Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Hello... - One thing that i have missed for a long time when designing scenarios is the ability to let the player COMMIT RESERVES if he needs to. I have come up with an idea that i think works OK (it might not be a new one...). This idea will 'cost' you as the designer 1 AI-group and 2 AI terrainobjectives (if you have some to spare...) - - You will need a reserve location that is shielded from the enemy LOS/LOF - You will need a 'reaction location' that preferably is somewhere that will see no combat. - I am about to finish my work on my first scenario for CMBS - Debaltseve Devils - and will upload this to the repository during the weekend (it should be avaliable early next week i hope). In this scenario i have used this RESERV idea. The reserves in this scenario will not be avaliable right away but will arrive some time into the scenario and will then be ready to be commited by the player. If the player chooses to commit those reserves to the battle he will LOSE POINTS and a TOTAL VICTORY will no longer be possible...A victory will still be very doable but not a TOTAL ONE... If the players advance stalls he will have the OPTION to commit those reserves and instead of a failed mission might be able to achive atleast a minor victory with the primary missiongoals achived... - In this mission my reserves will arrive to the rear of my side of the map and the 'reaction location' is located at the very back of the enemies side... - - - - My reserves when they arrive... - - - I think it will be important to make sure that the AI will not be able to see or target the PLAYER RESERVES. This can obvoiusly be done in a number of ways...In this scenario THIS works. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AttorneyAtWar Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Interesting Rebsol, can't wait to try out the mission. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 In the same way as the RESERV LOCATION needs to be hidden from the AI the REACTION LOCATION also needs to be in a place where no PLAYER troops are likely to 'GO' or be able to 'FIRE AT'... In this scenario i place this location in the far back of the AIs side of the map. This REACTION LOCATION could be 'constructed' in many different ways dependant on the overall scenario details. The IMPORTANT thing is that NO 'player' troops will be able fire at or see the 'inhabitants' of this location and likevise the 'inhabitants shouldn't be able to influence the battle in any way either...And this location should preferably look like it fits into the terran...nothing strange looking... - Inhabitants ? What Inhabitants ?... I'll show you... - The REACTION LOCATION works like this... - It is some hidden location that will not see any combat - It contains 1 AI unit (in this scenario a sniperteam) that is asigned to an AI-group (This is what 'cost' one AI-group). - This location contains 1 AI TERRAIN OBJECTIVE (touch objective)....COST = 1 AI terrain objective. This is my REACTION LOCATION in this scenario... - - It is 2 conected modular buildings without any external windows or doors lowered into the ground with the help of DITCH LOOK...Surrounded by a tall stone wall (no one will see these guys and they will in turn se nobody either...) - - It does not look terribly out of place.... - - ...and will not impact gameplay in any way... - Here is a picture of the REACTION LOCATION in this scenario... The idea is that the sniperteam will move into the next room once the player commits his reserv platoon to battle. The second room contains an AI TERRAIN OBJECTIVE (touch) - OK...how does this work ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 - To be able to tell if the player decides to commit his reseves or not the RESERV LOCATION will be 'surrounded' by an additional AI TERRAIN OBJECTIVE with a TRIGGER ENEMY set... - - - As can be seen...They player will not be able to move these troops anywhere without crossing the yellow squares (setting off the trigger). - The IMPORTANT thing here will be to make sure that the player has no reason at all to move any of his other troops to this location as these will also activate the trigger. An option could be to mention in the briefing that the player should not do that... - Reserves COMMITED !! - 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 - This will result in... - The AI sniper starts to move into the other room to TOUCH the terrainobjective at that location. - - As can be seen here the player looses 1000 points for commiting his reserves... - - NO MORE TOTAL VICTORY AVALIABLE !! (The points in this last picture are not the ones that will be used in the scenario...The picture was taken during a test...) - This might not be a perfect solution for the lack of a RESERVES function but i think it works pretty well... If they designer wants to and have one additional AI-group and two more terrainobjectives to spare he could take this a step further... Allowing the player to request (commit) either some more infantry or perhaps some armour support...giving different penalties to the player dependeant on what choises he makes... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Wenman Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 (edited) Cool idea and good use of triggers Not a new idea though, as in a CMSF scenario I created what I called off map holding areas, which was basically any area at the edge of the map lower than the main map in which units could sit without being seen. Reserves were set up in the area, I think in one scenario I had a couple of Abram's as a reserve and they sat on a hidden occupy objective. The player was told not to move the vehicles unless he wished to use them but that if used it would affect any possible victory score. What he wasn't told was is that he would lose points if the hidden occupy objectives were left empty. BS makes this concept harder as you have UAVs and CAS for both sides which will be able to see the reserves and destroy them even if they are not used. In addition if the defender surrenders then presumably the reaction location points will be lost to the defender. Keep thinking the logic through as I'm sure you can come up with the best option for this scheme though with a little trial and error. P Edited February 20, 2015 by Pete Wenman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Thanks, RaptorX7 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieme(ITA) Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Outstanding idea. You practically took the system of the game, twisted some arms, and made a brand new functionality! Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 I had a feeling something like this had already been tested Your concern about the UAV and CAS makes sence... About the AI loosing the points if it surrenders...I don't Think that will happen (or will it ?) The AI repsons to the player comitting his reserves is pretty instant (1 turn ). And the objective at the REACTION LOCATION is a TOUCH one.... Once TOUCHED the AI will not loose the points (i Think )...Whatever it does next... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Thanks Kieme ! Hopefully this will work atleast in some circumstances (scenarios without AI UAVs and CAS)... I have playtested this first scenario and with this one it works fine 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Wenman Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Good call on the touch objective - I'm not sure, but suspect you are right - a quick test will establish one way or the other. P 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 - a quick test will establish one way or the other. P I will try it out... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Nice I really like the idea. I believe that points awarded for touch objectives are not lost when you surrender. Let us know if you find out different.So, The only issue is this does not work for Head to Head play. However if a touch objective could be given negative points then you could make it work no matter what and on top of that you could give reserves to both sides. With negative points you would no need the AI group that moves to a touch objective and instead just make the area surrounding the reserves a negative point touch objective. I wonder if you can put a negative value in the objective editor... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Nice I really like the idea. I believe that points awarded for touch objectives are not lost when you surrender. Let us know if you find out different. So, The only issue is this does not work for Head to Head play. However if a touch objective could be given negative points then you could make it work no matter what and on top of that you could give reserves to both sides. With negative points you would no need the AI group that moves to a touch objective and instead just make the area surrounding the reserves a negative point touch objective. I wonder if you can put a negative value in the objective editor... Thanks, IanL You idea with NEGATIV POINTS is a very intresting one and like you mentioned it would simplyfy things greatly and also make something like this possible for H2H-play. I will try and see if it works right now...If i does not maybe adding such a feature could be something for BFC to considder...It does not sound like it ought to be a very massive task to implement (hopefully )... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Wenman Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 I've just been testing negative points and they don't work. A negative point value equals a nil value at game end - which is a shame. P 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glubokii Boy Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 to bad... That would have been sweet ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 I think it is a great idea though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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