odd behavior or bug? Mortar or ATG Teams crawling off...

[newlife]

So I'm on the road to montebourg campaign and I'm running into some odd behavior on the Turnbull's Stand mission. I set up my ambushes and hit go. A few quiet turns go by and the germans are crossing a nice open field and I decide to call in some direct mortar fire. I select it and one member of the mortar team is off crawling around for no apparent reason and the team wont fire without him. I can't even get the team to respond to a move command.

Oh well, the fighting hadn't really started yet and I just set up the exact same ambushes again not using the new info gained in the previous try.

I set up again and this time 3 members of one of the 57mm ATG teams decide to go crawling off. WHAT is going on here? I setup again in slightly different spots and the ATG team starts the behavior again.

Am I doing something wrong? The teams look okay on setup. Is this a mission bug? Are teams randomly programmed to get curious?

[Michael Emrys]

I don't know what the situation is in the scenario you are playing, but I've seen plenty of examples of inexplicably "fidgety" troopers. Most often, it occurs with a team or squad I've just moved to a new location and they are having trouble sorting themselves out. It can also happen if they have come under fire serious enough to impact on their morale. From your description, it doesn't sound like either condition applies. However, your crews or some members of them may be deciding that sticking around and opening fire might not be healthy. What is the morale of your crews? Their experience? Their motivation?

Michael

[Sabot6]

I've seen this happen a fair amount in CMBN when my mortar team is under some trees and/or does not have a clean, unobstructed LOS to the target (area or unit), particularly when the target is under trees as well. I believe what the graphic is attempting to show is that the team is moving around trying to be able to fire the mortar (at least, that's how it was explained to me a while ago). Of course, I've never had them find a better spot :^) so when I see them moving around like that, I generally cancel the fire mission the next turn and try to find a better LOS....

Perhaps the same thing is happening to your AT unit as well?

[womble]

It also occurs when the team doesn't think it has enough room in the AS it's got. An ATG in a half-tile behind Bocage, for example, if it's pointing the wrong way so the area "behind" the gun is a weeny corner of an AS, will prompt much wriggling, some of it to pastures new.

[Fizou]

I havent experiences this with mortars but several times with ATGs which is quite annoying. When giving a face command some of the ATG crew will crawl away from the gun and will go a long way from it. The gun cant shoot or do anything when these crewmembers are missing. I think Wombles right regarding the AS and specific locations that will cause this while others wont.

I havet seen it yet in CMFI and hope it has been fixed there so it will be gone with the 2.0 upgrade for CMBN.

[nachinus]

The case with ATG is serious indeed. I experienced it in a couple of occasions in ATG positions critical to my defensive tactic.

I hope it doesn't happen in the italian iteration, but I haven't seen any reference to it in the changelog. I haven't played it enough yet so I'm not sure.

[newlife]

Thanks for the help! The mortar team was under a tree. I had turned trees off in a previous scenario with lots of maneuver in an orchard. Normally I just play with trunks only but I was getting annoyed with the constant back and forth to turn a particular tree off.

As for the ATG team they were targeting down their line at a sharp angle to the terrain which may have caused it. I moved them to a place with a more perpendicular shot pattern to the terrain and I haven't seen it again.

For those above wondering, this was with average stat troops not under fire nor had they taken any.

[Baneman]

I had this recently with a 6 man MG42 team. But they were deployed up against a hedge which bent at that point ( about 30 degrees, but perhaps enough to reduce the AS size ). So Womble's theory seems sound.

I think the missing man eventually crawled back, but he did cause the unit to become "Tired" through his shenannigans and it also didn't fire for the couple of turns he was absent.

[Hilts]

I've had it happen a few times with ATG's and once with a German IG. It does seem to occur when the facing is changed. All guns were either behind bocage, walls or in a trench. I have not had it happen with guns in a wood. Whilst the crew man is crawling the gun cannot fire (I think the AI thinks the gun itself is moving). On one occasion the ATG jumped to the position of the detached crew member! If that's not a bug, I don't know what is. I hope it can be fixed.....

[GreenAsJade]

I haven't experienced the ATG one, but the mortar one happens all the time. I find that I can rationalise it as "well, duh, don't fire mortars from inside forests, you might treeburst yourself, and that's what the guys are worried about".

GaJ

[A co]

I think it's fair to conclude that the behavior, or coding, of AT guns in their interaction with terrain is pretty unstable. I see the crews do crazy things all the time. I hope they do something about it in the next iteration of the game.