FR HOME mission from Red Thunder (help with tactics)

[patrik pass]

Hello,

i am trying to win the second scenario from Red Thunder with name FR HOME.

I am playing as Russian partisans, clearing the small village from remnants of retreating German army.

Germans are scattered in the village buildings, i am starting in the forest, with few snipers and one squad. Another two squads will come from different directions during first 10 or 15 minutes. I dont have smoke grenades, i dont have arty support.

I tried everything and i am unable to win over defending Germans. I tried come closer with smgs equipped partisans to buildings through slopes - very limited possibilities because of map design, i am unable to come close enough to use grenades, i tried concentrated fire to one building - even destructed it, but i have limited ammo for smgs. I tried attacking from different angles simultaneously.

I am suspecting that i am doing something vital wrong and to learn it in this scenario will benefit me in whole Combat Mission game. I am hoping to get  advice from someone who was able to successfully finish this scenario. Thank you in advance.

(I am no new player to Combat Mission series. I have played old combat missions from beginnings, also Shock Force, Black Sea and Fortress Italy and i am familiar with basic mechanics of the game.)

[chuckdyke]

Your first party is to locate and make contact. Once the reinforcements arrive you use the DPM LMG to suppress. The Snipers must be on overwatch but close enough to be in contact. Once you capture the first building on the bottom right it is game over for the Germans. They just can't match Soviet submachine gunners. Use the last reinforcements to ambush the troops trying to withdraw. Snipers must be in visual contact with the submachine gunners to take out the Germans exposing from the windows.

[Ts4EVER]

This is how I did it:

 

[patrik pass]

Hello chuckdyke,

thank you! Because of my ignorance of weapon types, i missed dpm between members of squad coming from the open field. I was trying to win this scenario for three days

[patrik pass]

Ts4EVER, thank you to you too :)

[chuckdyke]

3 minutes ago, patrik pass said:

i missed dpm

Just remember Dinner Plate Magazine and you never forget this MG. 

[patrik pass]

Ts4EVER,

i was playing that scenario same way as you, trying to find nearest safe spot to the first dacha, blocked from fire from another buildings. But i was unable to supress Germans and without knowing that the third squad is in possesion of lmg i always attacked from frustration too soon.

[patrik pass]

chuckydyke,

"Just remember Dinner Plate Magazine and you never forget this MG.  "

Now i will

[chuckdyke]

I just give you some tips how to use the snipers. I enjoyed this I do 'back chaining' let me explain.

I forgot to mention you highlight your original waypoint and change it also to hunt and drag it towards your point of deployment. I use always quick to start as it is a bright yellow. I crawl the last 8 meters so change hunt to slow. Once the firefight started he broke the German's morale. 

 

Edited August 16, 2021 by chuckdyke

[patrik pass]

Nice. Very PRO tip. i was always checking LOS only from my waypoints perspective.

[dbsapp]

8 minutes ago, chuckdyke said:

I just give you some tips how to use the snipers. I enjoyed this I do 'back chaining' let me explain.

I forgot to mention you highlight your original waypoint and change it also to hunt and drag it towards your point of deployment. I use always quick to start as it is a bright yellow. I crawl the last 8 meters so change hunt to slow. Once the firefight started he broke the German's morale. 

 

Sounds interesting, I'll give it a try next time. 

You mean you measure line of fire FROM the the target to get the best place from where you can hit it, right?

[chuckdyke]

13 minutes ago, dbsapp said:

You mean you measure line of fire FROM the the target to get the best place from where you can hit it, right?

Yep it is common sense, like tracer it works both ways. To make it work you need to watch the C2 the squad of partisans must be in visual with the sniper who is on overwatch. 

Edited August 16, 2021 by chuckdyke

[chuckdyke]

13 minutes ago, patrik pass said:

Nice. Very PRO tip. i was always checking LOS only from my waypoints perspective.

Thank you it is what this forum is for tips and different ideas. Start the game with a map recon and use the xo to mark the spots. But remember each square represents eight by eight meters but does the calculation per square meter. It doesn't guarantee a kill, the odds only get in your favour. 

[patrik pass]

Usage of DPM with new LOS reverse tip worked. So far only minor victory, because they have escaped, but now i have solid ground to step forward.

[chuckdyke]

31 minutes ago, patrik pass said:

but now i have solid ground to step forward.

Testing I used this time BN in regards spotting. I play on Iron as you must spot your own forces too. BN is more suitable than RT for this test.

Unless forces inside a building open fire you won't spot them. After they open fire it takes the squad on the hilltop eleven seconds to spot troops inside the farm. In a previous test my scouting unit must approach the farm inside 25 meters before there is full contact with the units inside the farm.

