Bullethead

Well, folks are working on the timing aspects so I decided I'd do the pattern aspects in 1.05. I have 8 bullseyes on my range. This enables me to test all combinations of the following variables: gun/mortar/rocket type, LOS, TRP, and wide vs. regular spreads. Each test consisted of setting up 8 FOs, 1 per target, and giving them each 100 rounds (200 for mortars because they seem a bit wilder). Then I'd change FO type and/or nationality and do it again. All FOs used were regulars. Here are the averaged results: GUNS Regular Spread LOS & TRP: 100x50m, oriented E-W Blind & TRP: ditto LOS only: 140x60m, oriented E-W Blind only: 200x100m, oriented E-W Wide Spread LOS & TRP: 250m diameter circle Blind & TRP: ditto LOS only: ditto Blind only: 400-450m diameter circle MORTARS Regular Spread LOS & TRP: 150x60m, oriented E-W Blind & TRP: ditto LOS only: ditto Blind only: 250x100m, oriented E-W Wide Spread LOS & TRP: 300-350m diameter circle Blind & TRP: ditto LOS only: ditto Blind only: 400-450m diameter circle ROCKETS Wide Spread Unavailable, Only Regular All LOS/TRP combinations: ~600m diameter circle A few things to note: 1. These results are very similar to, but not quite the same as, those I posted a while back with some earlier version. 2. All impact patterns were centered on the point of aim. That is, there is no "scatter" to the over-all pattern regardless of LOS or TRP. This makes sense because the FFE isn't going to start until the FO has adjusted it onto the target. 3. If you have a TRP, you always get the same pattern regardless of LOS. 4. For the most part, if you have a either a TRP or an LOS, you get the same pattern. Only when you have neither do you get a bigger pattern. The exception is with guns, which have 3 steps of pattern size on the regular spread: TRP (LOS or blind), LOS only, and blind only. 5. Guns shoot slightly tighter patterns than mortars under the same conditions of LOS and TRP. This should be no surprise, because guns are controlled and fired by artillerymen, whereas mortars are done by grunts 6. Rockets are a special case. They only have the regular spread option, and they always shoot a HUGE circular pattern regardless of LOS and TRP. The only thing these variables affect is the time to FFE. On the subject of time for FFE, I make the following general observations: 1. All FOs have a base time that shows up in their info window when you call for fire. This base time is a function of a) weapon type (mortars are faster than guns and rockets) and nationality. The base time always shows UNLESS you're shooting at a TRP, which reduces the base time. But if the actual time is greater than the base time, you still only see the base time. 2. If the target is within the magic distance from a TRP, this base time is halved. 3. If the FO has no LOS, it will take at least twice the base time to get FFE. This is cumulative with the TRP bonus, so a blind TRP shot takes the same amount of time as a non-TRP shot in LOS, ie, approximately the base time. 4. Regardless of what the base time says, when it finally starts counting down like a timer to FFE, its time can run slower than the game turn clock. How much slower seems to depend on the existence of LOS or TRP. Troop quality probably also affects timer speed, but I didn't test this. 5. Besides starting FFE faster, TRP shots usually do not use spotting rounds before the FFE starts. Just BOOM, there it all is, so there's no warning to the enemy. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

Malmvig said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Not all scout missions at nature needed to be weak in force.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> OK, now you're talking a totally different situation, like at least a full platoon. You want this group of units to act in concert in some automatic way based on all the variables in the tactical situation. I don't think this is something CM can do. I have seen no real evidence of a collective AI that can control a whole platoon as a signle entity, as opposed to controlling each sub-unit individually. The AI seems to only deal with individual units. If that particular unit gets in trouble, it will run away and leave all its buddies hanging. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Bullethead: Many thanks again for the lesson on arty.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> No problem. I just don't remember giving lessons ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

