Tripod MG - Bocage setup issue

[YankeeDog]

As promised, and in response to C3K's request in this thread:

http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=96571&page=8

Here is a documented case of an MG setting up improperly relative to bocage, in game version 1.01.

First, the orders as I issued them to the MG. The MG is ordered to QUICK a few dozen meters laterally along the hedgeline, then FACE normal to the hedgeline, then deploy:

Here's a snapshot of how things looked at the moment the MG first arrived at the endpoint of the movement order:

And here's how things looked at the end of the turn, after all movement, rotation, and setup was complete. In this position, the MG CANNOT fire across the bocage; the gun is not on the berm and is therefore too low to do so. Note also that the gunner is out of position relative to the MG - he's facing 90 degrees to the gun:

Save games available to anyone who would like them; just post or PM me and let me know the best way to send them to you; files are 25-30 MB each. I have the before and after orders files, as well as the movie file.

Analysis: I don't always see this problem. I think this problem may occur when the MG team is moving more or less parallel to the bocage as it reaches the movement endpoint. In this case, it looks like the MG gunner Deploys the tripod and gun BEFORE executing the rotation called for by the FACE command, and this results in the MG being out of position -- the gunner will not move the MG once it's placed on the ground initally.

[dakuth]

Does it matter whether you give the rotate or deploy command first?

[LJFHutch]

Yeah, you have to let them change direction before deploying or that will happen. It would be good if units would be a bit more independent and take responsibility.

[YankeeDog]

So, just for sh*ts and giggles, I re-ran the exact same save game file, but changed the MG's orders to use a second waypoint so that it would approach the bocage line at a 90 degree angle, like this:

... And here's the final position of the MG after running these orders:

In this position, the gunner is in the correct position behind the gun, MG is "on the berm", and the MG CAN fire through the bocage line.

So, in this case at least the problem appears to have been triggered by MG team making its approach to its final position on a line parallel to the bocage -- in this case, even a FACE command pointing through the bocage will not get the MG to set up in a way that it can fire through the hedge. I do think this is a bug as the FACE command is supposed to be a way for the player to tell a unit to deploy for a certain direction of engagement, and in this case, the gunner is failing to deploy in a way that makes sense given the FACE command.

However, as a workaround for now, plotting an additional waypoint so that MG teams always approach bocage at a more-or-less 90 degree angle appears to fix the problem.

It would probably be a good idea to do additional testing for other situations, such as diagonal bocage, which may generate different behavior.

[LukeFF]

I do hope some better animations/positions are being planned for the machine guns, because that looks ridiculous.

[General Melchid]

would not a target arc command also prove a way of getting them facing right way without using 'face' if there are problems with lateral movement,deployment and face commands along a single waypoint?

[Vencini]

Great post. Now i'll be more careful deploying machineguns. Thanks!

[c3k]

This is a great thread. The screenshots are great. I know part of this has been addressed by BF.C (vague, I know, but that's how it is). I'll use my super-beta powers and raise this, as shown.

Kudos to Yankee Dog.

(Keep the savegames: I'll post again if the saves are needed.)

Thanks,

Ken

[chas_in_mlb]

Great!!! Thanks alot for that- this crappy bug has cost me some lives.

So BF gets to send the letters home, right?

[Vanir Ausf B]

I wonder if this problem is related to the deploy set up time bug, i.e. everything deploys instantly.