Tero

Originally posted by Prinz Eugen: Hmm, good question. January 1943 ? I don't think we did. I recall the first were purchased sometime before the summer -44, pergaps around the spring of -43 ? Can't remember exactly. Actually they were shipped in late summer (around August) in 1943. BTW: if you look at the Stug carefully there is no MG gun shield and the fighting compartment roof looks suspiciously like the one on the Ausf F8 (which we never had) if it weren't for the the commanders cupola. BTS please fix or do somefink ! Indeed !!! BTW: is this a real life boo-boo or just a "feature" related to the rarity being on or off ? [ September 20, 2002, 04:58 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

I'm not talking about fair. Especially when you seem to be gloating left and right with your copy of the game.

Oh my ! Oh my ! SWEET ! There seems to be work for the modders with the winter camouflage...</font>

This concerns the release (date) of the non-German language version product in Europe. Is CDV quilty of rasicm when it seems to be giving preferential treatment to German language clientel without divulging pertinent data on the release of other versions ? [ September 19, 2002, 01:20 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

The down side is they still can't bloody well take a proper hulldown position. :mad:

Originally posted by Sergei: I'm sure it can be quite a challenge for the Axis minors when you don't have anything else than toothpicks to take on that ISU. Well, play in forest terrain! And know thine enemy. The ISU comes with, what, 1 shot every two-three minutes. Long enough for you to insert that toothpick practically anywhere or spook the crew into fleeing the battlefield. BTW, I hope they modelled the reload time so that reloading of that big arsed 152mm gun will be affected by movement.

Originally posted by Andreas: I agree to some point, and I think that the 4x6km operations map is seriously pushing the boat out in terms of conceptual scope of the game. Most OBA would be in it, cavalry would move on horse over large areas of the map, and supply stations etc. might have to be simulated. And that was the end of the line with the SPIII for me too. Having said that - I also think that there will be few instances where people will be able to produce a historically reasonably accurate rendition of this kind of stuff in the first instance, so what will be broken in most cases will be the scenario, and that is not because there are no horses on the map. Concur. CMBB, as CMBO is in my opinion still best at portraying actions below battalion level. It does handle bigger stuff, but it is not as good at it, and while it can do it, it was not designed to do it. So why was the map made this big then ? On a 4x6km map, you would have a Soviet rifle corps attacking in 1944 in the breakthrough sector. With a tank army fed in through the breakthrough. CMBB is not really capable of doing justice to that either. And where would the fun in playing a game like that anyway ? It would start with a godawfull, map wide barrage which routs and maims most of the defending units during the first few turns and what would follow would amount to a Soviet victory parade on the field. So wheeling out the extreme range of what is 'technically' possible in CMBB as an argument to include stuff that is fairly irrelevant in the areas that CMBB is 'designed' to do well, is not much of an argument in my opinion. I would tend to agree. Only, if such a map was ever used to produce an operation then it would have to be a managed by a game master who would see the whole map and who would manage the resources. The players would only see a portion of the map at a time. Quite apart from the fact that there are currently not many computers around that will handle this kind of map.

Originally posted by Andreas: you just have to be careful that the discussion does not end like the charge of the light brigade. Or somefink... AFAIK the charge failed. Caution must indeed be excersised. If the discussion does NOT end like the charge of the light brigade then it would be a success and hey presto, the horsies are in CMBB.

Originally posted by Andreas: You really should do a search - alternatively, have a think about how much horses mattered on the tactical level of CM. Since it has been a while that I needed to worry about what my cyber soldiers eat, I fail to get all excited about the absence of salami made from Fury. There is one feature which was not discussed prior to the release of the demo and some further details. And that is the operation map. That 6 kilometers falls within the deployment range from the frontline of majority of the OBA If max range is 10km then the ideal range from the front line is 4-7km. Depending on the arty piece (gun, cannon or howitzer or what have you), terrain and doctrine of course. This means that most OBA intended to be used in an operation would be in fact deployed within the confines of the operation map. At least most of the horse drawn überFinnish arty would IRL sit on the full sized operation map.

Speaking of Russian spoken in the game: is there going to be a sound mod for the Russians in the Finnish front ? I'd rather my Russian opponents would not use the default German "Kameraden, nicht schiessen" (or however the phrase is rendered in the game) when they surrender to the Finnish troops.

Naaaahh...it would have to be a toothpick for it to properly represent a Finn tank hunter. </font>

Originally posted by Chad Harrison: But there are doodads for horses now, and they will be at the back of the battlefield eating while the battle rages. Chad Check out also the operations map size. The horsies are well within the limit and scope of the map at least.

