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Now THAT would be awesome! WEGO with multiplayer. Drool. Of course, with a different UI it would be better. (C'mon, it was too easy!) Thanks, Ken

Steve, Thanks for the response. I'm glad to hear that you guys are looking at some sort of change/improvement to the UI. As for my statement of "everyone", I did not mean that literally. What do I know what 5 billion people think? I meant it to mean "everyone who has written in this thread to complain about the current UI". Thanks, Ken

Following is a redacted quote about the current UI from upstream: According to this, "I don't get it" if I'm not using hotkeys. Yet, the game include the mouse and tab interface. What I am saying (and others) is that we play this game and support BF.C DESPITE the interface. We're asking for a better interface option. If hotkeys work for you, good for you. I prefer mouse controls. You ask, then just adapt. Well, I would NEVER buy a flight sim that didn't let me use a control stick. That's a game purchasing decision based on UI. I could make many other examples. The current CMSF control scheme has generated a lot of feedback. How much of that feedback has been positive? I don't think a right-click menu would need every single command. It should cover Move and Combat. Other commands can be accessed by the tabs. Again, how often is "Acquire" used? Yet, it has THE SAME LEVEL OF IMPORTANCE as any move or combat item: Tab, select. With very few exceptions no-one here is threatening to leave, or denigrating the accomplishment which is CMSF. It is a measure of our support for BF.C, and by extension a measure of BF.C's reputation, that we are trying to bring to light alternatives to improve the game. How many alternatives are there? That's a silly question. Steve, you say that everyone has a differing opinion of what to do. That's a specious form of debate. Everyone is UNIFIED in telling you that the UI is driving them away from playing this game. Until a new alternative is shown, everyone will continue to make suggestions. That does not take away from the salient point; the UI could be vastly improved. Thanks, Ken

Oooh, I'll guess: The units are SPOTTED (because Action Spot to Action Spot is clear). The LOS is BLOCKED (because of the wall, presumably high enough to block each unit). Because the LOS is BLOCKED, the LOF is also BLOCKED. Of course, I admit that I'm still fuzzy on when LOS is clear and LOF is not. Now that my guesses are on record, let's sit back and see what the REAL answers are. Regards, Ken

Add me to the this list. In another thread in this forum is a suggestion for tweaking the graphics menu for Nvidia desktop manager. That seems to've worked for some folks. (Assuming you can get CMx1 to load.) It didn't work for me. Vista with no CMx1. Regards, Ken

Steve, Honestly, I seem to have some measure of support. Not that consensus matters here, but doesn't that show that my mouse control request is not a single individual unable to adapt? Perhaps there may be something there... Mouse controls only with minimal mouse movement. (Sure, add a key or two to open menus.) I won't harp on my previous points. I think they still stand. It seems to me that the official position os that hotkeys are the way to go, how about adding a nifty little program to adjust hotkeys? Sure, I could edit whichever file it is. (I really don't know, but I'm sure a search would reveal it.) I liked Il-2's system for adjusting controls. If you're not familiar with it, a long lost of controlled attributes would open with it's corresponding key in the adjacent column. To change the key, you'd select the attribute and then simply hit the new key. When you were done, you'd close it and all your changes would be entered. If you'd chosen the same key for multiple attributes it would be highlighted. Any chance of whipping up something like that? Say, 1.07? Thanks, Ken

Steve, Thanks for the answer. I'm sure its tough seeing the same questions again and again. For what it's worth, your answer makes the total action spot, LOS, LOF world absolutely clear to me. Finally. Thanks. (For Darkmath - no offense intended, but if you're not part of the design team or don't quote them I do not regard details about in-engine issues to be anything other than "feelings" or "I heard that..." or "in my experience". All are liable to misinterpretations. But I do thank you for attempting to answer.) Regards, Ken

Other Means, Thanks. Accessed and copied. Regards, Ken

Yeah, I admit I understand the action spot theory. I have no clue how it really works. Kind of like black holes. The theory is cool, but what happens when you get near one, or start looking at interactions? As long as my guys shoot at guys they see and vice versa, and DON'T shoot at guys they cannot see and vice versa, I'm happy. Thanks, Ken

Melnibone, Perhaps I misinterpreted the tone of your response, but telling me to tattoo the hotkeys to my hand IS telling me "to anything". If it was humor, a smiley would help. Oh, the isolated word in caps? That's for emphasis to help avoid misinterpretations. If you meant your comments in jest, my apologies. Regards, Ken