Fubar- Unfortunately, the readme in 1.05 says prisoners no longer set off mines. Damn shame, as that was one of my favorite things It's especially annoying because my own troops set off the mines, but somehow learn to avoid them when captured But even when using prisoners was possible, I'm not sure it did any good. Basically, the question is: do minefields have a finite number of mines? I no longer think they do, but instead always exist and always have a chance of hurting whatever moves through the area. I know from personal experience that arty can breach mines and wire. I have also read that in WW1, they'd use MGs to breach wire as well. I have tried all these in CM and have yet to create a breach. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

Juardis- Interesting results you've got here. They are different from what I obtained earlier as to shape of pattern. Perhaps this was changed in 1.05? I'll have to run my own shooting range again . FWIW, last time I did the test, mortars and arty had the same shape of pattern in the same conditions. If there was an LOS to the impact area, the pattern was ovate with the long axis E-W. If no LOS, it came in 2 sizes: a wide cirlce with a TRP, and a very wide cirlce with no TRP. TRPs didn't affect impact pattern if there was an LOS. And rockets ALWAYS made a VERY wide circle, regardless of LOS or TRP. My test range is about 4000x2000m of grid-textured grass. Every 600m is a grain field tile surrounded by 100m of brush tiles. This enables me to accurately determine the size and shape of each pattern, plus obtain average figures for them over many runs. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

I'm not surprised at analogies you draw between opium and CM. After all, the average CM player (and thus I assume Steve and Charlse) is of an age to have been heavily exposed to opium in early childhood. What did they call that stuff? Paragoric? ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Now if I can only learn to cope with the 120 degree heat index.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, for starters, don't become a fireman until after you've acclimatized . To acclimatize, pack several quarts of Gatoraid and just go walk around in it between 1400 and 1600 for a week. Then try to cut the grass during that time. Gradually build up to fighting fires in full bunker gear in that timeframe ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

Malmvig said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>In CM you always need to make a decision whatever you want to move you scouts fast or, you want to move them safe.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, that's how it is in real life . The faster something moves, the more likely it is to catch the eye or make noise. So I don't see this as a problem. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>What I had hoped for but don't get is, that when these units gets into throuble they redraw to a safe place as soon as they realise they are outnumbered.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> As I see it, the decision on whether to fight or flee is left to you, the player. Scouts ALWAYS get into trouble--that's the whole reason you send them out there in the first place. They die so that others (the majority of your force) may live. Also, when you get ambushed, running away is almost always a bad idea. Usually, your only hope is to try to shoot back as hard as you can. Units in the game are assumed to know this, having gone to virtual bootcamp. Thus, it would be unrealistic for them to act otherwise. Also, what you want here is for the AI to make some rather complex tactical decisions and generate new movement orders for the unit on the spot based on the results of these decisions. I don't know if such a thing is possible. CM obviously already does something similar with a 1-on-1 basis, such as a Sherman popping smoke and retreating when it sees a Panther. But that's a lot simpler a situation than having some random team/squad out scouting and meeting whatever happens to be there. There would be no hard and fast, or at least easily discernable, rules for the AI to apply. Plus, even if this was possible to code, it would create another problem. How would the AI know your unit, drawn from the ranks of your entire force, is a "scout" as opposed to a line troop? If the AI was changed so that grunts always retreated when faced with superior numbers, then how would you ever be able to deliberately order such actions when you need them like you do in every battle? Jeff said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>it would have been nice for the squads to CONTINUE along with thier sneak orders AFTER the enemy mortar team was destroyed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yeah, you got a point here. It seems to me that once the shooting stops, the would-be Sneakers have something similar to the normal new-orders delay before they start moving again. The Sneak order is still in effect from the previous turn, they're just not doing it immediately. HOWEVER, IMHO this is very realistic. Think about it from the perspective of the troops. You've just been in a firefight. You might have taken casualties that need bandaging. You for sure have to reload. And you REALLY want to make sure those other bastards are really all dead or gone before you get up and start moving again. This all takes some time. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>It's a Type 99 Carrier! Maybe this means BTS are eager to do CM: Beyond Midway after all!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Good eye. This is excellent news for those of us anxiously awaiting a PTO/CBI version ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I gotta wash my car tomorrow before I lose my paint job! Any other advice for this carpetbagger?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Better wash the car ASAP. It only takes a couple hours for the acid in their blood to discolor the paint. As for advice on Southern bugs in general, I recommend you drink a LOT of homebrew beer or, if that's too much work, eat a lot of brewer's yeast pills. Apparently, some sort of vitimin B found in these products is a natural bug repellant. What your body can't absorb is sweated out all over your skin, keeping bugs away. Also, start putting Tabasco on everything you eat, liberally. Not only is this also good for you, it makes you taste bad to most bugs. So if the vitimin B doesn't keep them away, at least they'll only take a nibble before giving up. Eat enough hotsauce and they'll explode in flames ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

