Combat Mission under Mac OS X

[wildboar]

I have upgraded to Mac OS X and can't get CM to work.

I go through the fase of my computer "emulating" Mac Os 9. starting CM, choosing a scenaryo, but after trying to load graphics y get a freeze.

Is there a cure for this? Or do i simply have to forget OS X and remain in OS 9.2.2

Thanks for helping.

Fred

[Schrullenhaft]

If CM's your main addiction, then I'd suggest simplifying your life and forget OS X for now. Unless you have a penchant for messing around with software or you want to become more familiar with OS X, it will just be a hassle trying to run CM (CMBO & most likely CMBB) in OS X.

Basically you have to remove the 'Classic RAVE' extension that is included by default (and will get restored by OS X to my knowledge too on subsequent reboots) in Classic (OS 9.2.x). With this removed it should be possible to run CM in 'software emulation' which will lack graphical features, resolution options and be slower (generally it will look worse than you've seen it before). Forget trying to run high-res mods in this mode too, though they may work, they may also look completely messed up too.

The best solution, if you want to use OS X, is to have a separate boot partition with 0S 9.2.x on it (and one that isn't your designated Classic folder for OS X). Boot into OS 9 when you want to play CM and reboot into OS X for whatever you want to do there. This should allow you to have hardware RAVE acceleration for CM, which will make everything look 'pretty'.

If you're interested in the opinions of a bunch a people on CM's lack of OS X support you can read about it in this thread. However be aware that most of the complaints and issues are based on supposition and opinion, since there are only so many facts available from Apple about future Macs and OS's.

BTS/BFC haven't come out with an all-encompassing statement about CM and OS X. There will be attempts at getting it to work in some fashion in OS X, but there's a very high likelihood that CMBB will be forced to use software rendering in OS X. An OS X compatible version of CM (a new game, not a re-release of CMBO or CMBB) will be the next project.

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by wildboar:

I have upgraded to Mac OS X and can't get CM to work.

I go through the fase of my computer "emulating" Mac Os 9. starting CM, choosing a scenaryo, but after trying to load graphics y get a freeze.

Is there a cure for this? Or do i simply have to forget OS X and remain in OS 9.2.2

Thanks for helping.

Fred

Wildboar,

As Schrullenhaft says the easiest way is to avoid X and stay in 9.x for now (eventually you will need to move though I suspect).

To do it properly with the existing CM engine (which wont change soon) you need to do the following.

1. You need a plain (straight off the CD) version of 9.2 installed. This will be your "classic" system folder. Call this folder "System Folder"

2. You need another (lets call it "normal") system folder as well. This holds all those extra extensions, fonts, control panels etc, that you have collected over time. This is the one that you will use when running CMBO, CMBB and whatever else. This can be on the same or different hard drive partition as the "classic" system folder. You need to give this a unique name (mine is "Bloated System Folder").

3. You need OS X installed.

Now for the fun part:

1. Assuming you are in OS X use the "Startup Disk" System Preference to identify "Bloated System Folder" and restart. Play CMBO / CMBB to your heart's content.

2. Now you want to go back to OS X so select the "startup disk" control panel and choose the "classic system folder". Restart into this vanilla copy of 9.2.x. Now select startup disk again and choose the OS X system and restart into OS X.

You need the 2nd restart because OS X uses the last system folder for classic and you don't want it to keep trying to install Classic Rave etc onto the one you use for CMBO / CMBB.

Another option could be to use Extension Manager or Conflict Catcher but I find it just as complex.

Slightly off topic but if you copy (not move) your application specific prefences from the normal system folder into the classic system folder you can use your favourite classic applications from within OS X without rekeying serial numbers, etc.

Sorry if its long winded but this has worked fine for me since the OS X public beta and until the CM engine is re-written I think its something you need to get used to.

[ August 09, 2002, 07:58 PM: Message edited by: gibsonm ]

[Schrullenhaft]

Thanks Mark. Good instructions.

I'll get Madmatt to look these over and possibly include in the Tech FAQ (and possibly other materials, if necessary).

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by Schrullenhaft:

Thanks Mark. Good instructions.

I'll get Madmatt to look these over and possibly include in the Tech FAQ (and possibly other materials, if necessary).

No problem - Happy for anyone to use it.

I guess he will have other priorities until late September though.

[sturner]

I have found that if I partition, or have a second hard drive, I can put a "clean" version of OS 9.2.2 on one, and OS X and the Classic OS 9.2 for OS X's use. I don't have any problems then with OS X trying to reinstall the RAVE engine.

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by sturner:

I have found that if I partition, or have a second hard drive, I can put a "clean" version of OS 9.2.2 on one, and OS X and the Classic OS 9.2 for OS X's use. I don't have any problems then with OS X trying to reinstall the RAVE engine.