Ummm, I am curious about an answer to Popllt's question. And please, Steve, let's not get pedantic about how he drew a friggin' square, or the fact that the teams are on the same side. I applaud his ability to modify an ingame picture and congratulate him on taking the time to illustrate his question. How does the game work when two action spots have LOS to each other, but the units INSIDE the action spots do not? Are they spotted? Known? Etc. Thanks, Ken

Steve, If you think my scenario about how I play, my clicking diary, which is upstream several posts, is hyperbole, look at Andro, above. Regards, Ken

Rollstoy and Other Means, THANK YOU! However, I will still rail on in this thread about fixing the GUI. Remapped hotkeys are better than the original, but a better GUI would be, er, better. Regards, Ken

Again, gents, you seem to be missing the forest for the trees: WHY SHOULD ANY USER NEED TO REASSIGN HOTKEYS? Oh, I know: because the original assignments are, um, sub-optimal? Okay, back on track: left-click+shift is a two process function. Left-click and drag (drawing a box) is a single process function. What is THE MOST USED function in the game? Um, picking unit? Okay, LET'S MAKE THAT A SINGLE FUNCTION PROCESS. Left-click drag is one finger, one hand, one motion. (Sounds like a campaign slogan!) Left-click+shift and drag is two fingered, two handed, two motions. Sure, that'll double my caloric burn, but that's not why I boot up CMSF. Again, to hammer this home, right-clicking over a unit should open a window RIGHT THERE filled with orders buttons. That way my mouse pointer only moves a minimum distance, I don't have to select the little tabs (how often do I MOVE or TARGET compared to ACQUIRE or SPLIT? Why are they each given the EXACT same interface priority?), I don't have to wander away from the FOCUS of my attention. Regards, Ken

Melnibone, Thanks. Now, other than MEMORIZING my personal hotkeys, how do I do that? Meaning, how do I know what keys do what? Also, note that the specific letter assigned to the orders buttons are not what I was discussing. I was focusing on MOUSE usage. I know that hotkeys are very important in RTS gameplaying. However, I would think that even BF.C would agree with me that CMSF is NOT meant to be a twitch game dependent upon ping times and hotkey memorization. (Hey, those games have their place: more power to 'em. But not here.) So, Melnibone, you've told me to dig into a file and edit it to configure my hotkeys. That doesn't help. It doesn't help the neophyte, it doesn't help the computer USER who doesn't know how to unzip a file, it doesn't solve the problem of a clunky (at best) GUI. It is a workaround. The BEST interface should not take the FOCUS AWAY from the task you're trying to perform. Right now the GUI is its own FOCUS. If you are so satisfied with your hotkey assignments, any change to the GUI and mousekey usage should not affect you. WARNING: COMMON SENSE SOLUTION TO FOLLOW: Again, left-click-drag to select unit/s. Right click on said unit/s immediately opens a menu window, not with tabs, but with large buttons for the various commands. Obviously, I have no idea what it would take to program this. I don't care: I PLAY games, I don't MAKE games. Regards, Ken (P.S. Melnibone; I will, one day, reassign hotkeys. However, I will need to sit down and think through what would be the best keys to assign to the various orders. That is not the intent of a thread targeted at the game designers. That could be the subject of its own thread.)

Steve, COOL! I see you've mentioned minor-tweaks to the smoke capabilities of Strykers being included in 1.06, in your post, above. Thanks! Regards, Ken (For the humor impaired, HE DID NOT EXACTLY SAY THAT!!)

Steve, I disagree. Reading those reviews lead to the inescapable conclusion that the GUI is subject to valid criticism. How you react to that criticiscm is what will be important. I know CMSF is your baby. It's hard when strangers tell you that your baby is ugly, with webbed feet. Well, maybe that'd explain why it can swim so well? The GUI is clunky. It is a chore to use. It gets in the way of the game. Most functions SHOULD be one click away. Here is how I play the game: Hmmm, select a unit with left-click. Oops. I must've JUST missed him. Left-click again. Got it! Now, move the mouse ALL the way down to the orders tabs. Concentrate, concentrate, get the little "M" tab. Don't miss...Got it! Okay, whew, glad to see big blocks. Hmm, I'll click "move". Okay, back up to my unit...click, click, click, click, crap! That second waypoint is WRONG. Dammit, now I have to delete, delete, delete. Good. Click, click, click. Okay, he's done. Let's get his squad-mate moving up. There they are... Click. Son-of-a-BITCH!!! I placed another friggin' waypoint. Okay, delete. Find open ground, right click. Stare at unit info screen. Did that drop the first unit? No. Okay, right-click AGAIN. Okay, got it dropped. Now, where was that second unit? Oh yeah, up there. Left-click...got it. Okay, now down to the little tabs again.... That's NOT a parody, Steve. That is my experience playing this game. The GUI layout makes it an increase in workload to perform simple operations, like MOVING. My screen is a 24" widescreen. I play at 1920x1200 resolution. That's to give you an idea of the size of the tabs, and the distances to move the mouse. Yeah, woe is me. I'm sure you'll dismiss this as unwarranted whining. The fact remains that there are many separate, independent sources of information, some supporting CMSF, some "not getting it", but all decrying the state of the GUI. Maybe there's something there? A suggestion: Having to repeatedly move the mouse AWAY from the unit I'm using (the FOCUS of my attention) is sub-optimal. Why not enable right-click on a unit to immediately open a MOVE/COMBAT menu? That alone would be huge. Another oft-repeated request is adjustable waypoints. The old left-click-hold and drag to lasso units is, well, tried and true. If I only need one unit, I can STILL drag around it. If I get too many, I can left-click on them and drop them out of the selected units. That is a standard mouse use. Take these suggestions for what they are: suggestions to improve the game from a user's perspective with NO vested emotional interest in what has been done. Regards, Ken (edited for clarity and spelling)