[patrik pass]

I am also playing on Iron, so my most effective tactics in urban assaults was trying to trick possible enemies in buildings into returning fire. Obvious disadvantage is revealing my own possition too.

[chuckdyke]

44 minutes ago, patrik pass said:

urban assaults

Assault is the conclusion attack is the onset, but we must be careful in our choice of words. Assault in CM is I think when you deal with only or mostly terrain objectives and there are no points for destroying enemy units. It becomes straight out attrition as long as the body count is in your favour you win the game. Whenever you move a unit make sure the unit is covered. The mistake of George W Bush 'mission accomplished.' The enemy decides if our mission was accomplished not us. What is best having units with lots of satchel charges. Make your own doors and windows with them, looks a little rough but are a lot better.  

[Chibot Mk IX]

Here is my solution 

[patrik pass]

Thank you Chibot, i was doing the same, but i was unable to pin Germans down without lmg and i wasnt so lucky as Ts4EVER

[Ultradave]

Also, if I remember right from play testing, there is a 

<SPOILER ALERT>

 

 

German LMG in one of those two closest buildings. That location marked for snipers can be used to snipe away at the LMG from cover and hopefully eliminate that threat. Without getting rid of it anyone approaching those buildings tends to get mowed down. Keep the squads back and see if the snipers can take out the LMG. Everything after that becomes much easier.

You have time. You can wait a bit for a main push until your last squad appears and then you'll be able to take the village under fire from 3 directions. That keeps the Germans quite busy.

Dave

[patrik pass]

Quote

 

Thank you for the tip Ultradave. I did manage major victory for partisans, now trying to hold village from german perspective.

[dbsapp]

Very nice little scenario, as good as everything in Fire and Rubble. 

Tried it yesterday, I got major or tactical victory, but I'm not satisfied with my results (my casualties are too high and one or two Germans remained in one of the houses).

There were 2 issues I struggled with during playthrough.

First, partisans are very low on ammo. In the middle of the heated battle my guns became empty.

Second, and this one isn't confined to this particular scenario, my troops don't fire, though they have LOS, see the enemy and if I order them to fire manually they do, but if I don't they do nothing. To make them fire by themselves I need to bring them really close to the enemy (and they have long range weapons like bolt rifles). 

[chuckdyke]

5 minutes ago, dbsapp said:

if I order them to fire manually they do, but if I don't they do nothing.

When there is full contact the first thing, I do is split especially with US squads. You notice only three or four guys have a full contact the others don't. With a bolt rifle I give manual fire orders (they stop firing when they lose contacts). If I remember correctly the snipers are a veteran and an elite and the key was to make sure they get the contact icon of the others. Later when you get the DPM that is your area weapon which permits the sub machine gunners to approach the dacha. Small arms against hard cover is pretty ineffective. Inside the dacha in a melee, it is a different story preceded by some hand grenades. 

At the time of the German surrender.

[dbsapp]

9 hours ago, chuckdyke said:

When there is full contact the first thing, I do is split especially with US squads. You notice only three or four guys have a full contact the others don't. With a bolt rifle I give manual fire orders (they stop firing when they lose contacts). If I remember correctly the snipers are a veteran and an elite and the key was to make sure they get the contact icon of the others. Later when you get the DPM that is your area weapon which permits the sub machine gunners to approach the dacha. Small arms against hard cover is pretty ineffective. Inside the dacha in a melee, it is a different story preceded by some hand grenades. 

At the time of the German surrender.

On the new playthrough I found what I think is an optimal way to accomplish this mission. 

 

First, I sent all my forces, including snipers, to the opposite  side of the forest and stroke there. The German forces there consist of several men only, so it's much easier to penetrate their defense. 

Second, I occupied the houses, so when Germans started withdrawal they were blocked by my units hidden in the ruins. I was impressed how many German forces actually was there!

Thirdly, I employed the new squad from reinforcements to strike Germans in the back. 

I got Major Victory (some unnecessary casualties were made by mistake because I didn't use reloads).

 Frankly, its very hard - if even possible - to strike Germans in the face in this mission. Snipers are killed faster than they can kill anybody in the buildings. If you run from the bushes directly to the houses its a meatgrinder. 

[chuckdyke]

It comes down to macro management, buildings you need to be the first and the last one to shoot. In the beginning you didn't have enough manpower. Your second plan worked and that is the name of the game. Wait till the enemy makes a mistake. Snipers are funny in Combat Mission. Exploit them as spotters first they need to spot without opening fire. They are single and therefore hard to spot. I was lucky I suppose they made contact without being spotted. The platoon team cleaned up most of the village after his unit took the first house. The strategy was to let the German escape from the village and ambush them at the open field. Different players different ideas. 

Played with my Photo Editing program. 

 

Edited August 19, 2021 by chuckdyke