Frenchy Posted February 27, 2002 Share Posted February 27, 2002 I have been experimenting with this have found a way to portray trenches using the 2.5m height in the editor. If you don't mind the scale it works like this... Using dirt roads, lay out how you want your trench line to look. Then within the elevation area - change the dirt roads to 3 levels lower than the adjacent terrain. This creates a slope that is fairly steep and slows movement for troops. By placing men in position just close to the top in a defensive posture, with foxholes, you have yourself a makeshift trench line. I haven't experimented with vehicles and how they are affected but will do so at a later point. Before I progress much further has anyone else tried this? I know it looks funky but it's something...at least it allows cover from direct fire if you stay on the slopes. I have a feeling if you stay on the road and come under arty fire, the guys will bolt because of the "openness" of the road terrain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted February 27, 2002 Share Posted February 27, 2002 Great idea. The road helps visuals, but hurts play value. How about trying rough, which does give cover, will stop vehicles, and have generally better in-game effects. Also, 3 levels down would be 15', definitely a deep trench. WWB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronChef4 Posted February 27, 2002 Share Posted February 27, 2002 Whoa. . .thats definetly a deep trench Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Johnson-- Posted February 27, 2002 Share Posted February 27, 2002 I found that 2 levels down looked allright. Rough works pretty good for me. Also you can put a hedge or stone wall at the top of the trench, to give those soldiers a little more cover. I've got one or 2 WW1 scenarios, but it might be time to add some trenches to my eastern front scenarios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymore Posted February 27, 2002 Share Posted February 27, 2002 You should also be aware that your men will not receive any terrain masking protection from HE while occupying such a construct. (i.e. not equivalent to crater/trench) Blast damage from nearby HE depends upon the radial distance from the impact point to the target. Intervening high ground will not lessen the effect of the blast. Cheers [ February 27, 2002, 11:50 AM: Message edited by: Claymore ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted February 27, 2002 Author Share Posted February 27, 2002 Using rough terrain is an excellent idea. Reducing the depth is a good one also. I'll cook up a test map and see what I can do. Claymore - you are correct. Like I said in my first post it's a makeshift trench. It'll add a little color to the map. We'll have to wait for CM:BB to get the "real" ones! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 Originally posted by wwb_99: Great idea. The road helps visuals, but hurts play value. How about trying rough, which does give cover, will stop vehicles, and have generally better in-game effects. Also, 3 levels down would be 15', definitely a deep trench. WWBCoul'dnt tanks drive right over trenches? Well the Trench size you seem to be modeling anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 For the base of the trench itself, you can use a road lined with woods. That gives a type of cover that men will not rout out of, and also allows fast movement along the trench bottom, which rough doesn't. Foxholes can be made in the woods portion and give good cover, like dugouts at various spots along the base of the trench. Then put rough not on the tiles representing the trench bottom, but beside that - which is the place the men need to be to see out. That winds up giving 25% cover for men "on the firing step". It also makes the trench an obstacle to vehicle movement. Naturally you can also put barbed wire placed 50 yards of so ahead of the trenchline, to keep enemies out of grenade range until they cross the wire. You can use the ground beyond the rough tiles (behind), or breaks in the chains of rough, as sites for MG bunkers to represent firing dugouts. For the depth of the trench, you can use 1 level or 2. 1 level down still works in the sense of breaking LOS at the bottom and allowing it farther up the slope sides, but is a bit "bumpy", the side slopes are shallow, and it is a bit easy to see into from higher elevations. 2 levels is deeper than a trench actually was, of course, but it may work better in game terms, because it gets the steepness more nearly correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted February 28, 2002 Author Share Posted February 28, 2002 Working on it - hope to have a pic posted this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfamily33 Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 This all sounds interesting. Can you guys start posting pics of the various choices: Wood/Road; Rough; Rough/Wall; etc. Just when I thought I was done playing Frontovik for awhile you had to go an model trenches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 I used the walls too for extra cover,maybe its a good idea if some of the modders can change the walls into sandbags this looks better I think Oh and BFamily many thanks for letting us use your frontovik mods for our blukrainian forces!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted February 28, 2002 Author Share Posted February 28, 2002 What's the BMP# for the wall graphic? Sandbags sounds interesting. I will post pics over the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted February 28, 2002 Share Posted February 28, 2002 bmp for the wall is 1208 since I use XP its much easier to find the bmp you want you get pictures of all the bmps when you open the map. thats handy,just scroll down for the bmp you want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted February 28, 2002 Author Share Posted February 28, 2002 Thanks, Stoffel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted March 2, 2002 Author Share Posted March 2, 2002 I have a couple of pics up, only temporary. One simulates trenches using roads, the other using rough terrain. I tried modding the wall to represent sandbags but have quickly come to the conclusion that an artist I am not! I will keep the pics up for a week or two then will remove them. These are rough and perhaps will motivate map designers to give it a whirl. I prefer the rough and will tweak the appearance.. Ideas welcome as always Trench using road Trench using rough [ March 01, 2002, 10:09 PM: Message edited by: Frenchy ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfamily33 Posted March 2, 2002 Share Posted March 2, 2002 Frenchy: I like your idea. I tried using the rough terrain bitmap but applied the dirt road texture to the bitmap. The result is a more dirt looking trench that acts like rough terrain (cover and bars vehicles). I also applied the rough terrain three tiles wide when generating the map. Unfortunately, that's probably too wide to be realistic. I'll try posting a pic but my hosting service usually doesn't work: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchy Posted March 2, 2002 Author Share Posted March 2, 2002 Bfamily: Pic looks good, - yes due to the scale any make shift trench will look to big. I guess the next step is design a test scenario and see how the battle goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow 1st Hussars Posted March 2, 2002 Share Posted March 2, 2002 can someone e-mail or post here the link to the frontovik mod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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