Defilade and enfilade?

[JunoReactor]

Yes, I am clueless. I can use some advice on what they are, their tactical uses, advantages, disadvantages and AT uses.

[Michael Dorosh]

defilade - protection from incoming fire

enfilade - fire sweeping across a line of troops from end to end (ie from the flank)

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx(line of troops) <-- direction of fire

[Chad Harrison]

Wow, thanks Michael. I had never heard of either of those terms

[PiggDogg]

Guys,

Both "enfilade" & "defilade" come to English from French (probably from William The Conquoror and his Norman followers). Ultimately, the French came from the Roman Latin, but I shall stop here.

Michael,

Your definitions are correct and the way that I understand the definitions. One addition that I understood to defilade is to protect from fire by getting close to the ground and/or by using the low folds in the ground.

Here is the Webster College Dictionary definition of defilade:

"To arrange (fortifications) so as to protect the lines from frontal or enfilading fire and the interior of the works from plunging or reverse fire."

Cheers, Richard

[Michael Dorosh]

I had a general idea (they use the terms a lot in SPR, for example) but pulled the definitions from Oxford just to be sure. I am sure they have many military applications, like the two you mention Richard! Defilade occurs both naturally (dip in ground) and manmade (sandbag wall, etc.)

[Determinant]

Catchphrases - that's what you need:

'Enfilade fire from a Defilade position.'

Here's another goody:

'Good Sister Mary Expecting A Child' (Ground, Situation, Mission, Execution, Administration, Comms)

But my all time favourite mnemonic has to be:

'Grid to Mag Add - Mag to Grid get rid'

Toodle pip!

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by PiggDogg:

One addition that I understood to defilade is to protect from fire by getting close to the ground and/or by using the low folds in the ground.

There is another common usage that you will probably encounter in time. And that is describing the amount of exposure of a tank commander. </font>

• Chin defilade: Only his head is exposed above the hatch combing. TC is squatting in his seat, just barely peeking out in case there is some lead flying around out there. </font>
• Chest or "tits" defilade: Everything above his armpits is exposed. TC kneeling in his seat. This allows him to get his arms out and makes observation through binoculars easier. </font>
• Waist defilade: Everything above his belt is exposed. TC standing in his seat. His normal traveling position. Permits maximum situational awareness, but also exposes him to maximum danger from high speed metal. </font>

Michael

[PiggDogg]

Michael E,

I had not heard of these defilades before, but I am always willing to learn.

Chin defilade would seem to be safer for the dear tank commander. However, if one unlucky hit were to occur to the TC in chin defilade, a persistent and permanent wound would result. Ouch. :eek:

Cheers, Richard

[Michael Emrys]

True, Richard, but think how many wounds that same burst of MG fire would cause if he were caught in waist defilade...not that it would matter much to the deceased, but the crew would have a lot more to clean up.

:eek:

Michael

[tar]

A long time ago, I read an account by a British WWI army officer, in which he said that the experienced officers would always stick their chest and heads above the trenches to observe (at night), rather than just their heads.

This was because the Germans had their machine guns pre-aligned to just clear the top of the British trench. If you just stuck your head up, you would get an almost certainly fatal head wound if shot. On the other hand, if you stood up higher, you could get a more survivable wound.

[dd]

Sorry but thats total rubbish - the rank and file Brits in WWI defined "survivable wound" as:

A british Officer being shot in the head.

[Michael Dorosh]

I should imagine the really good officers used a trench periscope....unless the other officers didn't like them very much?

[Affentitten]

Originally posted by Michael Dorosh:

defilade - protection from incoming fire

enfilade - fire sweeping across a line of troops from end to end (ie from the flank)

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx(line of troops) <-- direction of fire

Wow. Hats off to that effective graphical presentation of enfilading fire using only ASCII characters! Kudos!

And as for chin defilade on tank commanders, how risky is that for their dental work coming into massive contact with the hatch rim as the vehicle lurches over the terrain? Or does that count as a survivable wound?

[Michael Emrys]

Originally posted by Affentitten:

And as for chin defilade on tank commanders, how risky is that for their dental work coming into massive contact with the hatch rim as the vehicle lurches over the terrain? Or does that count as a survivable wound?

While I am sure that could be a potential problem, it doesn't seem to have happened a lot. My guess is that when riding in that position, they had their hands on the hatch combing to steady themselves. Also, I doubt that they were rocketing around the countryside while in that position, but were instead moving fairly cautiously.

Michael

[ October 08, 2002, 01:41 AM: Message edited by: Michael emrys ]

[CMplayer]

Originally posted by tar:

A long time ago, I read an account by a British WWI army officer, in which he said that the experienced officers would always stick their chest and heads above the trenches to observe (at night), rather than just their heads.

Was that Robert Graves' Goodbye to all that?