Steve, Okay, so if I understand it, when a guy panics beyond recovery, or "breaks", the game will eliminate that individual. To avoid the processing hit you talk about, the individual disappears. Later, for the results, that individual is counted as "Missing". Is this correct? Do individuals which run off-map also count as "Missing"? Wouldn't it be technically more accurate, since they seem to evaporate, to call them "Sublimated"? Thanks, Ken

Ah, yes. Obviously, they are "missing". But, this game harps on 1:1 representation. So, how are the missing men represented in game? I mean, HOW did they escape to go missing? The 3 houses were surrounded. There were NO out of LOS locations. They were IN the houses. Then, magically, at the conclusion of the game, they are "Missing". Not "Captured", "Killed", "Wounded", "Turncoats", or any other "x": "Missing". If I were the Syrian CO, sure, I lost 'em all. Some dead, some wounded, some missing. But, as the U.S. CO, I control the ground. I mean, literally. I control it. My men could link arms around the houses, yet some of those slippery Syrians (copyright), have slunk away somehow. So, I know what this means, but it is a fudge, a kludge, it makes it a drudge. In short, with 1:1 representation, the accounting system is wrong. Regards, Ken

I've played several test scenarios pitting very low quality Syrians at night, in houses, against U.S. infantry. At the end of these test scenarios the results screen shows several categories. Focusing on the Syrian casualties, we have one called "Missing". What does "Missing" mean? The U.S. infantry searched the Syrian setup houses. The terrain is quite limited. The only Syrians found were KIA. The number of KIA was less than the original forces. I surmise "Missing" means some of them ran off the map? Is this so? If not, what does "Missing" mean? What is the mechanism to determine "Missing"? If they went off the map, why didn't I see them? Is this an after-game internal calculation? (The scenarios end too soon. The timer hasn't run out. I ASSUME the remaining unwounded/un-KIA Syrians get rolled into "Missing" if this is what happens.) BF.C: FIND MY MISSING MEN!!! Regards, Ken

1. Adjustable waypoints 2. Tool tips 3. Right-click that REALLY drops the selected unit 4. Single left-click and hold to draw a box (frequently used). 5. Order of Battle 6. A setup phase WHICH IS A SETUP PHASE NOT THE FIRST TURN!!!! (See my previous thread on this.) 7. The ability to set how long the battle will be. 8. QB's with direct force selection 9. Finally, the ability to create your own menu of commands, organized as you'd like. Right-click on a unit and get the whole drop-down menu. Better yet, have a quickpick list of the most commonly used orders right there on the first right-click, so I don't have to make a second or third or fourth action to perform the most common actions. (Allow ME to set the orders I deem to be quickpicks.) Regards, Ken

What was MORE interesting was the point of impact. The gunner had absolutely perfect conditions. He was close, braced, no wind, aimed, etc., etc., and still just barely hit the panel. It looked to be approximately 18"x30", give or take. And he almost didn't hit it. Now, how do the CMSF Syrians, under fire, nail a hard moving target at 100's of meters with those things? Regards, Ken

Steve, I would hesitate to place anyone into your player categories and say, "He is THAT kind of player." I enjoy EACH of those styles. They have their own place and time. Regards, Ken

Hey, is this up for 1.07? Thanks, Ken

Hah! That reminds me of my childhood "GI:Joe Mobile Command Post". Man, was that cool. It even came with its own recon UAV. WAY ahead of its time. Regards, Ken