Originally posted by rune: tero I did, and too bad. An eyesore nonetheless. It is the way the military uses dates, 450103 for example. The military being the US military ? Or the Swedes ? At least the Finnish military uses (or used the last time I was in refresher training in the spring) the DDMMYY (or ddmmYYYY) convention. During WWII they used the same convention. Dashes were put in to help non-military types. The non-military types being US/UK/Canuck non-military types ? In continental Europe most non-military types are either females or conscientious objectors. Others go to the national service. It is also a fast way to get the yet of the scenario. That is a matter of taste. DDMMYY is as fast. [ September 11, 2002, 09:47 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

Originally posted by Bastables: Slapdragon has pointed out before that when T34-85s met Sherman HVSS 7,62cm in Korea the T34-85 came off second best. IIRC the NKA T-34/85's had a crew of 3 men in most (all ?) encounters.

Originally posted by Andreas: You can always make your own, you know. With those mad Finnish language sources that nobody can read... The hard part will be the reconsiliation of the facts to the CMBB world. What is being referred to as heavy casualties in the regimental histories for the Finns mean sometimes 5 to 30 KIA in a typical CMBB scenario scale and length battle. The map sizing being what they will be there will be some far out maps with innumeranble lakes, ponds and streams in them. Mind you, there are some pretty interesting scen opportunities for the winter of 1941-42. I also wonder how the failed 1st Partisan brigade raid into the Finnish rear in the summer of 1942 would translate to CMBB.

OK, who was to clown who dreamt up the use of that stupid YY-MM-DD date convention ? BTS/BFC fix or do what ever it is you do to correct this eyesore. [ September 11, 2002, 06:54 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

Originally posted by KwazyDog: The last one is a T-26A (artillery) guys. I always thought the T-26A was the twin MG turret type. Basically the T-26 with a T-28 turret and 75mm gun. I always thought the T-28 had a 76,2mm main gun. Quite rare, but pretty neat... And I am sure it will find it's way to the "most gamey vehicles in CMBB" list in no time.

Originally posted by Munter: Sergei, Tero and Kuma: do the last TWO bones show Finnish tanks? The one on the left looks like the ill-fated "Rynnäkkötykki" with a British gun. I think that is a Soviet tank. The BT-42 was built on a BT chassis, this one is definitely a T-26. I think this is a command version of the T-26 with a 76,2mm gun. I just did not know it came with what looks like a T-28 turret (the round MG mount beside the main gun). Or that it was still around when the T-70 was introduced into service.

Originally posted by KwazyDog: Last time I checked Tero, it started well and truely 'over half a century ago', at least according to our calender. Yes. But if he first stormed across Europe and THEN turned East that would mean Hitler attacked West before Poland and USSR. Unless of course the Soviet and the US timeframe is observed and the start of the war is timed at 1941 and not 1939. Actually I did try to fit a 30 page history lesson in there with maps, time lines, pictures and an easy to use interface, but couldnt quite make it fit under the 25k limit. Did you try using a smaller font ? The banner is 2 pics and 6 flash pages after all. It still looks cool though. [ September 09, 2002, 06:58 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

Originally posted by KwazyDog: Glad you like it guys Looks cool. But..... when did WWII start ? Over half a century ago Hitler stormed across Europe...... and then he turned East. I seem to have the notion from school that is not quite how it happened. Over two years ago BTS/BFC stormed across the Western Front in the tactical/strategic games scene...... and then they turned East. sounds better. [ September 09, 2002, 03:23 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

Originally posted by lewallen: You can use the Pause function on the spotter when setting up the strike in the first turn to delay it as many minutes (I think) as the scenario is long. The trick then is to time it so you're ready for it when it lands... What if you have very little ammunition and you want to conserve it or you simply need it eleswhere ? You can not call off the strike if you set it up during the first turn. I just wonder if people would find it useful to have an option between a zero delay "preplanned" and a regular with the appropriate delays. Even during the first turn.

How hard would it be to implement an option for the first round barrage ? Now the player (apparently) has no option to select between a preordered barrage with zero delay and regular barrage with the delay in place.

The effects of the Soviet ATR's should not be forgotten. The concrete and the logs may be of little use against tank guns but they sure as hell will deflect the 14,5mm ATR rounds. Check out http://www.geocities.com/~fi1877/sturmi.html and the modifications list. I do not recall if the Germans for example added extra armour plates bolted to the sides of the lower hull. The Germans did use Schürzens. Since the Finns did away with the German plate system I can't think of any other reason for them being put there but to combat the ATR's. [ September 05, 2002, 05:09 PM: Message edited by: tero ]

Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: Actually I thought maybe a different photo was up that tero was responding to. His reference to two virtually identical uniforms as being one Army and one Waffen SS Panzergrenadiere baffled me.... I was refering to the different Death Head emblems in their (the armoured dudes) collar patch, not the Waffenfarbe in the collar piping. [ September 05, 2002, 01:52 AM: Message edited by: tero ]

Noticed a minor booboo: the tank UNT and the tank LTHQ seem to belong to Heer and Waffen SS/PanzerGrenadier respectively... BTW: VERY nice !!! [ September 04, 2002, 06:07 AM: Message edited by: tero ]