Teamski Posted August 30, 2000 Share Posted August 30, 2000 Hey, I've only played the demo far (Yes, it's on order, of course)But I see that on screen shots of the German armored cars, the drivers are incorrectly shown outside of the vehicle. Why were they shown this way when you can't see them anyways on the real thing? It looks as if their legs would be missing because they are too far forward. Ok, it's an anal observation! This might of been fixed already, dunno. I did search the forum AND I do love "The Game" to death.......... (just in case there was ANY doubt)..... -Ski ------------------ "The Lieutenant brought his map out and the old woman pointed to the coastal town of Ravenoville........" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brethon Posted August 30, 2000 Share Posted August 30, 2000 Maybe so that you know your driver is there (because they can get shot). or maybe the driver had his hatch open for a better FOV? just my couple cents. ------------------ The worst part of any conflict is peacekeeping, it is the time when only one side may fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamski Posted August 30, 2000 Author Share Posted August 30, 2000 Yeah, but Jpz IVs only show the commander...... -Ski ------------------ "The Lieutenant brought his map out and the old woman pointed to the coastal town of Ravenoville........" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 It's just a graphical representation. I don't think Jagdpanzer IV's have a hatch for the driver, do they? David ------------------ There's a splinter in your eye, and it reads REACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Måkjager Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 PzJg IV... nope not unless he sticks his head out of the forward brake drum hatch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamski Posted August 31, 2000 Author Share Posted August 31, 2000 Boy is this thread getting buried! I'd still like to know why the armored car drivers are shown way out in front, though...... BTS? Thanks! -Ski ------------------ "The Lieutenant brought his map out and the old woman pointed to the coastal town of Ravenoville........" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 Teamski wrote: > I'd still like to know why the armored car drivers are shown way out in front, though I said. It's just a graphical representation. David ------------------ There's a splinter in your eye, and it reads REACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 David is correct. I do not know why it is like this for some armored cars, but in the end it doesn't affect the game at all. I'll mention it to Charles in any case. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamski Posted August 31, 2000 Author Share Posted August 31, 2000 Thanks for the answer. Now I know..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 Made a point of checking this out last night. If there are any questions about this, load a QB and look at any of the German 234 series ACs. The driver's head sticks out halfway down the glacis! I would rather him not be shown at all (like the JgdPz) than have this. Of course, this got me thinking about possibilites for CM2 (again). Crew casualties are abstracted in CM1 (doesn't matter who is hit, vehicle buttons up and otherwise funtions properly), but could this be changed? If a driver is killed, it would effectively immobilize the vehicle. If the commander is hit, there goes your spotting ability. Naturally, on vehicles like the JgdPz, the driver COULDN'T be hit, since he has no hatch. Just another notch up the realism scale. ------------------ "Belly to belly and everything's better" - Russian proverb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfe Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>If a driver is killed, it would effectively immobilize the vehicle.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Have you never gotten a 'Shocked' vehicle?!? Happens a lot to me when a crew member is killed (maybe I'm just lucky ). Vehicle no longer targets, is unable to receive orders, and often stops its movement. The vehicle isn't permanently immobile, tho because the crew re-arranges itself after a period of time. Also, a buttoned vehicle already has *much* less spotting ability than one that's unbuttoned. - Chris [This message has been edited by Wolfe (edited 08-31-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted August 31, 2000 Share Posted August 31, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Wolfe: Have you never gotten a 'Shocked' vehicle?!? Happens a lot to me when a crew member is killed (maybe I'm just lucky ). Vehicle no longer targets, is unable to receive orders, and often stops its movement. - Chris <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Too many times to count! What I was meandering towards was something like a shock result, only more crewmember specific and permanent. (but not in campaigns!) ------------------ "Belly to belly and everything's better" - Russian proverb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted September 1, 2000 Share Posted September 1, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by IntelWeenie: If a driver is killed, it would effectively immobilize the vehicle.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Why? Most vehicles had second or assistant drivers. Morover, there was a lot of cross-training among AFV crews so that any member could take over for any other (within limits). Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted September 1, 2000 Share Posted September 1, 2000 Maybe IW means that during combat situation it's difficult to remove that ex-driver's corpse from the seat and then step behind the steering-wheel and pedals. AC's weren't very spacious, I feel. Yet I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted September 1, 2000 Share Posted September 1, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael emrys: Why? Most vehicles had second or assistant drivers. Morover, there was a lot of cross-training among AFV crews so that any member could take over for any other (within limits). Michael<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yes, I would agree with that statment. Sergei guessed correctly as to why I suggested the effect be permanent during a battle. One could even argue that if the driver is wounded instead of killed, it would take longer to replace him at the "wheel", since first aid duties would likely fall to the assistant driver. German ACs are a special case, too, since they had 2 driving positions. One in front, one facing the rear. It's starting to seem like the only truly realistic way to do this would be to model each crew member. Not sure if the extra programming/CPU hit would be worth it, though. (Of course, it could open the way for armored C&C by modelling extra attributes for the TC ) ------------------ "Belly to belly and everything's better" - Russian proverb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted September 1, 2000 Share Posted September 1, 2000 There is such a thing as missing the forest for the trees. I would respctfully suggest that we are getting dangerously close to that state here. Merely piling on finer and finer detail does not always add up to greater fidelity, let alone a better game. Not trying to shut down the discussion; just trying to keep some perspective. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OberGrupenStompinFeuhrer! Posted September 1, 2000 Share Posted September 1, 2000 On the surface, IW's suggestion seems to make sense. But it may already be happening. I think AC crews are an abstraction the same as the three man squad is an abstraction of the full number of troops in a squad. I think if I was in an AC and my driver was hit, where my survival depended on getting the vehicle moving again I would make a lot of effort to replace the driver with another crew member. I may not always get it done in time, but that is what the "shocked" state simulates. Similarly if the gunner is hit, this is abstracted as "gun damage" - although this may also represent physical damage and jammed breeches etc. It seems that if the crew or other damage can be made good in some way, the vehicle is "shocked" for a period of time. If the damage becomes too much, then the remnants of the crew abandon the vehicle. OGSF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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