National Moral

[Endy]

Hi,

I have a some remarks concerning the the national moral. I find the concept very interesting but, maybe, it needs some adjustements.

In my last game, I lost with CP (vs IA ) because the NM of germany fall to 0 in 1918

Ottoman empire has fallen and the peace is signed with Russia.

I have overwhelming forces in the west front et France is about to fall.

If you look to the losses, you can see that the entente losses are terrible compare to mine.

There is no way that in such conditions the Entente strike a major victory :confused:.

With such losses, I think the NM of france should be lower et the nm of germany higher, no ?

[Bill101]

Hi Endy

Can you send me a saved turn of your game please so that I can take a look and get a better idea of how this result has come about?

Please send it to me at bill.runacre@furysoftware.com

Thanks!

Bill

[Ataman]

Low CP NM is a problem also in my pbem game but I'm not sure if it's similar example above. Dec 1916:

GER:34

AUS-HUN:44

OE: 18

Both GER and AUS-HUN have very high losses in terms of troop losses, OE has mediocre losses. Baghdat is not captured yet but OE will surrender any time soon.

I looked back to the manual but does troop loss have impact on NM?

[Bill101]

Hi Ataman

Yes, unit casualties affect National Morale.

The most detailed guide to National Morale is included in the 1914 Call to Arms Strategy Guide. Here is an excerpt (my emphasis):

"Casualties in action suffered by both Majors and their Minors, along with losses due to convoy raiding and bombing raids will also lower a Major’s National Morale. This will be in a one to one ratio between the MPPs lost and the National Morale lost. For example, a Tank Corps that cost 300MPPs to buy will, if destroyed, cost its owner 300 National Morale points. But note that all casualties affect National Morale, whether units are damaged or are destroyed."

I have myself been wondering if Germany's starting National Morale should be higher, but I really do need more feedback before making such a change.

One reason for this is that there are a number of important factors on National Morale, of which unit casualties is the most important, but something like the ability to import food via Holland into Germany, or the British Naval Blockade of Germany, are also big factors.

[Ataman]

Hello Bill,

All written holds true. Norway,Sweden trade under constant raiding by Entente and heavy corps losses for CP. I neglected that part as Germany had both 4th level Production and Industrial technology. Only positive side Holland has 78% relation with CP.

For higher starting NM for Germany I agree. French has 60+ NM and hardly do anything still territory wise. Germany still at this point reinforcing and have good MPP, additionally have to get organized and fight in 2 fronts so a little NM boost at the beginning can be needed.

Related to OE, I imagine Ottomans NM very much influenced by controlling Mesopotamia and Damascus,Tripoli etc. They have 8 NM for now.(Late Jan 1917) But it seems it is very difficult to hold those territories and loss of corps are inevitable in at least Pbem game.

[Endy]

Thank you for your quick answear Bill. I sent you my saved turn.

I think that part of the explanation is that I mismanaged the ottoman empire and also the war at sea...I am still a beginner.

At some point, I also loose the support of Holland, but just for a few turns.

Still, the defeat is hard to swallow and doesn't look very realistic in the end.

[Bill101]

Hi

Thanks for the file Endy, and for the comments Ataman. The things you both mentioned will of course have made a difference.

For the Ottomans, sending a small German or Austro-Hungarian force to help them out can make all the difference.

Looking at your file Endy, there are some further factors: in the graphs for Germany and France I can see that 50,396 MPPs worth of unit casualties have been suffered, whereas France has only lost 30,970.

The Ukraine's political leaning is only at 0% towards the Central Powers. Were there turns when you didn't have four German units near Warsaw? Only the Ukraine provides a National Morale boost to Germany which will be lost if there aren't four German units near Warsaw.

None of the above is to necessarily disagree with the view that Germany could do with a higher starting National Morale total. I'll start a new thread asking for comments on current game balance.

Thanks

Bill

[Wodin]

This is where things like unrestrictive sub warfare should come into play..Germany has to play the card for a big boost in NM even though it will push the States towards war. If the CP player believes he still has enough strength to finish the War off before the Americns get to involved then thats when it could be played.

[xwormwood]

Bill, maybe you could send one or two strategy advises for the CP player once he has reached certain NM levels WITHOUT having used the unrestriced naval warfare?

My idea would be to send one or two historical messages how the german populations is starving and that the General staff debates about what to do to force England to its knees.

Later than a strategy advise that the General Staff has found a solution to boost NM morale (all nations of this conflict learned to hate each other to the death during this conflict) and to cripple Englands ability to fight this war: unrestricted naval warfare (UNW).

