Planning a trip to Russia; ideas welcome

[tooz]

Guys, next year my wife will fly to China to spend time with her family. I will join her later but I am looking into flying in either St. Petersburg or Moscow from Chicago, then fly to Shanghai afterwards.

So, I plan on spending a week in Russia first. Has anyone taken a flight from Chicago to Russia? Caveats or tips welcomed.

Once I rendezvous with the missus in China we will fly back to Chicago together. Having done that I will have actually flown around the world once. Kind of ambitious but I think this idea is sound (not to mention expensive).

Should I fly from St. Petersburg to Moscow or just take the train?

I know I'll need two visas--one for Russia and one for China. Figure three days in both Russian cities and one day spent travelling between the two.

One thing I really enjoy about this forum is that most members have done some globetrotting of their own.

[Sergei]

Be sure to learn the cyrillic alphabet (it's not hard) before you go, otherwise you won't survive for a day. In three days, you might be able to walk through the Hermitage museum in St.Petersburg, and queue to Lenin's mausoleum in Moscow.

[gunnergoz]

Too bad your stay is so brief, otherwise you might have made it to the Russian tank museum at Kubinka. I've not been there but seen many photos of it and it is on my must-see-before-I-kick-the-bucket list.

http://www.tankmuseum.ru/

http://www.threewhales.ru/t25.html

[tooz]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Be sure to learn the cyrillic alphabet (it's not hard) before you go, otherwise you won't survive for a day. In three days, you might be able to walk through the Hermitage museum in St.Petersburg, and queue to Lenin's mausoleum in Moscow.--Sergei

No problem, Ya gavaroo pa-Roosski (pardon the awful transliteration). Yep, Hermitage and Winter Palace in St. Pete on the list along with St. Basil's in Moscow are must see before bucket kicking.

Gunnergoz--thanks for the links!

[Sixxkiller]

There was a thread here where a guy went to Russia, complete with pics and stuff. Since we now know you are going, we expect a full mock up complete with pictures and samples (in the gallons) of vodka for all board members.

Have a great trip!

[Angus]

I would imagine there are more flights to Shanghai originating in Moscow than St. Petersburg, so I would recommend flying into St. Petersburg first, then going to Moscow.

Take Aeroflot. They use Boeings on their transatlantic routes and will probably be the cheapest option, unless some other airline has a sale. You'd have to get to JFK first, though.

You should take a train to go between the "two capitals." When you figure in the time you spend getting from the city center to the airport, checking in, etc., you don't save much compared to the train and go through a lot more hassle, not to mention the money you have to spend on the taxi rides.

Taking a night train is the best option; that way you won't waste any sightseeing time. There are a bazillion departures:

http://tinyurl.com/ybfoolx (from poezda.net, a good online train schedule)

There's nothing much to see from the train IIRC, so you wouldn't be missing much. A place in a four person berth or "kupe" should be about $50 IIRC. Platzkart would be even cheaper and is perfectly acceptable if you don't have much luggage.

http://www.seat61.com/Russia-trains.htm

Or you could go to Pskov or Velikii Novgorod first for a taste of provincial city life and some interesting architecture, and then continue to Moscow.

If you don't have time to go to Kubinka (I've never been), Park Pobedy in Moscow has a small free outdoor museum with about 40 tanks and aircraft, IIRC.

I lived in Moscow for four years and did a little traveling around European Russia, as well as spending a few months traveling around China for that mater, so if you have any questions ask away. :-)

[tooz]

Angus--cool. Thanks for the links and tips!

[Sergei]

While in St.Pete I think you should go to check the Aurora cruiser which is situated right in the centre. It participated in the battle of Tsushima (on the way there she was also slightly damaged by friendly fire), fired the starting shots of October Revolution and during WW2 her guns were used for defense of Leningrad (the ship itself was bombed several times).

Then there is the Artillery Museum right next to the Peter and Paul's fortress (itself a must see), with its courtyard stacked with tanks and artillery pieces from centuries past to present.

[tooz]

Spaseba! I'll be sure to check these sites out--thanks again!

[-E]

Bring your own food (crackers, etc.) Bring extra jeans to trade.

[tooz]

"Bring your own food (crackers, etc.) Bring extra jeans to trade."--E

I have been reliably informed that most department stores in Russia carry blue jeans nowadays.

I assume Russia now has supermarkets with food on the shelves.

I also saw that Moscow has an unfinished military museum. So, does that mean there are things to see in the finished part? Any link on this museum will be a big help. maybe by Spring 2010 it will be finished?

[Sergei]

I think he was assuming that you're travelling there on a time machine.

[von Paulus]

Been in St Pete and Moscow from 2008 to aug. 2009, I can tell you these places ain't no middle age! (judging by the average size of cars and errr... average size of heels and skirts...!!!) Your wife shouldn't let you go alone there.

If you drive 50kms out of these two cities, yes the time machine is on!! (yet you have to speak and understand fairly russian to avoid any tricky situation... I mean the most dangerous thing here is the police) That's also amazing.

Concerning the military museum, I haven't heard about any opening yet.

Anyway if you wanna see something cool related to WW2, go to "Park Pobieda" (metro Park Pobieda, blue Line, moscow)

There's museum here exclusively dedicated to the Great Patriotic War, with a big paints and yes a few tanks throughout a huge park. Worth seeing the inside, fun pieces of propaganda

And well... personnally I'd take the plane between St Pete & Moscow. Faster. More expensive yes.