OK, I'm confused . To try to sort this out, I will begin by stating what I think each of the various movement commands do at present (1.05). If these are wrong, tell me. Sneak: Slow movement of whole squad abstracting individuals moving cover to cover with some degree of stealth. If the squad encounters the enemy, emphasis becomes firing as much as possible. Squad will usually still move, but probably not very far. IIRC, in prior versions Sneak had much less emphasis on shooting. Move: Slightly faster movement of whole squad abstracting fireteam rushes from cover to cover. It is NOT just standing up and walking. Still fairly good at avoiding casualties during movement, but not quite as good at this as Sneak. If the enemy is encountered, squad will continue moving as ordered and may or may not fire. Usually does, but not as much as with Sneak. Fast: Balls-out running with thought for neither cover nor returning fire. Covers ground rapidly but at high risk, plus causes fatigue. Crawl: Very slow movement seeking to gain the maximum use of any cover along path. Emphasis is on moving and fire is not returned. So, it seems to me we have a command for all occasions. With Fast and Crawl, you sacrifice firepower for extreme speed and extreme defense, respectively. Sneak and Move, OTOH, are compromises giving different proportions of fire, movement, and cover. Sneak has less movement but more fire and cover, while Move has less fire and cover but more motion. Which you use depends on the situation, and that requires using proper tactics. Now, looking at Jeff's example of the troops moving across the field.... I don't this example is a good reason to change any of the above commands, because it does not appear to illustrate correct tactics. Instead of moving the entire force across the field at once, there should instead be units left behind in overwatch to cover the advance. So when the MG unmasks, the overwatching units start suppressing it while the rest continue their advance. To do this, give the advancing elements Move orders and just face the overwatchers in the right direction. When the advancing units complete their Move, they will be in grenade range of the MG. Once the treeline is secured, the advancers pause in a hasty perimeter while the overwatchers come across. Moving an entire force across an open field at once is risky in real life. Of course, it's faster than the bounding overwatch, so there's one of those terrible, life-or-death trade-offs commanders have to make 24/7. But the point is, if you decide to move everybody at once and take fire in the open, you should be at a disadvantage, as you are in real life. Thus, I don't think changing how commands work to make this situation easier is a good idea. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

My experience is that with the 1.05 patch, Sneak works the best for moving in close proximity to the enemy. It is the best at allowing the squad to keep up a good fire while moving cautiously from cover to cover. Also, it seems to be the best for advancing to contact when you know the enemy is very close but not presently in LOS (deep woods, etc). The Sneaking squads will stop moving and fire when they get a target more often than using Move. This isn't always the case. Sometimes a squad will Sneak along ignoring targets and get massacred. But the majority of the time, I get what I want. For the rest, c'est la guerre It's my understanding that of all the movement commands, Sneak has the most emphasis on shooting. Yes, the squad will try to complete the ordered move to the next waypoint, but this seems to have a lower priority than with Move. If you give a Move order in the above situations, the squad will almost always keep moving to the waypoint regardless of enemy action, and may not shoot back at all. With Sneak OTOH, next turn I usually find the Sneak's waypoint unreached. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

