Robohn Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 Playing on Flat Clear Terrain in Early 1944 how can American forces stop the dreaded Tiger and Panther Tanks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 Don't play on flat and clear!! lol - in "Early 44" (I presume you mean early after D-Day??) the terrain shuold be quite close and strewn with cover. the other useful things against them are 17 pdrs, 14" naval guns and aeroplanes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robohn Posted August 5, 2002 Author Share Posted August 5, 2002 My friend and I play on randomly arranged battlefields. I've got some planes, but they have yet to actually do anything. In fact, I've never seen planes do anything in a year of combat mission. I keep hoping though. I have the 76mm M10 and AT guns...but they aren't penetrating. Robohn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 Can you try to split up and outflank them? That's all I got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 There's one other thing I forgot - infantry - lots and lots of infantry. Especially with PIATs and Bazookas, demo charges and Gammon Bombs. Tanks have limited HE ammo, poor visibility are individually expensive and can only engage 1 target at a time. Oh - and play smaller games too - a Panther becomes less inviting when he's only got 500 pts to spend. And Stuarts and Greyhounds and Daimlers - their 37's & 2 pdrs can penetrate the side of Panthers and they're fast little buggers - just be sure to try not to get them shot at! Planes - well I see planes a lot. I saw one yesterday - it managed to miss a Mk-IV by about 2 yards & the crew actualy didn't abandon the tank, much to my surprise!! But planes need daylight. So they won't arrive at dusk or dawn or night. Or in rain or fog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robohn Posted August 5, 2002 Author Share Posted August 5, 2002 I actually hadn't considered taking lots of infantry. I guess I didn't want to see that many casualties! It could work though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 Smoke can sometimes help you maneuver to get a flanking shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 A swarm of vanilla Shermans can and will overwhelm them easily. Just move FAST into flanking positions. The Shermans will score several hits on the move, while any Tiger will have trouble following any one target. Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 What kind of Allied tanks, exacty, and do you have roads? Flanking is only going to work when you either have roads to move on, or tanks with good suspension (Cromwell, Sherman HVSS). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt. Wecker Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 If sherman is defending (attacking) against german PzIV or V, it will probably loose. At least at head to head fight. 4 of my shermans were destroyed like that, 2 of them with first shot. All of them only by one PzIV. When shermans grenades hit the Panzer, only "no serious damage message" message appears. But than a bazooka team with only one team meamber allive destroyed that tank-side shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted August 5, 2002 Share Posted August 5, 2002 Hmmm, by flat, do you mean to say utterly flay like a pool table? In CM auto-made QB maps that are "flat" have some dips and small hills. Combine this with LOS blocking terrain and you can usually find a way to manuever into postion to make a flank shot. Also, consider buttoning up the enemy tank by eitther sniper fire, arty fire or both. You cannot, without getting very very lucky defeat a Panther or Tiger head-on. You have to hit from the side. Another thing to consider is the Heavy Tank denying you the ability to win, or just distracitng you from winning? What I am getting at is at times I have been to eager too go on a "Kitty" hunt, and get myself into some trouble. Beware the opponent showing off his heavy armor! A good oppoenent will have a little suprose for you on the way to making a flank shot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frunze Posted August 6, 2002 Share Posted August 6, 2002 Smoke. Lots of smoke. If you have an artillery spotter, consider dropping smoke right on the enemy tank, letting you get up close, and most importantly, come at them from several sides at once. Uses up your arty, though (hopefully just cheap 81mm). If facing multiple tanks, smoking some will let you take on part of the enemy's force with only part of yours. Ditto what other people said about using every dip and little hill, together with every patch of trees and little building, to maneuver around them and get flank shots. Smoke can help with this too - cover that gap of open terrain you gotta cross. Tank smoke's good for that. Also ditto on infantry and 'zooks - make 'em button up, distract them, even kill 'em if you can get close. Smoke can help infantry approach too. Timing - making all my tanks come into LOS of the enemy at the same time - is what I have trouble with.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted August 6, 2002 Share Posted August 6, 2002 This discussion is totally useless without more specific info about tanks involved, road availablity and ground conditions. But it seems the original question came from a write-only poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robohn Posted August 6, 2002 Author Share Posted August 6, 2002 The only road on the map splits it evenly between the allied and axis sides. My seven vanilla Shermans have all been knocked out, but last turn I knocked 3 of his panthers out. The M10 TDs and a 57mm AT gun finally got some side aspect shots in. All the advice given has been great, and much of it I had already put into use(smoke and buttoning him with arty). The question is meant to be very generic for QB maps that use "Flat" "Clear" and "Rural" for parameters. I appreciate the tactical ideas, they will be very helpful in mauling my "Cat Lover" friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freaky ol'man w/very long wings Posted August 6, 2002 Share Posted August 6, 2002 Hi all, I would like to introduce yet another category "The read & then write only" poster. I've read somewhere that to kill a panther you have to be as cunning as the panther itself. The panther when it hunts never exposes itself to the prey for it only knows how terrifying its presence can be. Instead, it "seduces" it's prey to came to him by spraying aromatic odours from its body. For killing the tiger, the only thing I could think of, would be one picture I once saw of a Hindu erotic Painting. In the picture, the Hindu Prince shoots arrows from his bow, at tigers and gazelles, while mounting his concubine. That particular picture is flat and clear in the subject. In other words, maybe you should manouver in the flanks. If you got Shermans, those are inf-support tanks,ie., they would only support the guys with "zooks" and are not match against P's & T's in frontal engagement. If you got an M10 T-D, that's your lucky day. Still, remember, the flanks! Panthers and Tigers, it had been said, were found weaker on their side armour. M10's, in the other hand, are very menacing-looking, huge mothers, for what I had seen in photos. This I have seen, read somewhere. A book? A thread!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soddball Posted August 6, 2002 Share Posted August 6, 2002 Don't play Americans. Just use a Sherman Firefly. Play as Poles or Brits, take a pair of Fireflies, and show him the meaning of suffering. Nothing punctures the ego of a big cat lover more quickly than watching you drill three of his Tigers at 2km range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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