Vadr Posted June 4, 2002 Share Posted June 4, 2002 Is this a bug, or some subtle matter of physics I don't understand? I'm helping a friend playtest an operation. He has two wooden pillbox MGs, I have 4 Chaffee tanks. At 700 meters and slightly less, my Chaffees (75mm, 619m/s main gun) have a kill chance of 'None' against these wooden pillboxes. Issat right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sebastian Posted June 4, 2002 Share Posted June 4, 2002 i had 'none' chance with a daimler against a wooden pill box. bur after 3-4 penetrations they abondoned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaba Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 In the same respect -- I have had a Sherman 105 have an "excelent" chance to take out a concrete bunker from the side -- no such luck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMsoldier Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 i have noticed similar things, once i get a chance i am going to test and post what i come up with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMsoldier Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 Originally posted by Yaba: In the same respect -- I have had a Sherman 105 have an "excelent" chance to take out a concrete bunker from the side -- no such luck...i just tested 105mm at 700m shooting wooden bungers. The 105mm Self Propelled Gun knocked out the Bunker in 1 hit. kill:good Then i tested the SHerman 105mm, kill:rare, first of all, at that range it would rarly hit, and if it did it wouldnt kill. The reason being that it is an infantry gun and has very limited Anti tank/bunker capabilities, though it should have still knocked out the wooden bunker i think, With the 75mm, kill:Rare, it took 3 hits to knock it out. Same with 76mm. These small tests may or maynot prove anything, just my observation. [ June 04, 2002, 08:02 PM: Message edited by: CMsoldier ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 You can knock out a wooden bunker with a Sherman, so I imagine the little Chafeee ought to do it too. Can take several shots but it is possible based on my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjelinek Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 1 or 2 turns of firing will knock it out. The hit and chance percentages usually turn out to be better than stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMsoldier Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 I am playing a game where i have 4 M4 Shermans, and they all for hit the pillbox at the same time from 500m away and did not even penetrate, kill chance was None Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epée Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 Right from the days of Valley of Thunder it was well proven that Shermans can take out wooden and concrete pillboxes. You just need a shot in the slit. Chr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vadr Posted June 5, 2002 Author Share Posted June 5, 2002 Yeah, OK, I understand that the bunker *can* be killed by the 75mm. I killed one in our first run through the op. But my question is: Why kill chance "None"? I tell the Chaffee to shoot at the pillbox, but he thinks he can't kill it and so he throws smoke at it (doh). The same Chaffee can kill a Sturmgeschutz at 700 meters, with kill chances like "OK" and "Good", but a wooden bunker gets "None"? I'm not really complaining, I'd just like to know if there's a reason for it. As many of you have pointed out, the gun will usually kill the bunker anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 I've suspected a bug about kill chances for a long time. I routinely fire at things when the kill chance is given as very low and assume it's really better than stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 Hello, Could this be related to identification? The tank doesn't know which kind of bunker it has in front, so he just assumes it's the most dangerous one (concrete AT) and drops some smoke. Just a possibility. Sig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 I don't think it's a "bug" it should be an artifact of fog of war The kill chance is really only and estimate and doesn't really tell you all the much anyway and it should not tell you much your units see the opposing unit (whatever it is) and if you don't tell them to fire at it "maybe" the Tac AI will regardless of the "kill chance" Maybe its just part of the Fog of War to confuse you! Looks like its working in this case -tom w [ June 05, 2002, 09:46 AM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ligur Posted June 5, 2002 Share Posted June 5, 2002 I recently playd Blood & Steel, an armored battle with around 100 units on both sides and it appeared the kill chance was changing as the units indentified the targets. It was amusing to follow. I had Sherman Jumbos firing at JagdpzIVs from 700 meters and the kill chance was listed "good" or sometimes "low" when, in fact, it was "none" due to the 75mm gun and the positioning and armor slope of the jgpzIVs. My Jumbos just didn't know what they were, just SP guns. Against a Marder II the kill chance would be have been indeed "good." I ended up with 15 ricochets on frontal superstrucutures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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