Ace Pilot

If I had the answer to that, I'd be getting a paycheck from BFC. I'm just speculating, but the possibilities seem to include: 1. WIA disappear, as in CMx1. There is still the issue of not being able to capture them, but we lived with that in CMx1. 2. WIA are depicted and controlled by the player(s). Unlikely, I think because of the 1:1 control issues mentioned above. 3. WIA are depicted and controlled by the AI. The AI controls broken units in CMx1, so it may be able to do a decent job of controlling WIA in CMx2. It still leaves open the question of what happens when WIA are captured. A possible answer is that we will see the AI also control prisoners in CMx2, directing them to the rear or the nearest map edge. 4. Some combination of #2 and #3. The AI would still control WIA, but the player would have some influence by issuing general orders at the start of the battle (move wounded to rear immediately, leave in place, move to a designated rally point, etc). The AI would do its best to fulfill these orders. The same idea could be applied to AI-controlled prisoners (take to rear, hold in place, or even take NO prisoners). Personally, I'm counting on BFC coming up with an even more innovative way of dealing with this issue.

But it can't be that simple, since this solution potentially entails giving orders to a single man (if only one man is wounded in a unit). And I understood Steve to say that a 1:1 level of control would probably not be present in CMx2. Earlier, it was pointed out that depicting wounded should be no harder computationally since all men in the squad are depicted before any casualties are taken. However, before any casualties are taken, there is only a single unit for control purposes (two if we assume the squad can be split into two teams). If CMx2 gives us control over wounded, this could potentially turn a single 10-man squad into 10 wounded units, each awaiting the orders of the player. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that would increase the computational power needed. As I don't think BFC intends to go down this path of 1:1 control, I expect they will come up with another solution.

If wounded are not somehow depicted, does that mean that they cannot be taken prisoner?

5 AARs (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles Jon L JonS JPS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Londoner Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Platehead sandy simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit Steve McClaire SteveS stikkypixie StoneAge Ted The_Enigma Vadr Walpurgis Nacht 4 AARs Bigduke6 3 AARs Cuzn_JG14 Nefarious Sgian Dubh/Red Robin 2 AARs Renaud yacinator 1 AAR Kanonier Reichmann

Here it is - the final official listing of AARs submitted. A summary of the nubmer of AARs each player submitted follows. Action at Wet Triangle (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 Cuzn_JG14 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles Jon L JonS JPS Kanonier Reichmann kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Londoner Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Nefarious Platehead Renaud sandy Sgian Dubh/Red Robin simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit Steve McClaire SteveS stikkypixie StoneAge Ted The_Enigma Vadr Walpurgis Nacht yacinator Push to Maleme (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles Jon L JonS JPS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Londoner Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Platehead sandy simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit Steve McClaire SteveS stikkypixie StoneAge Ted The_Enigma Vadr Walpurgis Nacht St. Ed’s Sanitorium (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Cuzn_JG14 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles Jon L JonS JPS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Londoner Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Nefarious Platehead Renaud sandy simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit Steve McClaire SteveS stikkypixie StoneAge Ted The_Enigma Vadr Walpurgis Nacht Highlanders in Hell (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles Jon L JonS JPS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Londoner Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Platehead sandy Sgian Dubh/Red Robin simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit Steve McClaire SteveS stikkypixie StoneAge Ted The_Enigma Vadr Walpurgis Nacht Moltkes Bridge (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 Cuzn_JG14 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles Jon L JonS JPS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Londoner Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Nefarious Platehead sandy Sgian Dubh/Red Robin simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit Steve McClaire SteveS stikkypixie StoneAge Ted The_Enigma Vadr Walpurgis Nacht yacinator

The prize. We haven’t been very clear on what the prize for best AAR will be because we weren’t sure ourselves until recently. So I’m happy to announce that thanks to the kindness of Richard Rogers, there will be a prize awarded to the best AAR in the first round, and one awarded to the best AAR in the finals round. In each case, the winner will be allowed to choose a 1/35 model tank or 1/16th model infantryman that Richard will build, paint and then ship to the lucky winners. Thanks, Richard!

It's a percentage of the highest player's tourney score, in this case WN. So everyone that turns in 5 good AARs gets the same number of bonus points regardless of their score. So, keep your chin up. You may still pull out a positive score! Edited to add: I just checked your score. Disregard my last. [ June 17, 2005, 08:24 AM: Message edited by: Ace Pilot ]

The use of a sliding scale is a much better idea than the step function I proposed. If such a correction is to be used, I think you’ve hit upon the correct methodology, Treeburst. That is sort of my gut feel, as well. I’m also thinking that this may be “double counting.” The scoring curve of the Nabla system already attenuates those high scores that can result from playing inexperienced opponents. Reducing the score again feels redundant to me. However, that still leaves open the question of whether a modest score against a really good player deserves some sort of upward adjustment, as Treeburst outlined above.

I think taking past tourneys into account would be the most accurate method. However, I don't think it would be desirable because it leaves open the question of how to deal with rookies. My thought was to somehow weight a players score based on the overall performance of their opponent during that round of play. Rank everyone by their total Nabla score and then go back and adjust individual scenario scores based on how the opponent ranked. Perhaps your score would be increased by 10% against opponents that ranked in the top 1/3, and decreased by 10% against opponents that ranked in the bottom 1/3. This would help reduce the impact of high scores gained by playing inexperienced players. It would also enhance the score from good play against skilled opponents. I think this might be an interesting concept to explore, but my gut feel is that Nabla already deals well with this situation through the scoring curve and rewarding consistent play instead of isolated spectacular play.

