dog6880 Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Help my shermans suck. what are they made of tinfoil?!?!?!?! ok three shermans one tiger 500 meters. two round i bounce five shots off the tiger like it was like the Merrimack and i was a wodden ship. in the same amount of time my shermis died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forever Babra Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Whether Sherman or Uberpanzer, it helps to treat every tank like an eggshell armed with a hammer. Use them cautiously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Huang Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Welcome aboard, solider. I su** at the first time using tanks, but, I do better now. Here are what I am recommending : 1. Be patient and choosing the right tanks. 2. Finding out enemy tanks with your recon 3. Get your tanks ready in firing positons 4. Using a sniper or mortar fires to button enemy tanks 5. Move in your tanks from different directions, at least one of them can have a flank shot. ------------------ Staff Sgt. Huang I LOVE my country, but my government suc*s. [This message has been edited by Sergeant Huang (edited 01-09-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark IV Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dog6880: Help my shermans suck. what are they made of tinfoil?!?!?!?! ok three shermans one tiger 500 meters. two round i bounce five shots off the tiger like it was like the Merrimack and i was a wodden ship. in the same amount of time my shermis died.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> First, your Shermans do not need help to suck. 2nd, there is a reason Allied tankers feared Tigers. You found it. Remember that for every one you face on the battlefield, there are probably 2 others just like it, stuck in the mud, broken down, out of gas, or blasted by Allied air. It just wasn't your day. So listen to Babra & Huang (he means to "button", not "unbutton", the Tiger, btw). That's the stuff that gives you that edge. Flank, use your turret speed, and avoid long range engagements. If you gotta engage in the open, spread 'em out and go like hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 I've found the best way to have any tank survive is to keep them moving. Use the hunt and fast move commands in succession and zig zag as much as you can. Use more than one tank to cover one another. Don't let your tanks sit in an exposed position at all. Move, move, move. That's what those tracks are for. Even if you have to remain in the same spot, move the tanks forwards and backwards. Use infantry in advance of the tank if possible to guard against surprises. ------------------ Blessed be the Lord my strength who teaches my hands to war and my fingers to fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Yes, keep your tanks moving is very important for survival. One point to note is, do not move where your infantry have not covered, most German squads, especially after Jan '45, have a fraust or 2, they are very bad for your health. Not to mention hidden PaK and schrek. From my little experiences, any Allied tank under 600m range is potentially dangerous to most German tank, even Tiger. Try to maneuver tanks to take flank shots and target a tank with at least 2 of yours. When the German AFV targets one of your tank, the other can hit it from the side. This way, even 75mm M4A1 can kill tanks from flank and increase the chance of survival. Hetzers are particuarlly nasty for I rarely kill or lose them from Allied AFV. Side note: there are more than once a side shot from a Straut KO'd Tiger I. Griffin. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Huang Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 OOPS, Mark IV is right, a typo. I have to admit the "advices" can not help you a lot , but a little at least. I can e-mail you my currnet games after they are finished if you want. A real game explains a lot !! I am not saying my tactics will definitely can kill some enemy tanks, but with greater chances you can and be alive. ------------------ Staff Sgt. Huang I LOVE my country, but my government suc*s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Huang Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 OOPS, Mark IV is right, a typo. I have to admit the "advice" can not help you a lot , but a little at least. I can e-mail you my current games after they are finished if you want. A real game explains a lot !! I am not saying my tactics will definitely can kill some enemy tanks, but with greater chances you can and be alive. ------------------ Staff Sgt. Huang I LOVE my country, but my government suc*s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapdragon Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Like I said, Shermans die like Red Shirts on Star Trek. Still, 2 M4A1s moving full speed firing their pop guns at a single Tiger can be a bad day for the Tiger because its turret is slow. The trick is never to slug it out with the Tiger. Scoot and shoot -- your stabilization is better, your turret can follow at full speed, and you have a chance at getting an M-Kill or an A-Kill which is all she wrote for the heavy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 As a counter to this for those German players always seeming to have that "Lone Tiger" syndrome use the terrain to the advantage. Have "escort units" like infantry/panzerschrecks posted for ambushes in avenues of approach (like woods beside roads on the flank of your defensively situated tiger on that hill). It's a sure fire garauntee that you will ALWAYS be outnumbered in armor. When first playing CMBO all 80% of panzer losses were due to these good flanking tactics. Plan ahead for these. Spend a little more for that Hetzer/TD. Again that's why I love those Hetzers. They're cheap. It'll have usually one of two effects if your on the defense. A. They divert attention to take on those screening forces. Fine by me, never decided to have them make a final stand so I order them to fall back to different positions and repeat the process. Also, my Tiger is still alive plinking away like shooting Beer cans off the fence. B. They become aggressive and go balls to the wall after your strongpoint (i.e. your Tiger) with their superior numbers for a close range shot. Good target selection is the order of the day. Also, if planned right those Hetzers/TD's from your screening forces can be diverted to start shooting them from behind as they advance to take out your strongpoint. TD's give the important trait of a mobile ATG defense when you need them but that Tiger I/II has the survivability/firepower to be the center of your focal point. On the defense the Tiger's immmobility isn't as much a liability. ------------------ "Uncommon valor was a common virtue"-Adm.Chester Nimitz