Yes but I didn't want my notes to get into partitioning etc. If you have one partition you need the 2nd reboot. If you have partitioned then sure you can swap back and forth but the overhead of fully backing up, partioning and restoring the data may be a bit too much for a user who doesn't want to get too involved.

[ August 12, 2002, 06:48 PM: Message edited by: gibsonm ]

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by gibsonm:

...the overhead of fully backing up, partioning and restoring the data may bit a bit too much for a user who doesn't want to too involved.

That's the only thing that has kept me from doing it. Just lazy I guess. I could burn a copy of my hard drive onto a CD and get it done, but I keep putting it off.

Michael

[wildboar]

Thank you all for your help,

I think for the mean time I will play under 9.2.2 and use OSX for other things.

I am afraid of trying to partition and losing data in the process.

I sure hope later versions of CM are OS X compatible.

Again thanks for your advice.

Fred

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by wildboar:

Thank you all for your help,

I think for the mean time I will play under 9.2.2 and use OSX for other things.

Fred

Fred,

If you run into problems, drop me a line (address in profile).

[SteveP]

There is a way to do all this which is simpler than what has been suggested so far, and doesn't require partitioning your hard disk (though partitioning has some advantages). It does require purchasing the latest version of Conflict Catcher. CC has a very useful feature, which detects whether or not you are trying to open OS9 from within OSX (i.e., Classic) or trying to boot OS9 separately. All you have to do is have CC activate a full set of extensions (including Classic Rave) when you are booting OS9. You can have it activate a reduced set of extensions when OSX is starting OS9 as Classic. You still have to go through a reboot to OS9 when you want to play CM, and then reboot back to OSX for other things, but you don't have to reboot twice or have two versions of OS9 on your hard drive. Also, be aware that the booting process when you start Classic can take a few seconds longer for CC to do its job. But it works very well for me.

Cheers,

Steve (Mac fanatic since '84)

[gibsonm]

Originally posted by SteveP:

There is a way to do all this which is simpler than what has been suggested so far, and doesn't require partitioning your hard disk (though partitioning has some advantages). It does require purchasing the latest version of Conflict Catcher. CC has a very useful feature, which detects whether or not you are trying to open OS9 from within OSX (i.e., Classic) or trying to boot OS9 separately. All you have to do is have CC activate a full set of extensions (including Classic Rave) when you are booting OS9. You can have it activate a reduced set of extensions when OSX is starting OS9 as Classic. You still have to go through a reboot to OS9 when you want to play CM, and then reboot back to OSX for other things, but you don't have to reboot twice or have two versions of OS9 on your hard drive. Also, be aware that the booting process when you start Classic can take a few seconds longer for CC to do its job. But it works very well for me.

Cheers,

Steve (Mac fanatic since '84)

Actually I did mention it as an option in my original post.

[SteveP]

Didn't mean to overlook the prior reference to Conflict Catcher. It's just that there's a widespread perception that you need to have two version of OS9 on your hard disk and that (in part because of this) you need to partition your hard disk. This feature in CC is tailor made for just the type of situation that you have with CM.

I also want to fix in error in my previous post. You want to set up CC so that Classic Rave is included when OS9 is being used from within OSX, and keep it from activating when you are booting OS9. My previous post seemed to indicate that it was the other way around. Also you can use CC to have a very lean version of OS9 open when it is being used as Classic -- that saves time when Classic is being opened and also overhead.

[karch]

Great posts everyone. I was wondering if CC could do something like that. I'll be getting a copy. I'll be having CC remove Classic Rave in either 9 or X, since for a quick PBEM return, I'd rather play in software 3D than hardware since I don't always want to spend the time rebooting, but that's just me.

Another note, in the Classic control panel in X, you can specify exactly which OS9 folder to use as Classic. Even if you have multiple 9 folders on the same partition, wouldn't that force X to use the same 9 folder each time, leaving your gaming 9 folder alone even if you just booted from it? Just curious.

[SteveP]

Hi, Karch:

On your question about if OSX would leave your gaming version of OS9 alone: if you are going to use Conflict Catcher, I would recommend that you only have one version of OS9 installed. I think the reason that people often recommend having two versions is because of the limitations of Extensions Manager. Also, CM players worry about the fact that OSX will install/activate Classic Rave whenever it opens OS9 as classic. However, none of that is a problem if you set up Conflict Catcher correctly. CC will activate Classic Rave when OS9 is being used as Classic, and not activate it when you are simply booting OS9 itself.

[27ray]

OK I was reading that there is a new (1.8) classic rave extention included with OS X 10.2, has anyone tried running CM in classic with the update?

-ray

If not I will try in the morning and post my results.

[Schrullenhaft]

I believe that someone in the main forum has already posted that 10.2 still does not support hardware rendering in Classic under OS X. But you're welcome to post any specifics about what you find out personally to this thread.

