IDF Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Why the hell is this not possible? In the scenario editor there is no sand terrain!! There are also no landing craft. What can be done about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceebee Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Just a guess!! maybe it because its called Beyond Overlord not Combat Mission: Operation Overlord! Just a guess though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saru3000 Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 This thread has some of BTS's thoughts on beach landings in CM: http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/Forum1/HTML/000233.html What can be done about this? You'll have to convert an existing tile (i.e.wheat) into sand and use assault boats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Originally posted by IDF: Why the hell is this not possible? In the scenario editor there is no sand terrain!! There are also no landing craft. What can be done about this? You can simulate Omaha pretty well in CM, believe me, I've done it. Use open ground for the sand, at higher altitudes it gets more yellowish. If you really want to maintain the height differences for bluffs and stuff, then just ignore that it's greenish. At the edge of the beach use 'ford' water tiles. Put a battalion of exhausted, pinned green American troops in the water and on the 'beach'. Have mines and TRP's all over the place. Make sure few, if any, American squads are in C&C. Then give the Germans a constant supply of artillery and many HMG's at a comfortably long range. A few pillboxes can be nice as well. To get around the lack of boats, you can have reinforcements arrive periodically in the 'ford' water tiles. Set them at 'weary'. For the look of hit boats, you can strew some assault boats around in the water. The results should be pretty realistic. regards, --Rett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skott Karlsson Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 "Put a battalion of exhausted, pinned green American troops in the water and on the 'beach'. Have mines and TRP's all over the place. Make sure few, if any, American squads are in C&C. Then give the Germans a constant supply of artillery and many HMG's at a comfortably long range. A few pillboxes can be nice as well. To get around the lack of boats, you can have reinforcements arrive periodically in the 'ford' water tiles. Set them at 'weary'." Just a question here... Why would you set the Allied units as "exhausted" and "weary" if they are just hitting the beach? If they are just hitting the beach one would presume they just exited the landing craft. They may be scared to death but "exhausted" and "weary"? wouldnt reflect it properly. They would be reasonably fresh. Now if your using the setting as if they just came running and crawling a 100 yards or so from the beach to a ridge of cliff then that would fit but not if they were starting at water/sand edge. ~Skott~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Ceebee, it may be be subtitled "Beyond Overlord," but the "Ham and Jam" scenario depicts the famous raid on Pegasus Bridge the night before the full invasion. ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diceman Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 I've got an Ohmaha scenerio if you'd like to try it. Just e-mail me, and tell me what you think. Warning: huge map. ------------------ Pair-O-Dice "Once a Diceman, Always a Diceman." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceebee Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Gremlin, Ok point taken but that operation was inland and therefore no need to creat extra tiles and vehicles! I answered that way I did as the first poster sounded quite aggressive! Ceebee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 I know what you mean With enough new tiles, I think certain aspects of the beach invasions could be worked out in CM, but obviously a lot of it can't be: no ships, amphibious tanks, full variety of obstacles, ability to scale cliffs, etc., etc. Oh well Skott, many were weary/exhausted from the days spent waiting on ships that tossed and turned in bad seas before the invasion, and then seasickness from the bobbing of the landing craft themselves during the invasion in bad weather. Then try wading through water with 60+ pounds of gear while dodging incoming fire (not that you realy could), and there you go. Many carried much more and drowned under the weight of it. ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. [This message has been edited by Gremlin (edited 01-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow 1st Hussars Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Originally posted by IDF: Why the hell is this not possible? In the scenario editor there is no sand terrain!! There are also no landing craft. What can be done about this? OMFG, are you people even aware of Canadians in the Second World War? JUNO PEOPLE!! JUNO!! ------------------ No bastard has ever won a war by dying for his country. They won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country. shadow@jagdtiger.de Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 I, on the otherhand, resisted to urge to point out Juno beach. I'm just waiting for Maximus to show up and make some rabid anti-Canadian comment now. 'Those socialists didn't contribute to the war effort at all.' Cheers, Walter R. Strapps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 What's Canada? ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Tom Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Originally posted by Walter: I, on the otherhand, resisted to urge to point out Juno beach. I'm just waiting for Maximus to show up and make some rabid anti-Canadian comment now. 