In this advice there should be some math examples how about how much the UNW would help with the german NM, and how much income England would lose.

If the CP player still don't use the UNM, a finaly advise and / or decision event should appear, strongly recommending to use this weapon to turn the tide of war.

Maybe in the decision event one or two subs could be offered (if yes, pay a price and use UNM within 7 (7 as example value, you would have to calculate a real number here) turns. If the player don't use the UNM within the 7 turns, he should be penalised. If yes the USA should notice this and should react stronger than usually. After all there was this debate and the great national effort to produce these additional subs).

If no, the player could get 2 or 3 additional hisorical informations about the effects of the UK blockade, the bad food quality and about civil unrest.

[Aryaman]

Hi

The Ukraine's political leaning is only at 0% towards the Central Powers. Were there turns when you didn't have four German units near Warsaw? Only the Ukraine provides a National Morale boost to Germany which will be lost if there aren't four German units near Warsaw.

Bill

Is that detailed in the manual?

[OneRing]

Is that detailed in the manual?

It is in the strategic advice you get in game after the Ukraine is established.

[Endy]

Hi

Thanks for the file Endy, and for the comments Ataman. The things you both mentioned will of course have made a difference.

For the Ottomans, sending a small German or Austro-Hungarian force to help them out can make all the difference.

Looking at your file Endy, there are some further factors: in the graphs for Germany and France I can see that 50,396 MPPs worth of unit casualties have been suffered, whereas France has only lost 30,970.

The Ukraine's political leaning is only at 0% towards the Central Powers. Were there turns when you didn't have four German units near Warsaw? Only the Ukraine provides a National Morale boost to Germany which will be lost if there aren't four German units near Warsaw.

None of the above is to necessarily disagree with the view that Germany could do with a higher starting National Morale total. I'll start a new thread asking for comments on current game balance.

Thanks

Bill

Thank you for your time and advices Bill.

I will also try to make a better use of unrestricted warfare.

I don't have enough experience to give an opinion about game balance. My only concern was that NM concept may lead to a strange situation where you lose with far superior forces and tons of MPPs...

I don't question the importance of something like national moral during the war though. Maybe, It was just that particular game.

I have some PBEM in progress so I will see.

[Strategiclayabout]

Hello everyone ,

- This answer is more for Ataman, especially the red part below but anyone can read it of course. If I made any mistake understanding how it works, you're welcome to jump in .

- Overall, I don't think CP need any NM boost, see why below.

UNIT LOSSES

- Seems UNW/blockades have been very well explained above by Bill and others so I won't add much: ships are your preciouuuuus because unlike land units, you always get full NM bonus for sinking them (and they cost a lot).

- Killing land units with low supply (under 6) is very important since you get their whole MPP cost in NM bonus (destroying a corps at low supply = +225 NM, a detachment +75 NM). So it's good to encircle enemy and cut supply before attacking if you can. However, no bonus for HQs, their cost is big enough as it is.

- Another point to keep in mind is that units of minor countries entering war are at 0 supply on their first/deployment turn, meaning each one you destroy will give you the full NM bonus. (you can see it with Belgium on first turn when Germany declares war on it: those two border detachment will give 75 NM bonus when killed)

NM LOCATIONS

- First thing I notice is that you only own very few enemy NM locations, especially in Russia. Remember that occupying those locations increases your NM while lowering the other side's one.

- That's why advancing in France and/or Russia early is interesting when/where there are "easy" grabs:

FRANCE (103 NM)

1x 25 NM Lille

2x 15 NM Briey Loos

4x 12 NM Sedan Maubeuge Arras Calais

BALTIC STATES (123 NM)

3x 25 NM Kovno Vilna Riga

4x 12 NM Libau Ventspils Jelgava Siaulai

POLAND (194 NM)

2x 30 NM Novo-G Brest-L

2x 25 NM Warsaw Lodz

7x 12 NM Kutno Radom Ivangorod Lublin Syedlets Kovel Bialystok

- If you decide to go heavy against Russia early and maximize Germany NM, at best, you can have up to +600 NM / turn gap in your favor: Germany gains 194+123, Russia loses 194+123 = 634, nearly 3 corps... Ukraine is also a rich prize for later offensives:

UKRAINE-CRIMEA (>200 NM)

7x 25 NM Cities

3x 15 NM Mines

Xx 12 NM Towns XX

- Another thing to consider in Poland is you can decide who (Germany or Austria) will benefit from some NM locations. Can be good to give some to Austria to compensate early losses (usually Tarnopol, Cernowitz, Kolomea, possibly Galician oil fields).

