Adamo Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 Please help! I'm running WinXP with a Geforce 3. I've tried many different drivers with my antivirus disabled but the same thing continues to happen: I play for about 5 - 10 minutes and then the game freezes and I can't even Ctrl-Alt-Del out of it. I've read some stuff about disabling FSAA but the troubleshooting guide sugggested this was for immediate freezing and/or 2D 'text' issues. I've had this game for about 1 month and I love it but I'm getting really frustrated with it. My PBEMs are continually getting messed up because of this problem. If you can suggest a driver that you've used successfully or some other trick, please enlighten me! thanks adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 For GeForce Ti 4600 (AGP 4X) and older (which would include your GeForce 3) we usually suggest the 30.82/30.87 driver. If you play other games, then a newer driver may be more desirable, but it will have a few problems with CM. I'm not sure that the video driver is to blame for your lockups however. Turning off FSAA (which it usually is by default - "Application control...") usually helps with some types of graphical corruption. However it does put more of a load on a videocard too, so turning it off will make less work for a videocard that could possibly be overheating or providing some other hardware reason for the lockups. You may want to check you case for overheating. It could be the CPU or the videocard. Assuming you can get enough ventilation inside, opening the cover and leaving it off for awhile while it is running and see if this helps or not. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamo Posted January 5, 2004 Author Share Posted January 5, 2004 Thanks, Schrull. How can I check the temp of my case? I've heard of some utilities that I can download. adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 You can check it from the BIOS. You get to BIOS by restarting your computer, then hitting maybe del or some other key that it prompts to get to BIOS before it loads Windows (you don't have much time to hit it so keep punching the key all the time). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 As mentioned, your BIOS setup screens will probably show the temperature. The one problem with this method though is that the CPU won't be running as hot as it possible could while running Windows. So temperatures taken here could be a bit misleading. Another thing to try is a monitoring program. These programs can be provided by your motherboard manufacturer (such as ASUS) or you can get third party ones that recognize some generic monitoring ICs. They'll only be as accurate as the ICs and their sensors have been calibrated (which could be 5° C off or more). But it should give you a general idea of your CPU temp. Other things that could overheat include the videocard (for which there are fewer temp monitoring programs available). The airflow around the card or how well the videocard's fan is operating are two things to look for. One program for monitoring (though that isn't its primary purpose) is Sisoft's Sandra; running the CPU module should tell you the current temp. Hardware Info is another utility. And here's a listing of System Monitoring Utilities, one of which should work for you (such as Motherboard Monitor). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamo Posted January 5, 2004 Author Share Posted January 5, 2004 Speaking of case temperatures. Is it normal to be unable to restart a computer after it has been running for awhile because of high case temp? Sometimes if a program freezes up on me and I'm forced to 'pull the plug' almost all the time I am not able to restart immediately because (I've always assumed)that the case temp is too high and must cool down a bit in order to be at an acceptable 'booting up' temperature. Please note, in the past I've run lots of graphically-intensive programs for long periods of time without freeze-ups so I'm not sure if my CMBB freeze-ups are temp related. adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamo Posted January 5, 2004 Author Share Posted January 5, 2004 Thanks for the link, Schrull. I just DL'ed a utility called 'Speedfan'. I'm still trying to figure which temp is which but the 3 temp readings are listed as: Temp3: 81 C Temp2: 75 C Temp1: 65 C Now this is with me just on this webpage with no other app's open. Just antivirus and the basic processes running in the background. CPU usage is very low--- 0.1% . Are these temps high or do they look OK? adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 Not being able to restart immediately after could be a sign of an overheating processor (or motherboard chipset). It could also be a sign of a power supply overheating or some design or limitation with that model. CM is a bit different from other games in that it may push the CPU harder for much longer periods of time than other programs. As unlikely as this may seem, CM usually occupies 80-100% of the CPU cycles during the entire time you're playing CM. The only thing that would be comparable is some of the MPEG/video encoders out there that utilize the CPU to its max during the process. Such heavy and frequent use of the CPU can push it to the point of overheating that many programs may not reach. In this case, possibly taking off the computer's cover may allow for more airflow to cool down the CPU or videocard enough to allow it to operate without problem. If this solves the problem then more or better case fans are needed to move air into and out of the computer case. Also cleaning up the fans for both the CPU and videocard may help (since they can get very dusty, which may affect the cooling potential). Many videocards also have their fans give out on them. Some of them will stop spinning while others may just spin too slowly to do much good. Once the videocard is taxed hard enough (a good 3D game most of the time), then you might start seeing lockups related to the video. [ January 05, 2004, 03:09 PM: Message edited by: Schrullenhaft ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 Those temps look fairly high to me. Again, one thing to be aware of is that these temperature readings may not be that correct (your readings here may be higher than they actually are). You may want to check your BIOS setup to see what temperatures it is monitoring. Some ICs are setup to monitor the CPU, the motherboard's northbridge chipset and possibly other items. I'd guess that the highest temp here is the CPU. One problem with some of these 'generic' monitoring programs is that they'll autodetect your monitoring IC. Sometimes they may get it wrong (which will usually result in no display) or they won't be 'calibrated' like a dedicated piece of software from the motherboard manufacturer (which may 'add or subtract' from the reading depending on what they've tested for with that design). BIOS updates sometimes have these 'calibrations' programmed into them for reading the IC, though I don't know if only the BIOS and monitoring programs from the motherboard manufacturer will show them or if any generic program will read the 'calibrations'. