Question about Infantry in Buildings

[GerryCMBB]

Hello All and thanks for the previous help.

How much abstraction is used with infantry in buildings? If a unit is in a building can they see out all sides or do they have to be positioned near one wall/window? Are there special commands to finesse their placement? (In CMx2 for example there is a face command).

Thanks,

Gerry

[Vanir Ausf B]

It's been a while, but from memory:

In CMx1 there are no action spots such as we have in CMx2, and the abstracted infantry squads exist on a 1 meter x 1 meter point in space, so you can place infantry exactly where you want them in buildings.

Doors and windows are not modeled, so buildings can be seen out of and into at any spot and can be entered and exited anywhere on the ground floor.

[GerryCMBB]

Thanks for your help. One other thought on LOS. You cannot be in the middle of the floor and see out all sides I presume? To see out the north side of the building they have to be near the north facing wall of the building, right?

Gerry

[Vanir Ausf B]

Probably, but I'm not sure. It may depend on the size of the building. I think if it's a small house they can see out of all sides at once, a large building maybe not. It's been 10 years since I really played CMBB.

EDIT: I just booted up CMBB to check and that is pretty much how it works. You can put a squad in the middle of a house and they can see out of it in all directions. Larger buildings are more restricted.

[decimated550]

I think one effect of a Building is a diminished ability to use anti-tank weapons. Heavy Woods seems to have the same effect, as you'd expect from the obstructions of walls and trees.

[Erwin]

Never saw any diminished AT abilities from buildings. Otherwise wot Vanir said.

[hannsg]

I think one effect of a Building is a diminished ability to use anti-tank weapons. Heavy Woods seems to have the same effect, as you'd expect from the obstructions of walls and trees.

What do you mean by anti-tank weapons?

If anti-rifle, rifle grenade or thrown weapons there is no issue AFAIK

The problem is with rockets

Rocket indoor backblast is modeled in the game

The back blast will damage building can cause morale to degrade and can cause building to go on fire. In a damaged building infantry AI MIGHT after being ordered to fire a rocket NOT fire.

I have seen infantry units fire rockets from buildings and then go to PANIC and run purely as a result of the backblast. The smaller the building the bigger the problem as bigger buildings factroys and churches have larger rooms where backblast is less of issue.

[Erwin]

That is very interesting. In my 12(?) years of CM1 I don't recall ever seeing that. And firing rocket AT weapons from buildings is the desired method - unlike CM2 where you cannot.

[Vark]

If you place a squad a tile away from the walls they cannot see more than a short distance out, trouble is neither can they be seen, except at close range. Great way to ambush, especially with a short cover arc and hide command. For that reason I'd fire HE blind, just into buildings, before the assault squad went in, or give a few blasts from a flame thrower.

I found out the hard way what happens if you fire an AT launcher in a small wooden house during the height of summer!

[hannsg]

That is very interesting. In my 12(?) years of CM1 I don't recall ever seeing that. And firing rocket AT weapons from buildings is the desired method - unlike CM2 where you cannot.

RE: infantry AT-rockets indoor back blast damage/fire risk to buildings + morale risk

Its in the user manual somewhere cannot check now PDF as the game is not installed on my new computer

the worst case scenario would be a "conscript" team firing a Panzerschreck(stove pipe) from a wooden small "heavily damaged" house, high probability of the team "panicking" and running after the house blows up and/or catchs fire

An elite team firing a Panzerfaust from an intact factory will have a low order of probability of adverse effects

[Vark]

I normally found they'd suppress themselves, which was ok if they hit their target, not so good if they'd just annoyed a T-34. I'd try to give teams a delayed sneak order before firing.

[hannsg]

I normally found they'd suppress themselves, which was ok if they hit their target, not so good if they'd just annoyed a T-34. I'd try to give teams a delayed sneak order before firing.

Yes that is what I meant to mean

The morale is damaged by back blast and its effects.

Usually in most cases I have seen it happen , it just "shakes" or "pins" team

[hannsg]

From game user manual

"Watch out when you want to fire weapons with

backblast (like bazookas and Panzerfausts) within buildings

- this often suppresses the firing unit and there is a good

risk that the building will catch fire from the backblast"

[Kanonier Reichmann]

If only this sort of common sense approach was used in the CMx2 versions of the game. I'd be happy if they just allowed Panzerschreks to fire within buildings with a resultant potential adverse effect on morale or the structure or both, and exclude actual rocket propelled ordnance. That would at least be a reasonable compromise.

Regards

KR