Erwin Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 There seem to be three types, 7.92, 7.92K and 7.92AP. What rifles/MG's are these for? Also, is there any resupply for the Sturmgewehr(sp?) assault rifle? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Off the top of my head. Apologies for errors: 7.92 = regular 7.92mm ball ammo. Good for many German weapons like MG34/42, k98. 7.92 AP = Armor piercing 7.92mm round typically carried by vehicles, but cross-compatible with standard 7.92mm ammo. Theoretically, 7.92mm AP ammo should be somewhat better at penetrating light armor than standard ball ammo. 7.92K = 7.92mm "Kurz" ammo (Kurz means "Short" in German). This is the ammo for the Stg44. This ammo is not cross-compatible with regular 7.92mm ammo; while the bullet is the same, the cartridge case is shorter and therefore the chambering is different. Edit to add: Never encountered a vehicle carrying 7.92K ammo in-game myself, though this doesn't necessarily mean one doesn't exist. It is worth noting that the Stg44 was pretty rare in Normandy, and given the Germans' general supply problems in the theatre, ammo for it may well have been scarce. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Just to clarify, if needed: The 7.92 and 7.92AP are interchangable. The 7.92K can ONLY be used by the StG44. It can only use 7.92K. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted November 8, 2011 Author Share Posted November 8, 2011 Thanks guys. So, I can have units that use 7.92mm (rifles and MG's) also acquire and use 7.92AP? (Why on earth does the game feature this distinction if there is no effective difference?) Are there any vehicles that carry acquirable 7.92K? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 (Why on earth does the game feature this distinction if there is no effective difference?) Probably because there is a difference. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Statisoris Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Off the top of my head. Apologies for errors: 7.92 = regular 7.92mm ball ammo. Good for many German weapons like MG34/42, k98. 7.92 AP = Armor piercing 7.92mm round typically carried by vehicles, but cross-compatible with standard 7.92mm ammo. Theoretically, 7.92mm AP ammo should be somewhat better at penetrating light armor than standard ball ammo. 7.92K = 7.92mm "Kurz" ammo (Kurz means "Short" in German). This is the ammo for the Stg44. This ammo is not cross-compatible with regular 7.92mm ammo; while the bullet is the same, the cartridge case is shorter and therefore the chambering is different. Edit to add: Never encountered a vehicle carrying 7.92K ammo in-game myself, though this doesn't necessarily mean one doesn't exist. It is worth noting that the Stg44 was pretty rare in Normandy, and given the Germans' general supply problems in the theatre, ammo for it may well have been scarce. 7.92k can be found in German Bunker stashes. This is like the 20th iteration of this exact same thread btw. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted November 8, 2011 Author Share Posted November 8, 2011 "Probably because there is a difference." It would have been actually "helpful" if you could inform the rest of us puzzled folks WHAT is the difference between 7.92mm and 7.92AP in GAME terms? Otherwise, you simply emphasize that there seems no rational point in having these distinctions at all in the CMBN game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheVulture Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 "Probably because there is a difference." It would have been actually "helpful" if you could inform the rest of us puzzled folks WHAT is the difference between 7.92mm and 7.92AP in GAME terms? Otherwise, you simply emphasize that there seems no rational point in having these distinctions at all in the CMBN game. Armour piercing round. Better penetration of light armour (and buildings?). There is no difference in which weapons can fire the rounds, just in the effect when they are fired. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkelried Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 The "Patrone SmK" (Spitz mit Kern) as the 7.92AP in the game was officially called had a V0 of 785 m/s and could penetrate 12mm of steel - although I have not found (yet) at which distance. Another "Patrone SmK/H" was produced until early 1943, but was cancelled since it contained tungsten. It penetrated 20mm of steel at 500m. There existed also a "Patrone PmK" with a phosphorous incendiary core which could penetrate 7.5mm of steel. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbmtintin Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 The "Patrone SmK" (Spitz mit Kern) as the 7.92AP in the game was officially called had a V0 of 785 m/s and could penetrate 12mm of steel - although I have not found (yet) at which distance. Another "Patrone SmK/H" was produced until early 1943, but was cancelled since it contained tungsten. It penetrated 20mm of steel at 500m. There existed also a "Patrone PmK" with a phosphorous incendiary core which could penetrate 7.5mm of steel. And do you know what was the steel penetration of the regular 7.92? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Statisoris Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 And do you know what was the steel penetration of the regular 7.92? Here are some penetration numbers for the standard 7.9sS (schweres Spitzgeschoss) "heavy pointed bullet". 10mm of iron at 300m 7mm of iron at 550m 5mm of steel at 100m 3mm of steel at 600m. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Statisoris Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 The "Patrone SmK" (Spitz mit Kern) as the 7.92AP in the game was officially called had a V0 of 785 m/s and could penetrate 12mm of steel - although I have not found (yet) at which distance. The SmK (Spitzgeschoss mit Kern = "pointed bullet with core") could penetrate 12-13mm at a distance of 100m. One can see that the AP round would be more effective, at least against the two lighter US vehicles below vs the the standard German round which doesn't even look like it would penetrate. M2 and M3 Halftrack Armor 6.4-13mm M8 Greyhound Armor Hull Front, Upper 16 mm, 5/8", 0.625"@0°4 Hull Front, Lower 19 mm, 0.75" Hull Sides, Upper 9 mm, 3/8", 0.375"@0°4 Hull Sides, Lower 9 mm, 3/8" Hull Rear 9 mm, 3/8", 0.375"@0°4 Hull Top 6 mm, 0.25" Hull Bottom 3 mm, 1/8-1/4" Turret Front 19 mm, 0.75", 0.875"@0°4 Turret Sides 19 mm, 0.75", 0.75"@0°4 Turret Rear 19 mm, 0.75" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted November 8, 2011 Author Share Posted November 8, 2011 Sorry for being the 21st thread on where to find 7.92K, Statisoris. It's just strange that the only place to find the ammo is in bunkers (and I couldn't find any mention of that in the manual). So, that was helpful. Thanks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkelried Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Here are some penetration numbers for the standard 7.9sS (schweres Spitzgeschoss) "heavy pointed bullet". I am not sure how many SS still in use in 1944. In 1942 the SmE (Spitzgeschoss mit Eisenkern) seems to have substituted the SS almost completely in order to make economies on lead. In 1944 the SmE Lg (Lang) was introduced which reduced the amount of lead required to nil, but had similar ballistics than the SS. Maybe you have some data on the SmE and SmE Lg. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Statisoris Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 I am not sure how many SS still in use in 1944. In 1942 the SmE (Spitzgeschoss mit Eisenkern) seems to have substituted the SS almost completely in order to make economies on lead. In 1944 the SmE Lg (Lang) was introduced which reduced the amount of lead required to nil, but had similar ballistics than the SS. Maybe you have some data on the SmE and SmE Lg. Hmm, don't seem to have anything other than basic information on that round. I have contacted a reliable source of mine who deals in World War 2 arms and ammunition. I will see what he says about the SmE (Spitzgeschoss mit Eisenkern) "Pointed bullet with iron core" penetration and put up a post when he gets back to me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Statisoris Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 No luck, my source does not have any historical penetration data on the SmE (Spitzgeschoss mit Eisenkern) "Pointed bullet with iron core". :-( He did state that "it was a bit more penetrative vs the sS" but he does not have actual figures in milimeters. So we could probably assume that it was somewhere in between the sS and the SmK. Maybe anywhere from 6mm-11mm at 100meters. If anyone has real number on the SmE please post. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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