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamo Posted January 5, 2004 Author Share Posted January 5, 2004 Schrull, I just went to BIOS and got a CPU temp of 75 C, and a system temp of 40 C. My thermal shutdown temp is set at 110 C. This reading of 75 C was not after playing CMBB for an extended period of time. I guess I should play it for about 15 minutes and then quickly restart and go to BIOS and take a reading. If the reading is nowhere near 95 - 100 C then my freezing's probably not temp related. By the way, I said this before and I'll say it again. I REALLY appreciate all the help you're giving me. Do you work for Battlefront? thanks a million adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted January 5, 2004 Share Posted January 5, 2004 Which specific P4 do you have and what motherboard is it mounted on ? Are you using an Intel (retail box) heatsink or some other OEM heatsink ? The temperatures you listed seem a bit high. I'm looking through the Intel site for some good info on CPU temps, but it is a bit hard to find. P4s should typically reduce their speed when they start to overheat. This might cause a problem with CM when the 'down clocking' occurs, but I don't really know. Looking through some Intel documentation it appears that 40°C for the ambient (system) temp is the max for P4s 2.8GHz and below. It appears from Table 2 that 78°C is the max for a P4 1.8GHz (423 pin). Anyway, I'm just guessing that overheating is the problem here. Taking off your case cover may help (it would probably reduce the 'system temp'), so if your computer is located conveniently this may be the first thing to try. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamo Posted January 6, 2004 Author Share Posted January 6, 2004 Update! By the way, before I start blabbing, this is an Antec case with AMD 2100XP and Geforce 3 with 512 ram on Gigabyte 7VRXP mobo Opened up case and found lots of dust between heatsink and heatsink fan---possible cause for high temps. I also noticed that I don't feel too much airflow between 2 Antec fans in front of case (blowing in) and 2 Antec fans in back of case (blowing out). The fan speeds listed in BIOS are CPU fan 4821 rpm and System fan 1739 rpm. With all that said, I just played CMBB for about 25 minutes - a miracle in itself. Then I immediately turned off the game and quickly restarted and went to BIOS to check temps and they were just about what they always are - 75 C. Now, granted, I was playing with the case wide open so airflow is much better than it usually is. I am still playing with very recent drivers, version 52.16. What do you make of all that? I know for sure that tomorrow morning I'm going to unscrew that heatsink fan and clean it out. And then I'm going to work on the fans. Do you know if it's possible to increase fan speeds? thanks adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 Generally you can't increase the fan speeds. Sometimes, if you have the electrical knowledge, you can increase the voltage/amperage to a fan it that may cause it to spin faster (or just burn out). A number of fans (especially CPU fans) have speed control circuitry built into them. This allows them to speed up or slow down (to reduce noise) dependent on temperature or some motherboard control (which is usually related to temperature, etc.). Fans can slow down when they start to wear out, though they'll probably register very low RPMs at that point. You may want to check whatever Antec documentation you have about your case fans to see what their operating speed range is supposed to be. The speed of the fan may also be linked to whatever motherboard connection they may be hooked to. Preferably they want to be hooked to a power/monitoring connector that is geared for case fans to control the system/ambient temperature. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamo Posted January 6, 2004 Author Share Posted January 6, 2004 OK, on the cooling front. I removed 'tons' of dust from my heatsink and the intake grills on the case. I was amazed that the fan on the heatsink was even able to keep the cpu from burning up. I"ve been running idle now for about 15 minutes and my cpu temp is around 48 C, much better than the 75 C I was getting the other day. I think what I'm going to do for now is continue running the game with recent drivers and FSAA turned on just to see if the problem was temp related. If I continue to get freeze-ups and my cpu temps are not too high then I'll turn off FSAA and then change drivers--not necessarily in that order. Let's hope, this works. I really want to enjoy this game. Schrull, you are god! I can't explain how much I appreciate what you've done for me. thanks again adam 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 The Intel specifications for max. temperature inside the case and the power ratings for the processors are at: http://support.intel.com/support/processors/pentium4/sb/CS-007999.htm#Table2 AMD doesn't have the info that accessible, but this might help: http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/25175.pdf 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 IIRC, the rule with AthalonXPs is keep it under 80C. Preferred temperature is in the 40s or 50s C. WWB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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