[karch]

I didn't realize 10.2 had a newer version of RAVE, but it still doesn't work. Software rendering IS better than nothing. For returning PBEM turns and such, it's fine and beats having to reboot if you're only playing 1 turn or so.

I'm actually surprised Apple updated RAVE at all. Maybe it's a good sign that by the time Apple hardware will not boot OS9 (next year?) that ther is a chance that the Classic RAVE extension will advance enough to be able to play Combat Mission. The version is now 1.8. What version of RAVE does OS9 use?

[Schrullenhaft]

I believe that CM requires at minimum RAVE 1.5.4 (?) and that 0S 9.0x - 9.2.2 had RAVE 1.7.

[gibsonm]

The good news is that they are both happy with the Classic Rave 1.8.1 Extension (part of Jaguar Build 6C115).

You can't launch them as "classic" apps from within OS X.2 directly but if you restart (using the same System Folder that Classic uses) they are very happy indeed.

No more 2nd System Folder, Conflict Catcher or Extension Manager work arounds to worry about !!!!!

A 2nd, unexpected, Father's Day present!

[Tim Doerr]

Hi all.

I'm confused by some of this.

I have a Quicksilver G4/733. I've never had any problems booting into 9.2.2 and playing CMBO (or CMBB demo for that matter). I've never had to mess with extensions or have a seperate partition or anything. I just used the 9.2.2 folder that came with the machine.

Now, when I want to play CMBO in Classic mode (OS X.1.5) using the SW rendering, I just launch another Classic Ap first to get the Classic environment up and running. When it's done, I go into the Extensions folder and trash the Classic Rave. I then launch CMBO and have no problem playing in SW mode.

So I don't understand all the steps it sounds like you all are doing to get this to work.

On a related topic, I havn't been able to get the CMBB demo to work in Classic SW mode. It insists on having an 800x600 resolution and apparently the SW mode default is 640x480. I don't know how to change that (or if I even can). Any one have any ideas (for a fairly non-techie)?

Lastly, the Rave 1.8.1 sounds potentially promising for an eventual patch from BTS to get CMBB working in Classic hardware mode. But watching your instructions, it just sounds like you're re-booting into 9.2.2 which is what I've always been doing without any other effort. So I'm wondering if Rave 1.8.1 is really doing anything for you.

Just some thoughts from a fellow Mac guy.

[karch]

I'm trying to get CMBB back running in classic mode, but have the same issue when starting up CMBB without the RAVE extension it forces the computer into 640x480 and then says that the game must run in 800x600.

I tried the switchres extension, but it doesn't seem to run in 10.2. Anyone have any other idea on forcing the computer to stay in 800x600 so we can play it in software mode?

Otherwise, can BFI look into NOT having the program try and downsample back to 640x480?

Love the game, just trying to run it from inside X.

[chrisl]

Originally posted by karch:

I'm trying to get CMBB back running in classic mode, but have the same issue when starting up CMBB without the RAVE extension it forces the computer into 640x480 and then says that the game must run in 800x600.

Love the game, just trying to run it from inside X.

I managed to get it to sort of run inside X by downloading SwitchRes and creating a set that forces the resolution to 800x600 and colors to thousands when CMBB tries to run. This works for CMBO, but for CMBB the textures don't get loaded right, and I get what looks like 16 colors smeared all over the place. I can sort of ID units, but terrain is impossible. If you have a more recent graphics card you may not have this problem.

Still trying to get CMBB to run on a Wallstreet with only 4 MB of VRAM...

[chrisl]

Just a quick note to confirm that I managed to run CMBO inside OSX with 640x480, 800x600, and 1024x768 resolution on a lowly PB G3/300. I used SwitchRes X to force the resolution setting. It seems to work fine in OS X.1; in fact it seems better behaved than the 9.2.2 version.

I launched classic from the Classic system control in "System Preferences" with the "open extensions manager" option selected, and then I disabled Classic Rave. After classic finished launching, I launched CMBO and it ran just fine in the resolution ordered by SwitchRes. Colors should be set to thousands, but it behaved when set to millions, too.

I can get CMBB to launch in this way at 800x600, and 1024x768, as well as get through all the 2D screens just fine, but then gives garbage colors beginning at the "Loading 3D graphics" dialog, and displays the map in garbage colors, too.

SwitchRes is available at www.madrau.com. There are two versions-- one for OS8.x through 9.2.2, and one for OSX. Use the OSX version for OSX, even if you're using it to control resolutions in Classic.

[ September 04, 2002, 01:50 AM: Message edited by: chrisl ]

[gibsonm]

Chrisl,

Just to clarify - you can get CMBO to work but not CMBB?

Also are you running OS X.2 or OS X.1.x?