- On the other side, any location Russia can grab will help and delay NM fall. The objectives above don't look like much but it's still quite an easy 12+12+12+15=+51 NM / turn and some MPPs without many losses. And if you add the two galician fortresses (30+30) it jumps to 111 NM / turn + events NM hits.

- That's also why an offensive in Caucasus can be interesting NM wise for OE or Russia at some point since they don't have many enemy NM areas to grab:

CAUCASUS - RUSSIA (109 NM)

1x 25 NM Kars

7x 12 NM Polti Batum Ardahan Oltu Sarikamish Erivan Amamli

CAUCASUS - OE (160 NM)

4x 25 NM Erzerum Trabzon Mus Van (2 Industrial centers)

5x 12 NM Rize Baiburt Erzincan Eleskirt Bitlis

MINOR COUNTRIES AND EVENTS

- Capturing some locations (fortresses,capitals,NM objectives...) triggers NM events where you win NM % points and/or your opponent loses them, for Russia with a 40,000 NM basis, 1% = 400 NM, so losing Warsaw should be around -3% = -1200 NM.

- War entries / exit: usual ones are OE (+CP), Italy (+EN), USA (-CP+EN) entries and Russia exit (-EN). To illustrate: when OE joins CP, Austria gains around +3% NM = +900NM

- Minor countries (Belgium, Serbia...) locations don't yield any NM so any offensive/losses sustained there are only for strategic or MPP gain, not NM.

- You have to think about it for OE in the Palestine-Mesopotamia: you'll lose some MPPs if you retreat but no NM for most locations (you still have some NM objectives/events) unless you take heavy losses to defend them with low supply.

- However, some minors have strings attached to them:

Holland will hit Germany NM and MPPs each turn if leaning towards EN

Romania will hit Austria NM each turn if entering war on EN side

- In your case, Romania already being on Entente's side in 1916 is bad news, meaning Austria will take an NM hit each turn due to the "food import" event, see below, especially the last two parts. Looking at your strategic map, it also looks like it is the result of losing Lemberg/Przemysl and Transylvania = more NM hits / turn and by events, the worst possible combination .

Thanks for reading !

[Bill101]

It is in the strategic advice you get in game after the Ukraine is established.

A copy of it is on page 70 of the 1914 Call to Arms Strategy Guide, entitled "The Importance of Ukrainian Grain Supplies"

[Bill101]

Hello everyone ,

- This answer is more for Ataman, especially the red part below but anyone can read it of course. If I made any mistake understanding how it works, you're welcome to jump in .

- Overall, I don't think CP need any NM boost, see why below.

That's an excellent post, thanks for writing it up!

[Bill101]

Thank you for your time and advices Bill.

I will also try to make a better use of unrestricted warfare.

I don't have enough experience to give an opinion about game balance. My only concern was that NM concept may lead to a strange situation where you lose with far superior forces and tons of MPPs...

I don't question the importance of something like national moral during the war though. Maybe, It was just that particular game.

I have some PBEM in progress so I will see.

Understood, and this makes sense. I'm glad that we've raised the subject as it's good to consider game balance every few months, especially as the Breakthrough Edition of the main 1914 Call to Arms campaign has quite a few changes that weren't in the original version.

I'm always happy to hear thoughts on balance as it's a difficult thing to get right, especially given the different strategies tried by both sides.

[Strategiclayabout]

- Killing land units with low supply (under 6) is very important since you get their whole MPP cost in NM bonus (destroying a corps at low supply = +225 NM, a detachment +75 NM). So it's good to encircle enemy and cut supply before attacking if you can. However, no bonus for HQs, their cost is big enough as it is.

Hi everyone ,

- My bad, seems I made a mistake here (in red). There is a NM bonus for destroying an enemy HQ but it must be below 5 supply (and not below 6 like for other units).

- An HQ with 10 steps will have 5 supply even on a 0 supply tile and give no NM bonus if you destroy it in 1 turn.

- However, if you weaken it, wait a turn for it to go under 5 supply and then destroy it, you'll get the NM bonus.

Was it designed that way ?

[Bill101]

It certainly fits the pattern whereby if a unit is destroyed when its supply level is below its cheap rebuild level, then you get a nice National Morale bonus for destroying it, so it is certainly consistent.

[Strategiclayabout]

Ah thanks Bill,

I still had some doubts but everything's clear now ^^ .