of the Marines on Iwo Jima Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Lucke Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 You might also take into consideration that early game American AP ammo (75mm & 76mm) is rather brittle --- you'll see a lot more "shot broken up" messages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beer_n_Pretzels Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Play the British and purchase some Fireflys. Fritz isn't so cocky when you're slicing through Tigers and Hetzers at over 500m. Even a King Tiger can be taken out frontally if the Firefly uses Tungsten (Turret Penetration). Use 'Tophat' and 'Lowsky' tactics to engage German Tanks. This has been discussed previously on the forum, so feel free to use the search function. One warning, those Fireflies are still Shermans, and they usually only take one hit (ie. the first and the last...) They also make great bonfires for Fritz to toast his marshmallows after the battle Another bonus is that 17 pounder shells don't seem to break up like Sherman, Cromwell and Churchill ammo (which carry essentially the same gun). If you're really annoyed seeing Tigers all the time then insist on the Panther 75/76 rule, or buy 8" Artillery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 German players don't forget to use that tiger tank to lure the allies into a flank attempt on it, whereby your flank-protecting elements can ambush and surprise them. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polar Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 Simple solutions.... Pre 1945: Artillery, Artillery, Artillery. People can talk all they want about German Armor superiority (when they could field it) but U.S. artillery was the best in the war. Use it... a LOT of it. 1945: Pershings Pershings Pershings!! Great tank. Faster Turret, faster movement, descent gun, good armor. It lacks the direct punch of the Tiger... but head to head these tanks tend to trade a lot of ricochets. I have said this before, and I'll say it again... maybe it is just my style, but Allied forces as a whole are just far more tactically sound. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoePrivate Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 I just played a TCP/IP armour battle(Jan45) last night and with the increased use of Tungsten it is the German tanks that are dying like Red Shirts in a Star Trek episode. I was really amazed. My Sherman76s and Hellcats had anywhere from 3 to 7 tungsten rounds apiece, they were firing it on the first shot and picking off HD Hetzers, JgPzs and Panthers at around 800m from the front. When they ran out they would pop smoke and retreat. In one 'engagement' 3 Panthers and 2 Hetzers were KO'd from the front for the loss of 2 of my Hellcats, all from tungsten. This is a drastic change in play, I normally go light on the armour so hadn't noticed the significance of using tungsten before. Allied tanks suck no more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailz Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Warmaker: As a counter to this for those German players always seeming to have that "Lone Tiger" syndrome... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Which I find somewhat confusing... why the mystique of a lone Tiger fending off the masses? In any event, it may be tougher to win a gunfight with a Sherman, but admit it guys... it is a hell of a lot more satisfying cracking a Krupp Special with your 75, than blasting open Detroit Tin with an 88!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessRobinson Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 I think the problem is that the earlier (pre-45) Allied tanks are more tricky to use effectively. The above posts sum it up well. Unfortunately, I read these posts too late to prevent me from losing lots of armor real quick a couple nights ago. In a June 1944 scenario (to remain unnamed), I had three Sherman IIs and one Sherman Firefly IIC widely spread out, hidden in decent cover across a wheat field and scattered trees. Along come two Panzer IVs in open terrain, along a road at a range of 750 – 800 meters. All four Shermans start firing. All four Shermans miss their targets. The Panzers stop and locate their targets. The Shermans miss their targets again. The Panzers pick off a Sherman II. The Shermans keep missing. The Panzers pick off the Firefly. The Panzers pick off another Sherman II. I put my last Sherman into reverse and hide deeply in the scattered trees. Bad luck? Maybe. But here’s what I did wrong: I engaged the Panzers at too great a range. I wasn’t spread out far enough to get a true flanking shot. I kept the Shermans stationary while firing. A painful lesson learned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henri Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JoePrivate: Allied tanks suck no more!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hellcats have never sucked for killing German tanks (but don't let them get hit...). Henri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt.Tom Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 When I first started playing I would often use my tanks too early, as soon as an enemy tank would open fire on my infantry I would panic and commit my tanks to a frontal attack, a big mistake with Shermans. It pays to wait and get the whole picture, infantry can take a lot of damage and still be usable. So let your infantry distract the Tiger and get around him, it can take some time but it is worth it. Pvt.Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JessRobinson: I kept the Shermans stationary while firing. A painful lesson learned.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> What's the problem with that? True, you're easier to hit when you're stationary, but it's also easier for you to hit. Also, you got off 2 shots before the Panthers did. I doubt you could do that if you were moving. I much prefer firing from a stationary position. If they miss, they miss and I chalk it up to a bad firing solution. If happens repeatedly, chalk it up to a bad random number seed in the AI . ------------------ Jeff Abbott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoePrivate Posted January 9, 2001 Share Posted January 9, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Hellcats have never sucked for killing German tanks (but don't let them get hit...). Henri<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I agree Henri, the Hellcat has always been a great AFV. However, pre-tungsten it would have been suicide to confront a HD Panther from the front with just 76 AP. From my game last night that can be an effective option now... if you have tungsten Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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