I can't even manually target an infantry sound contact when using the targeting tool. The sound contact "unit" is unclickable. My take on this is that an infantry sound contact is assumed in the game to be "out there somewhere". I have seen troops, even elites, shoot at nothing at all in night battles. No sound contact, no national insignia icon, nothing. But there were usually things going on within a few hundred meters of where they shot, either actual combat or sound contacts. So perhaps a sound contact "unit" on the map simply represents the center of an area of effect within which troops hear noises. If they reach the point of thinking there's really something there, they shoot at a random spot within this area, where they think the noise is really coming from. I don't know, but it does seem to me that the actual sound contact "unit" isn't treated as a real unit in terms of being a specific target. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

The problem with speeding up the PBEM process is that it greatly reduces the scope for inter-player taunting. Especially if, as in your proposal, the players aren't talking directly but are sending their turns to some server ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Black flies don't connect with southerners<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> They know better. If they don't break their teeth on our thick hides, they suffer spontaneous bug combustion from the amount of hotsauce in our blood . Even the dreaded Highland Midge gives me a wide berth. Down here, however, we have Southern flies that have co-evolved with us and can handle this stuff. Deerflies in massive swarms and smaller formations of the much larger hossflies. The skeeters get more press due to numbers and all the yankees they kill with fever, but IMHO the hossfly is the true ruler of the skies. They've been known to carry off small childern. But the bug that I find most annoying is the lovebug. These things don't bite nor seem to damage crops, but they are a serious threat to travellers. Twice each summer, such as right now, they swarm by the billion over hot surfaces like roads, mating on the wing. You hit so many that you have to stop every 5-10 miles and clean your windshield just to be able to see. Plus wash them off the fenders because their blood quickly ruins your paintjob. And don't even think about motorcycling unless you like the nasty taste of the things and don't mind feeling sandblasted. They are also attracted to white objects in the evening, such as your house, which they will completely cover. Next morning, they'll mostly be dead, leaving ankle-deep drifts on your walkways for you to track on the carpet. Nothing (except bikers) eats these things. The swallows, martins, and dragonflies all stay clear and spiders abandon their webs and build new ones when they get full of lovebugs. Fire ants won't even touch the corpses on the ground. And as the great mounds of them rot in the hot sun, they release a very putrid funk. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>There ARE lots of deer down here, but they're just cute, tiny things. Nothing worth shooting at<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Mostly we shoot them to keep them from eating crops and flower beds, and being road hazards. Damn vermin, worse than rabid SS Gerbilgrenadiers. Plus, they make good alligator bait, and what's left is good for crayfish bait. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

If you deploy units on the non-visible part of the operation's map, I don't know what happens to them. I'm only just now making my 1st operation myself. I suggest you try it and see for yourself, which is what I'm going to do when I get to that point in the work The battle window size is based on map width. It goes the whole height of the map, but only the set number of meters from the west edge in width. That is, if the battle window was 1200m, then you'd see from the west edge 1200m to the east and no further, but all the way to the true map edges north and south. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

DaveT said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>OK now you need to get to work on the rest of the Allied tanks<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yeah. And join up with Pritzl to avoid duplication of effort, at least at first . Dave ------------------ My front is pushed back.My right gives way.Situation Excellent! I am attacking! Ferdinand Foch 1916 ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

Hell, any mod looks good to me who lacks the skill or tools to make them myself . I'll take it as is. But since you want critcism, I'll say this: It seems to me that most US winter cammo was either bedsheets draped over the vehicles or whitewash liberated from occupied farms. The former doesn't seem practical for a mod and the latter was probably brushed on. And also came off fairly easily. Thus, I think the whitewash would end up giving you a reverse shading effect. That is, it would stay on longer inside the angles, nooks, and crannies of the vehicle rather than the flat surfaces. So like where you have the Chaffee's green showing on the fender support brackets, that's where I'd expect the most white to be. Same goes for real snow accumulations. So, if you want to improve this, perhaps you should try putting more white in the cranny areas you presently have the darkest. Otherwise, I think the coverage of the flat areas looks great. At this scale, I can't tell whether the white looks brushed or sprayed, but I think either method would result, after a bit of exposure to the elements, in a foggy, irregular, semi-translucent effect like you have here. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

