A teeny weeny little bug thread for NATO

[SlowMotion]

Here's a small AI thing I noticed while playing a QB.

The soldier visible in the LAV keeps looking at the direction where no enemy is spotted. Even though enemy infantry behind his back keeps shooting at his vehicle from maybe 50 meters away and within 1 minute destroys the vehicle.

I think the soldier should have spotted the enemy and reacted differently: turn 180 degrees towards the enemy, seek cover inside the vehicle or something, but NOT ignore the firing.

Maybe there was another soldier standing behind the still visible soldier who died, can't remember, and the code thinks it's his responsibility to scan that side of the vehicle?

[YankeeDog]

It is my understanding that soldiers riding "airguard" in vehicles do usually divide the area around the vehicle into sectors, with each soldier being responsible for covering a certain arc. In general they're not supposed to fire into another soldier's arc of responsibility, but rather keep their focus on their own arc, in case a new threat pops up. So if there was a soldier in the right side hatch who recently went down, it's possible this soldier still has his attention focused to the left because that's his "assigned arc."

This said, I would think that there are limits to this, and that sooner or later a soldier would shift his attention to an obvious, imminent threat regardless of his assigned arc, especially if another airguard goes down and leaves his arc uncovered.

In your specific case, though, it also looks like the airguard soldier may not be able to see the threat -- he's standing on the left side of the vehicle, and if I understand you correctly the threat is coming from the right side, from a lower elevation. So he may not have LOS/LOF to the enemy from his current position, because part of the vehicle is between himself and the target. Ideally, I suppose he should shift over to the right side hatch to try to gain LOS, but this may be asking a lot of the Soldier AI to have it popping soldiers around from hatch to hatch like whack-a-moles, in an attempt to gain LOS to a target.

[SlowMotion]

Too bad I didn't save the situation so I could check if the LAV soldier had LOS. But I guess this could be part of a larger issue that sometimes makes things look weird for the player - spotting happens based on sight only.

If you hear shooting behind your back when there aren't many battle sounds nearby, you might turn to check what is happening. But now units behave as if they were deaf to shooting, engine sounds, soldier in same vehicle getting wounded etc.

[akd]

Some possible problems:

1. There seems to be some issue with target spotting/information sharing in the YPR-765. I keep running into situation where the "passengers" are spotting targets (even buttoned up, I believe), but the "vehicle" never seems to acquire these targets.

(Above went on for a good ten minutes. Target never become visible to vehicle or was engaged by vehicle, even after repositioning.)

Which brings up another issue, should the YPR-765 GNs have IR optics? It is not clear to me where this sensor would be located if so. They (or their passengers at least) seem very good at spotting targets...

2. However Gill ATGM teams seem completely blind in comparison. Does the deployed Gill have IR optics? Can the Gill team use the Gill CLU optics when the system is not deployed (ala Javelin)?

[phil stanbridge]

/\ I've seen that behaviour with other vehicles too. Only the passengers will spot the target, even if they are 'buttoned' up within the IFV.

[Waaarg]

Is there any hope we can get a C2/Equipment hotfix outside of the scope of the 1.31 patch?

A very big part of me is happy for the bug, as it really did give me a much better idea of how C2 works.

Is there any est date on the 1.31 patch itself?

[Praetori]

Hi

i playing a PBEM game ( Nato Dutch Damascus blues again ) in the martyr1 place there are 4 1 store houses in a row. my men panic and ran out of the

wall the dont use the door.

i have save game if need it.

Lol that sound hilarious (Disney comics comes to mind), FRAPS for good laughs.

[akd]

Ran into one of these situations where adjust fire never takes effect. Clock ran out with nothing happening, a good 15 minutes plus. Save from 5-10 minutes after request for adjust fire:

http://www.filefront.com/17507979/De Hinderlaag 001.bts

[HintJ]

I apologize if its already been mentioned, but it seems that in the Task Force Thunder campaign, many of the unit names are not human proper names, but are team names like "A company HQ" instead of "Callahan," or whatever. This was not like this before.

[HintJ]

I should say, since this is a NATO bug thread that, after having installed the NATO addon as part of the bundle, TF Thunder units have messed up names.

[Peter Panzer]

Are Dutch Recon Lieutenants really armed with M240/FN MAG's or is this a TO&E mismatch?

[Alan8325]

I apologize if its already been mentioned, but it seems that in the Task Force Thunder campaign, many of the unit names are not human proper names, but are team names like "A company HQ" instead of "Callahan," or whatever. This was not like this before.

In v1.30, there was a fix that made name changes to individual units apply to the unit's leader name in the unit info panel rather than the individual unit. Therefore you can't go to the editor and rename the A company HQ to "Callahan," but the leader name in that unit's info panel will say "Callahan" when before it might have said "Smith." Platoon level formations and up can still be renamed, however.

[HintJ]

In v1.30, there was a fix that made name changes to individual units apply to the unit's leader name in the unit info panel rather than the individual unit. Therefore you can't go to the editor and rename the A company HQ to "Callahan," but the leader name in that unit's info panel will say "Callahan" when before it might have said "Smith." Platoon level formations and up can still be renamed, however.

What I mean is, after having installed the NATO/USMC/UK bundle, the TF Thunder campaign messes up the names of many units. For example, the company commander is now called "A Co HQ" instead of "Callahan," among others.

Because I'm talking about a campaign, I can't even load it in the editor to change the names back.

