied vehicles dictates the need for different tactical and technical approaches for each force. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0tten Posted April 21, 2003 Share Posted April 21, 2003 Ah, how about Captured T-34 vs. captured Stug III I think this is a bit confusing for the tank commanders.... But here is my fav: T-34 85 vs. Tiger I 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted April 21, 2003 Share Posted April 21, 2003 Hi Laxx The Russians can win that scenario but only if they don't try and take the Germans head on-not easy at all but doable. Balanced in the sense of points I believe! Later I learned that balance means "equal chance". There is a sequel to that scenario also which ups the quality of the troops and numbers of tanks. How many T-70 did you give them? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSColonel_131st Posted April 21, 2003 Share Posted April 21, 2003 I thought that the Panther and the T-34 85 are quite even...lots of round front armor, high powered 76mm canon... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demoss Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 The T-34 M43 vs. Pz IV F2 or early G seems pretty fair to me - the Pz IV isn't armored above 50 mm yet, so both sides have good kill chances. I haven't tried the cueball test. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Saunders Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 Originally posted by RSColonel_131st: I thought that the Panther and the T-34 85 are quite even...lots of round front armor, high powered 76mm canon... Optics.....Panther wins. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Rommel Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 "I have done a lot of tests where it was found that the axis had a clear advantage with your T-34 vs. captured T-34. There were over 400 tests (in the open on a flat surface at different ranges) done to determine this. (Better ammo, I think it was decided.) Sorry, that really isn't even at all." I found this on a page on Soviet comparisons of tanks "Many people attempt to explain the superiority of one tank over another by placing them in some kind of 'ideal conditions', that is, those conditions in which these tanks never fought and will never fight. For example, on a level playing field, like knights on a jousting field. If tanks were tested in this manner, then mobility, reliability, and cross-country performance would not be needed! Why bother? Make the armor thicker and the cannon more powerful and success will be ensured! Why do the engineers of all countries test new vehicles in field trials? Why are the reliability of individual components and the tank as a whole subjected to such intense scrutiny? In addition, the overwhelming majority forget that some vehicles were created in general not for combating other tanks but, shall we say, for storming of fortifications, or supporting friendly infantry. " I tend to agree with this quote on testing on flat open terrain.I try to use actual conditions to test vehicles. [ April 21, 2003, 10:37 PM: Message edited by: Erwin Rommel ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laxx Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 Hans, It was 2 x T70 and 2 x T34 vs 14 Pz III. As for tactics, it is easier said than done to get into flank and rear shots, especially on broad maps with shallow depth. I have recently started playing the Russians, and I am mucking around a good tank combination for pre June 1942. Yesterday nite, I played 1941 September Quick Battle, a 650+ points with T-34, multiple T-26s, T-60, BT-7, BT-5 and one KV, all regulars. On the German side, Pz I and IIs, all regulars. All about 7 - 10 on each side. I split 2 force, one hull down frontal, the other to do a wide flank. The short of it is that, I find the Russian tankers not too experienced in 1941, and the saving grace is the kv tank which kill all except 1 Pz. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 I never really notice any instances of 1 vs 1 matches lasting long in CMBB. Slugging matches just don't happen for me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.