Pirate

Yes Yes, Mr Bloody Gut. I read all that in the manifesto. That is not what I am talking about. Ask Major H about direct sales of Tac Ops. They may make you a living (or not) but being any kind of earth shaking game that makes the world take notice, no way. This game won't be worth the net space it takes up in 5 years. It is a good game now, but pirates and other, better games will kill it in two years. Oh, and you don't have to buy shelf space in the industry. That is an outright lie. The only space you have to buy are endcaps. Those are those nifty racks at the end of store shelves. You need to know the industry to make fun of it or you just look silly. I do agree that marketing nerds ruin more good games than they produce.

That's better, now we got it going again. I do praise Charles for his effort. But I wonder about his true motive. Is it because he could not find a publisher, or because he truely believes that the industry should move this way. This game started out with Avalon Hill. I know Charles, as well as most other people working with AH, got kind of burned there. I also know how hard it is to get any kind of good terms for low selling (by marketing nerd projections)games from publishers. Heck it is very hard to get a publisher to even look at a wargame. I remember when Ardennes Offensive was traveling the world looking for a publisher, no one would pick it up, but finally SSI did. It is a great game, you can get it for free now, but nobody wanted it. Is it that Charles does not want the middle men, or is it that the middle men don't want Combat Mission?

Wow, did I kill this thread? I was looking forward to the debate.

darn games, you would think people would make games a monkey could play

von Lucke, I have read it, I know more than I am saying.

A factory worker. All those guys gone off to war. All those women doing war work. Just me and the chicks getting hot and steamy in the showers after work. That is what I would want to be, a factory worker in the good old USA.

Some numbers, Sid Meier's Anteitam sold around 8000 copies. That was with lots of dollars in adds and such. If this is any indication of what BTS can expect with like amounts of dollars spent on adds then I'm afraid there will be no CM world take over. I hear that Anteitam will be on the shelves soon. I wonder if BTS is looking for a publisher. Big cheers for making the game on a Mac and porting it to PC.

42, make computer games for a living, love realtime, CM is OK.

Must be a plot by Atomic Games.

Uhhhh, the game plays a movie for you every turn. I'm sure all they did was capture those movies and paste them together.

I know that Ron Gretz was way behind the Real Red final version. I don't know about Mick. Eric didn't work for Avalon Hill. He just drove Kibler crazy with a word.

Wow, Eric Young is going to Break Away Games! I wonder what Charlie Kibler thinks of that. He left Avalon Hill because he would not work with Eric. CC4 is not encrypted. The files were opened within 24 hours after the demo release. It was moded the next day. Both Ron and Mick are looking at mods and the game very hard. Are they not part of the Real Red crew? KZ is a dork, but he means well. Eric is just another shmo looking for work.

Wow, CC2 and the V4V and W@W games all rate. I am impressed. Those were the best games ever. My fav is America Invades. High Command was done by Colorado Computing, not Atomic. It was a way cool game too.

Kind of a cross between Close Combat and Beyond Squad Leader. I like it.

Wow, what a thread. PC gaming is anything but dead. It is yet to be proven if anyone can make a real living selling games on the internet. I hope it works for two reasons. First, there are so many good games out there that never get published. Publisher marketing types kill more good games and push bad games out the door before they are doneat an allarming rate. (Yes, I am in the game biz, I know this to be fact as all of you do) The worst part is that so many good games never get published. Second is that if companies like BTS and Firaxis succed in internet marketing more companies will start the practic, and more of the small audiance games like CM will be available to the internet public. I do know, as MajorH can tell you is that the only other company that tried this kind of approach that I know of was Arsenal Publishing. They were ahead of their time in the self marketed game idea. They died a horrible death. Why? Because the internet was still very young then. It has grow, the market has grown for this kind of marketing, and I hope that BTS can be one of the first small companies to lead the way to better games and more games in general. Thanks for reading my post.

Hmmm, I wonder if Hasbro will get PO'ed about them stomping on their trade mark.

My 2 cents worth.... I know for a fact that the Hetzer can't neutral turn. It does have a very tight turning radius. About 1 meter. At least the hetzer I have ridden in could not do this.

I have an SS outfit for sale. A mauser too.

He did some Star Trek game called Rebellion or something like that. It was published by Paramount. I have met him many times. Last I heard he sells car stereos now. I like roasting him and Zabalaoui in Close Combat. [This message has been edited by Pirate (edited 02-29-2000).] [This message has been edited by Pirate (edited 02-29-2000).]

The story is even more fun when you know who Mogica is in real life.

I don't get the AoK thing. It ain't no wargame.

There were few survivers in rifle companies in World War II. Only 10% of the men who landed with British divisions at D-Day were still with their units at the end of the war. But it is true, most games are way to bloody.

My Uncle Bud said that he kicked his out because he was tired of gettin wacked in the head by that dad blamed gun swingin around and up and down in the turret.

I don't think there is any such thing as competition in the wargame market. I quote the imortal words of Jack Dott, "If you put the game on the shelf people will buy it" Games sell because of distribution, not wether they are better than other games.

well, this is not true, in computer gaming. It may be true for CM. Smoke, explosions, and other effects work on other machines and other programms. Don't try and tell me different. They work in none 3d as sprites painted on 2D objects in the 3D world and they look cool. What CM needs is a real time engine, and some good effects, and some cool flash bang. You can say what you want about the numbers that are pushing this game, but it just does not show. Steve and Cherles have done a great job in meshing real 3D and turned based gaming. It just does not turn me on. I'm sorry, but the demo does not do it for me. Have a nice day.