[Alan8325]

What I mean is, after having installed the NATO/USMC/UK bundle, the TF Thunder campaign messes up the names of many units. For example, the company commander is now called "A Co HQ" instead of "Callahan," among others.

Because I'm talking about a campaign, I can't even load it in the editor to change the names back.

Yeah, the 1.30 changes applied to everything IIRC, including existing campaigns which were all made in the editor at one point. That mission in TF Thunder originally had the unit named "Callahan", but since updating to v1.30 it is just A Co HQ, but the unit leader name should be Callahan now. I don't have a running TF Thunder campaign in progress to check, but can you tell if the unit leader name is at least correct?

[HintJ]

Yeah, the 1.30 changes applied to everything IIRC, including existing campaigns which were all made in the editor at one point. That mission in TF Thunder originally had the unit named "Callahan", but since updating to v1.30 it is just A Co HQ, but the unit leader name should be Callahan now. I don't have a running TF Thunder campaign in progress to check, but can you tell if the unit leader name is at least correct?

I know what you are talking about--in 1.30 we have lost the ability to name units in the editor, but that's not what I'm talking about.

Maybe my problem with leader names is only after installing the 3-module bundle. Many of the leader's names are now the same as the unit's name. And some of the Stryker's names don't even match the vehicle #. It's a complete naming mess and obviously an error.

[Waaarg]

When I installed the Marine+Brit bundle, all the names were wrong. A re-install fixed it.

[HintJ]

When I installed the Marine+Brit bundle, all the names were wrong. A re-install fixed it.

Do I need to unlicense or anything first, or do you suggest just re-run the bundle .exe?

[Federico]

HintJ,

You are right.

I have the CMSF+Marines Bundle + Brit Forces + Nato.

We have to reinstall all?

tks

[HintJ]

Are Dutch Recon Lieutenants really armed with M240/FN MAG's or is this a TO&E mismatch?

What's that circular bases mod called? It reminds me of Close Combat hula hoops!

[stoex]

Got another one - relatively minor but can be a PITA until you notice, and particularly during setup. Thing is, now that units share ammo, a unit's ammo count shows ALL the ammo available to that unit, not just the ammo the unit is carrying. In other words, it shows the sum of the ammo the unit is carrying PLUS all the appropriate ammo that units around the original unit are carrying, ready to be shared. Not entirely the way it should be, I think.

Example: During setup (Dutch campaign, mission 2), you have several GILL missile teams in Fennek transports. If you put the Fenneks close together in the setup zone, the teams will show 4 missiles each. If you put them far apart, they will show 2 missiles each. It's the same if you take the teams out of the Fenneks, by the way. Also the same for MG teams (any unit that has a numbered ammo count, not just the bars in the GUI) If you get the distance just right, the teams may even show 3 missiles each, which I think has to do with the fact that only one soldier from another team is within sharing range, not both. The graphic representation of the ammo is always correct, however. No screenies necessary as this is easy to reproduce...

Another related issue is that ammo sharing 'distance' may be a little large and unrealistic in some cases. This is due to the fact that all levels of buildings are treated as one action spot for the purpose of ammo sharing. This means that if I have a GILL team on the roof of a 6 story building (without ammo), and another GILL team with ammo walks into an adjacent action spot on the ground, the team on the roof immediately inherits a missile from them. Also, units can share ammo with units out of LOS, e.g. through a wall with no doors or windows. Both of these aspects create opportunities for highly gamey ammo sharing (meaning you can leave a team out of sight and let it constantly supply the 'fighting' teams without them having to move, and without exposing the ammo carrying team.

I wonder if a relatively easy fix for either of these issues is possible?

[Waaarg]

Hrm this might be a different name issue than mine. But it couldn't hurt to try. I un-installed - relicensed then re-installed. But make sure you do it in the proper install order or there is a texture issue that pops up.

I checked both versions (1.21 and 1.30) and they are the same and I haven't seen that issue in any of my games so I'd give it a shot.

[Jonny(FGM)]

With regards to ammo sharing.

I had a dutch recon team jump in a APC to go fetch a Panzerfaust missile, there was another recon team on the roof of the building the APC was hiding behind. Then the second the recon team dismounted the faust missile instantly jumped from the dismounting team to the team on the roof. I thought ammo sharing wasn't supposed to work like this?

[Allan Wotherspoon]

With regards to ammo sharing.

I had a dutch recon team jump in a APC to go fetch a Panzerfaust missile, there was another recon team on the roof of the building the APC was hiding behind. Then the second the recon team dismounted the faust missile instantly jumped from the dismounting team to the team on the roof. I thought ammo sharing wasn't supposed to work like this?

Musical Panzerfaust's anyone?

I suppose this is an example of unintended consequences when implementing a requested feature...

[Jonny(FGM)]

Not really a complaint though, this was how I was imagining the ammo sharing working in the first place ; )

Although the dismounting squad only had 1 faust and I wasn't too pleased they gave it up so easily lol

[Alan8325]

With regards to ammo sharing.

I had a dutch recon team jump in a APC to go fetch a Panzerfaust missile, there was another recon team on the roof of the building the APC was hiding behind. Then the second the recon team dismounted the faust missile instantly jumped from the dismounting team to the team on the roof. I thought ammo sharing wasn't supposed to work like this?

Was it a 1-story building? I can realistically see someone going up to the wall of the building and handing a panzerfaust rocket up to someone on the roof, but if it is a multi-story building it becomes a little unbelievable and I would say it's a bug.