'Those socialists didn't contribute to the war effort at all.' Cheers, Walter R. Strapps I'd have to say that Rob/1/Sherman would probably have said something anti-American well before Maximus would have come by and said anyting. Maximus has had the recent opportunity to express some anti-Canadian propaganda but kept clear of it, while Rob/1/Sherman has decided to remain on the warpath and madly post whenever he can. Whatever his beliefs on Canada may well be doesn't matter, all that matters here is wether or not he respects BTS's rules of the forum. Which he has been. Regarding beach landings, like the external thread states, these battles would be a lot like an overwhelming attacker advancing accross an open field toward their enemy. Once they get to them, they are toast. Casualties were high for both sides, but, only at Omaha was the immediate tactical situation questioned at all by the Allies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Originally posted by Skott Karlsson: "Put a battalion of exhausted, pinned green American troops in the water and on the 'beach'. Have mines and TRP's all over the place. Make sure few, if any, American squads are in C&C. Then give the Germans a constant supply of artillery and many HMG's at a comfortably long range. A few pillboxes can be nice as well. To get around the lack of boats, you can have reinforcements arrive periodically in the 'ford' water tiles. Set them at 'weary'." Just a question here... Why would you set the Allied units as "exhausted" and "weary" if they are just hitting the beach? If they are just hitting the beach one would presume they just exited the landing craft. They may be scared to death but "exhausted" and "weary"? wouldnt reflect it properly. They would be reasonably fresh. Now if your using the setting as if they just came running and crawling a 100 yards or so from the beach to a ridge of cliff then that would fit but not if they were starting at water/sand edge. ~Skott~ I noticed from testing this today that units get pretty tired from moving through 'ford' water tiles. So if you start guys out in the surf they are pretty tired by the time they get on the beach. Many were also seasick and suffering from either constipation or diarrhea depending on the guy. Another neat trick I found is that you can put roadblocks, mines and barbed wire into the 'surf' tiles, by placing them on open ground and then changing to ford tiles in the editor. So you could conceivably have engineers removing minefields (ie obstacles) in the water! Too bad engineers can't blow holes in barbed wire though. regards, --Rett [This message has been edited by CMplayer (edited 01-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierce Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 You know, it bugs me also that there isn't a D-day related scenario. I can see BTS point that it would be brutal, but to a large extent, that was the allies finest hour. If you read the Stephen Ambrose book, on the American beaches (don't know about the others), it was basically a matter of low ranking officers, cut off, deciding to do what needed to be done. That's democracy... In other words, while the scenario would be hellish, so was D-Day. The historical significance provides enjoyment. Doing ALL of Omaha would be hard to do, but instead, I think lots of "tiny" operations would be good. Think of a scenario like this: Scenario Name: FUBAR It's D-Day. The shelling that was supposed to take out the fortifications on the cliffs above was completely fubared. Somehow you made it to the beach. Your platoon didn't. Looking around, you don't recognize a single person or landmark. I guess landing you in the right location was completly fubared as well. You toss your maps into the water. All around you, men are dying as they're slaughtered from the machine gun nest on the hill above. The mission you and your men trained for months to accomplish, that's fubar. You have a new mission. You're going to take out that machine gun nest, or die trying. Probably the latter. But at this point, you have nothing to lose. ................................... Scenario Design Details: The beach is filled with soldiers out of C&C, except for those in range of a single Company HQ unit which has found a small spot of shelter. Most of the soldiers are huddled behind small bits of shelter. The basic strategy is to take the company HQ unit and gather up the resources you need to take out the pill box. Scattered througout the map is 5 platoons worth of soldiers, most of who will end up being scenario fodder. In fact, you can probably only gather up about one platoons worth of people out of a starting 5 platoons. The objective, the machine gun, has enough victory flags to make the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 Originally posted by Pierce: You know, it bugs me also that there isn't a D-day related scenario. I can see BTS point that it would be brutal, but to a large extent, that was the allies finest hour. If you read the Stephen Ambrose book, on the American beaches (don't know about the others), it was basically a matter of low ranking officers, cut off, deciding to do what needed to be done. In other words, you want to play a scenario where none of the orders you give are followed, and the AI does whatever the hell it wants? That is what you are advocating! In all seriousness, Juno Beach had a lot of elements that can't be simulated in CM - besides landing craft, there are the 9 foot walls with barbed wire on top and the use of scaling ladders, plus flail tanks and other funnies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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