Isn't this just reflecting the fact that the parameters you have chosen for the scoring curve dampen the effects of outliers (i.e., it dampens more as the score gets farther from the median)? In the case of WN, I think you've shown that his Nabla score is not as relatively high as his opponent's score is low. For example, in Maleme, WN had a Nabla score of 1.2, but his opponent had a Nabla score of -1.99. This was the scenario where WN scored a 90% when the median for his side was 22%. The negative impact WN has on his opponent more than offsets WN's high score, pulling the group average down. Which brings me to a nasty mathematical proposition. Could the Nabla score be enhanced even more by taking into account how well your opponent did? For example, scoring a 50-50 draw against WN should earn you more Nabla points than scoring a 50-50 draw against me. I'm thinking that the overall relative performance of your opponent should influence your individual score.

Some excellent points, GaJ, in your responses to WN and Kingfish.

I think you are back to using Nabla, which is intended to score a player based on how well they did relative to the tournament's median score for that scenario. By tweaking the scoring curve, you can decide how much or how little you want to credit outlier scores. I also think it would be a good idea to implement some sort of wild card qualifier for the finals, e.g., the winner of each section advances, but so do the top "n" scorers, where n is dependent on the size of the tourney.

Suppose the Axis subsection has the following scores: Fred:.....50...50...50 Ralph:...90...10...50 Harry:...10...50...90 Should they tie or is this a good reason to apply Nabla? Edited to add: Obviously, I picked the scores to favor the Nabla scoring system, which could produce a tied result also. But my understanding from reading parts of the scoring manual is that Nabla was designed to favor the player that scored well consistently relative to others, as opposed to a player that happens to get a high score in one scenario that carries him despite so-so scores in other scenarios. [ June 15, 2005, 01:14 PM: Message edited by: Ace Pilot ]

The due date on AARs was 14 June. I posted a list of all the AARs that I had received just prior to the deadline and wanted to give everyone a day or two to point out any mistakes. Plus I still need to clear out my inbox of AAR submissions that have since arrived. In the interest of getting the designers the maximum feedback, I won't look too closely at the time stamp of any AAR emails that I get in the next day or two. I expect that I will be able to post the official final list of AARs received by Friday. GaJ - As for hosting the AARs on a website, I'm in the process of confirming that I have a host lined up. If it doesn't work out, I'll be contacting you, GaJ - thanks for your offer to help.

Jim, I got an AAR from you, but needed some quick changes made to it. I tried emailing you but got an automated response saying my email was blocked. Bottom line - please adhere to the format guidelines for AARs found here (especially #3).

They should be sent to me. All relevant details can be found here.

Bugger. You lot might want to avert your eyes. I think we're about to be treated to a round of 'Genitalia Puppet Show Theater'... </font>

I'm sure everyone will be greatly disappointed that I have to interrupt our own little bard, but I promise to be every bit as entertaining. Here is the current AAR status. I expect it will change as submissions come in under the wire. Also, let me know if you are/are not on this list and should not/should be. I hope it won't take more than a couple of days to iron out any glitches/inaccuracies. Action at Wet Triangle (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 Cuzn_JG14 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles JonS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Nefarious Platehead Renaud sandy Sgian Dubh/Red Robin simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit SteveS stikkypixie Ted Vadr yacinator Push to Maleme (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles JonS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Platehead sandy simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit SteveS stikkypixie Ted The_Enigma Vadr St. Edouards Sanitorium (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Cuzn_JG14 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles JonS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Nefarious Platehead Renaud sandy simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit SteveS stikkypixie Ted The_Enigma Vadr Highlanders in Hell (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles JonS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz sandy Sgian Dubh/Red Robin simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit SteveS stikkypixie Ted The_Enigma Vadr Moltke’s Bridge (FGM) Panzertwat Andrew Kulin Artavash BigDog944 Bigduke6 Cuzn_JG14 dangerousdave dieseltaylor Flenser Frenchy GreenAsJade GreenHornet Gtimthane jbertles JonS kenfedoroff Larry Thorne Lt Bull Malakovski Melnibone Mick_Oz Nefarious sandy Sgian Dubh/Red Robin simovitch Sivodsi Sleekit SteveS stikkypixie Ted The_Enigma Vadr yacinator

Today’s the day, gentlemen! AAR submission deadline is here. Thanks to all of you that have already gotten your AARs submitted. That being said, I’d like to maximize the amount of feedback for the ROW scenario designers, so if anyone could submit AARs – if given a little more time – please let me know immediately. I don’t want to be the reason for holding up the finals round, but there might be a little wiggle room. Please get back to me as quickly as possible. Format for AARs reminder: Use the following file naming convention for your AAR: [Your screen name-opponent's screen name-scenario] Include the following at the start of each AAR: Scenario name: [scenario] [Allied/Axis] Player name: [screen name of AAR author] Opponent name: [Opponent's screen name] Score: [AAR author score - opponent score] Group [X] Email: [AAR author email]

You can find Nabla's 33-page manual that explains the scoring system on this page as well. It should be noted that the scoring of ROW tournaments changed with ROW III (going from the original to a "modified" method - not sure why it changed). I think the original method used a "scoring curve" that helped address some of the issues that have been raised here. The "scoring cuve" is described in the manual in section 2.4 (page 11).

I now have Bigduke6's 4 AARs. Thanks, Kingfish.

I DEMAND that you do NOT make me a beta tester for CMx2.

I DEMAND that you do NOT make me a beta tester for CMx2.

Bigduke6 - I haven't received any of your emails. Try sending them to Kingfish and he can forward them to me.

John - Have you received any of the emails I sent you several days ago? Either way, please email me directly at the address in my profile.