OK, the battle window in an operation defines how much of the map is visible at any 1 time in one of the operation's battles. I believe the minimum battle window size is 1200m. So if your map was 2000m long and if 0 was the Allied entry end, then for the 1st battle, you'd see from 0-1200m of the map. If the German base area was beyond that distance, it (and that whole part of the map) wouldn't show up in the battle. It's like the world ends at 1200m. As the Allies advance, the 1200m window rolls forward with them. So say they advance 500m in the 1st battle. Then in the 2nd battle, some part of the map at the Allied end would be cut off, and some more on the German end would become visible. The amount depends on the size of no-man's-land you set and where the front line ends up being drawn. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

Thanks, RL . That's my own opinion. Plus, even if you don't do any better, you at least gain a better appreciation of the horror of it all. At least I do. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the brand new Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops Main site www.historicalgames.bizland.com/index.html

What, really, are you calling "lemming tactics" ? After all, one of the fundamental principles of war is mass, to attempt to achieve superior force at the critical point. Perhaps in some cases the defender sees this being done to him and calls this "lemming tactics", when in reality it's realistic massing of force against defenders spread too thin while trying to cover all the bases. But it seems to me that in scenarios with roughly balanced forces, if the attacker puts all his might on 1 flank, he leaves the unengaged defenders free to counterattack his exposed flank. ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops

Consider this a shameless plug if you will, but I'd like some feedback. A couple months ago, I uploaded a scenario called Valhalla1, Fight for a Volcano. Totally hypothetical, the objective was to control the top of this huge, snow-covered volcano at the end of the game. Has anybody d/l'd it and, if so, what did you think? ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops

On this subject of hard-to-impossible scenarios, I have a philosophical question. Basically, life ain't fair and sometimes (or, as it seems to the line troopies, more often than not), the assigned mission far exceeds the capabilities of the tasked unit. But orders is orders so in you go. My question is, if such a battle is well-documented, should a scenario designer stick to the facts and give the players a pretty much hopeless situation, or should they "tweak" the balance of forces to make it winnable? I mean, we're not talking about an FPS game where you have to win to move to the next level. We're talking about a game that attempts to recreate reality, as part of which there is no "campaign mode" as seen in SP and such. So if you're unit gets wiped out, you don't lose anything in the long run. For example, take the Huertgen Forest. Here, the US faced some of the thickest segments of the Siefried Line, complete with dozens of interlocking pillboxes and bunkers all surrounded by mines and barded wire, and with dug-in troops in the intervals. And all this in a very dense, swampy forest, that greatly limited the ability of supporting arms of all types to help the grunts break through these obstacles, besides adding treebursts to the woes of the exposed attackers. Plus, on top of all this, the US was at the end of its logistical and manpower tethers while the Germans had the railroads they build for the 1940 campaign, AND the US high command kept grossly underestimating the force required. So for practically the whole campaign, you'd have a lone, understrength US battalion given a task properly requiring 1 or more regiments. Worse, often these battalions were doing the only US offensive actions on the 1st Army's front, so the Germans were free to bring in fresh troops from other sectors. As a result, battalions would spend days or even weeks trying to advance a few hundred meters, suffering appalling casualties, to be replaced when totally depleted by other battalions, who suffered the same fate. So say you make an operation of such a battalion's exploits. As true to life as you can make it. What happens? The US player beats his head against the wall for very little gain and terrible cost. Would anybody find this fun? Or even interesting? ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops [This message has been edited by Bullethead (edited 09-14-2000).]

MT said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Skeets ARE the State Bird...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Listen, you carpetbeggar, Lousy-anna had the skeeter as State Bird firstest. Plus poison ivy is the State Flower, and the fire ant is the State Critter. Plus we got better prisons here. How many movies, documentaries, and congressional investigations have there been of Yooper prisons, as opposed to Angola? I rest my case ------------------ -Bullethead Visit the Raider Operations message board at www.delphi.com/raiderops