wouldn't the forums be nicer if:

[yapma]

A BF approved buglist was stickied.

A BF approved list of desired improvements was stickied.

It's a fairly common feature of independent game designer websites. I expect because it shows a degree of respect for the customers, and avoids clogging up the boards with "this is broken" type comments.

If these were in place, for instance, I could avoid posting:

1. Why can't my troops see over walls that are half their apparent height? Is this a new bug?

2. Is the right click menu command going to return? Never in my life have I bothered to memorize hot-keys for any software, and I probably won't start now.

[Guest]

I would have said the same thing a few months ago. (Hey, I did!)

Seeing the volume of talk that each bug generates, though, I'd say that separate threads are probably ideal, actually. That way more important stuff stays on top, and BFC isn't held accountable for questionable bug reports. BFC is quite a bit larger than your average indie developer, I'd imagine there'd be hundreds.

At my company we keep a list of bugs that the users can post to, but the users can't see the whole list. We keep our own internal bug list that is deduped and verified. Much cleaner that way.

How good would potential users feel about a patch that only addressed 1/3 of the game's "open" issues, most of which are frankly subject to debate?

[SgtMuhammed]

The single thread idea sounds nice till you have to wade through 200 posts to see if anyone else noticed your FO's throwing their binos at the battalion commander.

[Thomm]

Originally posted by yapma:

1. Why can't my troops see over walls that are half their apparent height? Is this a new bug?

Yes! New bug, confirmed by BFC.

Best regards,

Thomm

[Webwing]

-

You guys don´t know what you are talking about!

I guess I´ll have to explain.

First BF gave us the high wall bug. They let us play with it for a while.

Then they took it away and gave us the short wall bug. They are going to let us play with it for a while.

Later BF will post a poll where we will vote which one we prefer and this will be hard coded forever in the game.

Now, seriously. The short wall bug has been already fixed. Steve mentioned it in another post. It will be released soon in a small patch.

Thank god we don´t have a medium sized wall in the game!

--

[Dirtweasle]

That's good Web.

Even so Yapma's suggestion, echoing the earlier suggestions from many customers would be a big improvement in the forum.

[Dirtweasle]

Originally posted by SgtMuhammed:

The single thread idea sounds nice till you have to wade through 200 posts to see if anyone else noticed your FO's throwing their binos at the battalion commander.

As opposed to filtering through God knows how many individual threads?

[SgtMuhammed]

Six of one, half a dozen of the other I suppose.

['Card]

Why not a bug report sub-forum?

Users could post bug reports, with the provision that moderators could freely and aggressively delete anything that was just a rant or an opinion ("I demand the grass be re-skinned to look grassier!", that sort of thing) or was a duplicate of an existing report.

BFC could then respond to each one with the following:

1. New bug. Hadn't seen that one. Good spot.

2. Aware of that. We're working on it.

3. Unable to repeat or verify this one.

4. That's not a bug. It's a feature, and you're an idiot.

This could potentially achieve several things:

1. If something wasn't just seen, but actually acknowledged as a bug (with a foreseeable solution) by BFC I think people might not feel the need to repeat their complaints endlessly in hopes of being noticed and getting something done.

2. The modern video game consumer knows there are going to be bugs. There are bugs in everything. If people thinking about buying the game could come to this forum and see BFC being responsive and forthright about their bugs, I think it would be a powerful marketing tool.

[yapma]

Originally posted by SgtMuhammed:

The single thread idea sounds nice till you have to wade through 200 posts to see if anyone else noticed your FO's throwing their binos at the battalion commander.

Nah, the stickied bug thread would not work like that. The developer (or a loyal member of its posse) posts its own list of bugs to be squashed, as modified for public consumption. Bugs are crossed off as they are fixed, and added as uncovered (and deemed worthy of correction). You can post to the thread if you want, but only the top post is really noteworthy.

Seems to me like that pretty good, low cost, PR for a disgruntled fan base. As to potential customers who visit the website, there would be many fewer "this or that is broken" threads, and evidence that the developer is committed to supporting its product.

On the other hand, Phillip already posted this idea. Since we don't have such a stickied thread, maybe it's not such a good idea.

[Guest]

Heh. It's a fantastic idea!!!

Seriously, though, my suggestion was more along the lines of what Sgt was thinking. The "keep bugs in top post" thing is definitely more maintainable.

Hmm. I like it. You'd still have the problem of reconciling spotted / actual bugs, plus the volume of reports that BFC sees, but the idea if well implemented could be helpful.

I also like the separate forum for bugs idea, but the one thread (perhaps per patch?) idea could be more doable.

[Battlefront.com]

We've had the current system for 10 years and I don't see any reason to change it. Not perfect, but it works pretty well. The alternatives all require significant energy and oversight, plus such things always spawn threads of their own so I don't see this as actually "fixing" anything. Just makes the status quo more cumbersome IMHO.

Steve

[Guest]

Fair enough, I agree on all points. I think the main issue yapma is going after is transparency, though, which isn't addressed by the current system.

Transparency, of course, can be the most horrible thing in the world when it comes to user bug reports. Where I work we find it cleaner to go without.

[yapma]

Well, the owner has spoken, and the owner disagrees, so that is pretty much that.

I would only say: (1) doesn't the current system require significant energy and oversight (combing through threads and responding) (or not responding, which makes the customer think the developer does not consider their problems important enough), (2) doesn't the current system, which litters the forum with bug reports, give the impression to the public that the software is crap, and (3) doesn't BFC already have a list of bugs (which I can't imagine is a valuable trade secret) which, with some modification, could be posted.

As they say, IMHO.

[Battlefront.com]

Yapma,

The thing is the discussions would still be going on, list or no list, so the perception issue you raise and my own time sifting through them won't change. I doubt customers will refrain from reading and posting to such threads either, so their time won't be reduced either. And these discussions are often critical to understanding either the game as it should work or as it shouldn't be working, so there is reason for these discussions.

As for posting a list of bugs that we've fixed or will fixed goes... I don't see any real benefit of doing that. I sometimes tell people about specific bugs and fixes, so when I think it is important for people to know I do make that information public. However, often times I get peppered with questions about such things and that's sometimes a waste of time since the eventual patch will answer their questions if they would wait for it. But it is natural to want to know more ahead of time, so I don't fault anybody for this. I'm just saying there aren't clear benefits for doing some comprehensive reporting system. Which is why we've never done it and, at least for the near future, don't plan on doing it.

Steve

[dixon_el]

I agree with most of the above. I hope battlefront immediately stops fixing the game bugs, deploys everyone on their team to fixing this blog (for the six to eight months) and only then returns to development of the games, AFTER this huge, incapatitating BUG is FIXED in the forum.

WAIT.... I have the solution!!!!!!!!!

Get Battlefront to stop fixing the game bugs! Then there will be no problem!!!. No fixs, no need to search for them, problem solved. Damn, I'm a genius.....

Gamers are the only people in the world that demand the non problems be fixed before the actual problems.

[Dirtweasle]

Steve, in 1907 IIRC the Chicago Daily News editorialized that the automobile would never supplant the bicycle as the primary vehicle of choice for most Americans.

Fast forward to 1908 and Henry Ford introduces the Model T

Yet, somehow Schwinn made a fortune.

Might be a lesson here.

~~~~~~~

Actually Dixon, many many industries try to anticipate the needs and desires of their customers and head 'em off at the pass. This is very very common in business.

Also, some firms actually create a need that doesn't exist and then solve it for their customers. Think of it as a kind of straw man marketing ploy if you will. One example is the "Big Mac Attack", there are others.

[Dennis50]

So ....Profound.