But night train in luxury room is also worth it.

Last but not least, prepare for bargaining taxi rides. The point is to stretch your arm towards the street and anyone else will stop. Cheeeeap !!! I mean you can drive 20kms for 500rubles (10$) Real taxis are somewhat costlier.

Eventually, if you're an adventurer, take plane tickets and go to Volgograd for a day. You want war things? History's there!

[tooz]

"Last but not least, prepare for bargaining taxi rides. The point is to stretch your arm towards the street and anyone else will stop. Cheeeeap !!! I mean you can drive 20kms for 500rubles (10$) Real taxis are somewhat costlier." von Paulus

This reminds me of my one and only trip to Lithuania in 1993. This Byelorussion cab driver tried to milk me for $20 US (must have been the white socks with my sneakers that gave me away). I wouldn't go for it and he was much surprised by my ability to curse him back in Russian (Na sharoo sin soka, etc.,). I told him (in Russian) to call the Police if he wanted, then pointed to the meter which (surprisingly) worked. The fare was 20 Tablonas (Litus now) and I tossed a 20 tablonas bill in the cab and went merrily on my way.

I also remembered buying a coke at a soda stand and having to drink the coke there, then give back the plastic cup to the vendor. I am sure things have changed there by now.

Even in 1993 Latvia (Riga is beautiful!) and Estonia (I like Tallinn so much I had to visit Estonia twice) were doing so much better than Lithuania at the time (my heritage is Lithuanian and Ukrainian).

So, I am now brushing up on my Russian (again) and making plans. I have seen from documentaries that the hotel industry is still lagging far behind the West. Is this also true for St. Pete?

[Sergei]

Go to Astoria. They're not lagging behind the west, they have sticked to the same imperial standards throughout the last 100 years. Bath filled with champaigne? No problem. You are a millionaire, right?

There's plenty of international hotel chains in the city, for example Radisson is a high quality Scandinavian place, or then there is Sokos Hotels which is a Finnish chain (and probably half their clientele is Finnish tourists not wanting to experience local culture). I don't have any experience, though, I always stay with friends or in cheapo hostels.

[von Paulus]

of course ... you can find hotels in dark streets welcoming you through the worst of all squalor. (which, in some kind of way, may be fun!) but you can surely find dozens of good hotels close from the center. (and I don't even speak about luxury hotels!!! )

Nevertheless you should buy a travelling guide for those two cities.

[tooz]

Yeah, I have some guides and I am pricing and budgeting.

How long is that train ride to Moscow from St. Pete? Does the Russian train system have a website? Linky please. Metro? If it's in Russian np, because it will be good practice.

Talking about time machines...When I rendezvous with the missus in China I will get a taste of China now, and China then. Her home town is very rustic with big hogs roaming the alleyways along with chickens everywhere (talk about free range). I always get a smile looking at the little piglets trailing behind. My wife's family home only had running water put in back in 2002. Once I get to China my expenses are light because we stay with family in nanjing and Guangzhou. I finally get to spend a little time in Hong Kong at the end. I have been to Shanghai and Beijing more often than Chicago and New York.

The trip also gives me a good contrast between two Communist superpowers (I am sure Russia's hammer and sickle is everywhere). China is suffocating under an environmental disaster. There is trash everywhere--especially in the countryside and even in Nanjing some rivers run black! How about Russia? I am thinking that I will see less trash and smiles in Russia (the Chinese always seem to be happy). One thing for certain, communists in China that actually believe in communism are hard to find.

[Angus]

Russian Railways: http://eng.rzd.ru/ Travel times from St. Petersburg to Moscow range from 5 hours to 11 hours.

Moscow Metro map: http://www.godzillashostel.com/images/maps/metromap.gif

St. Petersburg Metro map: http://www.petersburg-lodging.com/Petersburg/metro_map.gif

You'll certainly see a lot of signs of the Soviet past, especially in Moscow's metro, where you can't turn around without running into a statue or mosaic or bas-relief depicting some part of Soviet ideology or history.

In my experience people are friendlier in China than in Russia. There were numerous occasions when strangers went out of their way to help me during my travels there. In Russia, not so much.

Russia is cleaner than China in terms of litter, but it's still a problem. China's built environment is in much better condition, however - a lot of Russian buildings don't look too good either inside or outside.

IIRC, parts of Mozhaisk (about 100 km from Moscow) didn't have running water when I was there in 2004.

[von Paulus]

Moscow - St Pete train ride is 9hrs. But it's night trains... Dunno about the website.

City centers in Moscow - St Pete are really clean. However suburbs ain't, lots of trash.

And apart from luxury hotels, don't drink tapwater. (i ain't joking!)

Chinese people are very smiling but you hard to get friends with. Even a chinese friend told me it's not worth spending vacations here!

Russians can be cold at first but then they're so quickly adorable you won't even believe your eyes. That's what made me love this region of the world (besides women!!!)

Metro map is on a google search.

centre of the city in St Pete is "Nevskiy Prospekt" & "Vassilevski ostrov"

centre of the city in Moscow is "okhrotniy ryiad"

i'd also recommend you to go to "VDNKh" orange line station, in moscow, it's a huge place built by Krushchtshev gloryfying communism. (north east of the city). Anyway around the red square is enough stuff to keep you busy for at least 1 day.

if you like propaganda ( ), go on the circular metro line (brown line) and each metro station is richly decorated.

[tooz]

Thanks guys--very helpful!