noxnoctum Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 Specifically between standard and (late)... there is a small price difference, but no visible different stats... Anyone? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarquon Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 More ammo and a faster turret. Best to compare them in the editor. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 noxnoctum, There's a big difference in capabilities, as detailed here. http://www.battletanks.com/t34_85.htm Longer, detailed discussion here. http://www.battlefield.ru/en/armors/27-medium-tanks/87-t34-85.html Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Um, the first is only talking about the difference between the T-34/85 and the T-34/76, as is the bulk of the second longer article. The question was about differences between early and late T-34/85s. All of these had 3 man turrets etc. The late model had an improved (lighter) recoil mechanism, which marginally improved the rate of fire and gave a bit more room in the turret for the crew. Ventilation was also slightly improved. Whether the lighter recoil mechanism made for any real increase in turret speed is debatable (likely not), but CMBB gives such a benefit. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 JasonC, Beg to differ. The second link is quite specific regarding the D-5T armed T-34/85's configuration. The turret has 2 men, not 3, and the crew is 4. http://www.battlefield.ru/en/armors/27-medium-tanks/87-t34-85.html (Fair use) "The tanks, armed with the D-5T gun, were noticeably different from vehicles produced later, both in external appearance and in internal construction. It had a two-man turret and a four-man crew overall. The commander's cupola, with a two-leafed folding hatch and revolving on a ball-bearing support, had been moved sharply forward. An MK-4 observation periscope, permitting an all-around field of view, was mounted on the turret roof. The gun and coaxial machine-gun were fired using the TSh-15 telescopic elbow sight and the PTK-5 panoramic telescope. Both sides of the turret had an observation slit covered with triplex glass. The radio was located in the hull with its antenna lead on the right side, exactly the same as on the T-34. The ammunition load consisted of 56 shells and 1,953 machine-gun rounds. The power plant, transmission, and chassis underwent practically no changes. These tanks differed among themselves dependent on when they were produced. For example, early-production vehicles had one turret ventilator, while most of those produced later had two. It should be noted that the model examined above did not, apparently, figure into statistical accounting as a T-34–85. In any case, at the present time, there exist significant discrepancies in the literature regarding estimates of the quantity of vehicles produced. The basic figure varies in a range of 500–700 tanks. In actual fact, the number was significantly lower. This can be shown by the fact that in 1943, 283 D-5T guns were produced, 260 in 1944, 543 in all. Of this number, 107 guns were used in JS-1 tanks, a 130 (not more than 100 according to other sources) were used in KV-85 tanks, and a few more were used in vehicle prototypes. Therefore, the number of T-34 tanks produced with the D-5T gun is close to 300 vehicles." By contrast, the S-53 armed versions differed markedly (Ibid.) "The «thirty-fours» with the S-53 or ZIS-S-53 gun had three-man turrets, with the commander's cupola moved farther to the rear. Only the new MK-4 type observation device was installed. The commander's PTK-5 panoramic telescope was removed. The engine had been taken care of as well: the «Cyclone» air filters had been replaced with the more efficient «Multi-cyclone» type. The tank's remaining systems and assemblies were practically untouched." So, we have crew of 4 for the D-5T version, with 2 in the turret, vs. a crew of 5 for the S-53, with 3 in a new turret. Seems to me those are significant differences. The S-53 version should be significantly more expensive because it's more capable of rapidly acquiring and engaging the enemy, since the commander can now focus on fighting the tank, rather than timesharing between command and shooting, and ROF should be higher than for the D-5T versions because of a full time gunner. Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 The tiny run of 300 vehicles with the early gun do not appear in the game at all. The game vehicles reflect the minor differences between the earlier S-53 and the slightly improved ZIS-53 guns. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 JasonC, Roger that. Per the CMBB Strategy Guide, page 2/31, the first model in the game has a slow turret and an L/52 gun, the second a slow turret and an L/55 gun, and the third a fast turret and an L/55 gun. I find it most odd that BFC skipped the early T-34/85 altogether, considering that it's numbers are much greater than for the T-34/57 tank-interceptor, whose fielded weapon count is positively minuscule and then, depicted only the early model of two types deployed, for there was also a 1943 version. Since BFC had Valera's cooperation at The Russian Battlefield, this information should've been available to the game designers. As you can see from pics 2 and 7, there are major visual differences between the two types. http://www.battlefield.ru/en/armors/27-medium-tanks/78-t34-57.html Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravells Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Hi John, Do you know if the CMBB strategy guide is still available to purchase? I can't find it listed in the Store. Cheers Ravs 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 http://www.battlefront.com/products/cmbb_guide/cmbb_guide.html 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravells Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Ohh thanks Wicky! (Sorry about the threadjack all). Dang, the buy and download site is no longer in operation....(sigh). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Are you in the US? http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=88741&highlight=Strategy+Guide 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravells Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 No sadly not, in the UK, that's why it probably didn't work, although I didn't even see a way to select US as a region. Thanks for your help anyway, Wicky. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 25, 2009 Share Posted December 25, 2009 ravells, It's not a threadjack when you chime in to ask about something already being discussed in the thread. As you can see from Wicky's response, we're happy to assist. Recommend you E-mail Madmatt sales@battlefront.com and see how to go about getting a copy. Am sure there's a way. In the limit, something could be done person-to-person. Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravells Posted December 25, 2009 Share Posted December 25, 2009 Thanks John, and a merry christmas to you! Thanks for all my early presents (the info you sent me!) best Ravs 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 27, 2009 Share Posted December 27, 2009 ravells, Same to you, and you're welcome! Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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