Nippy Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 Newbie question I've been wondering for some time: Just how many HMG's are too many? What amount is realistic? If defending, why even bother with infantry at all*, just load up on MG-42s/Maxins and watch the bodies pile up. P.S. What's the deal with Flak Guns? Everyone seems to gripe about them all the time. *Yes I realise this is very cheap and would never do such a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNoobie Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 i just finished a QB defending a town with the Germans...and i had like 6 HMG's...you can hold em of for awhile but then once the Rooskies got close the HMG had too many to target...i was overrun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nippy Posted October 6, 2002 Author Share Posted October 6, 2002 I just finished up a QB using the afore mentioned "Gamieness"...is wasn't pretty. Sept 1942 Russian Assault Small map with Modest Hills and Moderate tree cover 1000 points Soviet Forces restriced to Infantry only. 25 turns I purchased 23 MG-42s...nothing more. No trenches, no nothing! Here is the result of my click-fest. German Results Troops Okay 138 (All) Causalties 0 KIA 0 Soviet Results Troops Okay 361 Caualties 194 KIA 39 Final result - Total German victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 Nippy wrote: If defending, why even bother with infantry at all*, just load up on MG-42s/Maxins and watch the bodies pile up. Are you talking about playing the AI, or another human. If playing the AI, then the answer is because you want to challenge yourself and have fun playing a balanced game that is more near to historical accuracy. If playing another human, because you are going to actually talk to your opponent first, and probably find out they want to play in a reasonably historical manner along with other agreements which keep play balanced. Otherwise, why bother playing CM. Nippy wrote again: I just finished up a QB using the afore mentioned "Gamieness"...is wasn't pretty. Don't understand the point, or the assertion that CM was somehow gamey. The gamieness was in choosing two dozen MG's, you can have the same effect in choosing a dozen JSII's or something. [ October 06, 2002, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: Bruno Weiss ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterk Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 Did the Russians have any mortars or artillery at all? If not, it's not that surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mud Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 If your opponent brings along decent HE/arty support, or armored vehicles that an MG42 won't hurt (given that your test was rigged with aforeknowledge of 'infantry only') you'll probably want some infantry that can hoof it for longer distances without getting tired, and that doesn't lose ammo if taking losses while on the move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParaBellum Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 Nippy, what do you want to prove with this setup? That MGs are deadly against infantry? Well, they are. An all infantry force against massed MGs? Guess why tanks were invented. I think nobody will doubt that HMGs on the defense are of great value, especially when you have clear fields of fire. But there are quite some disadvantages of HMGs compared to infantry squads. 1.) It's difficult to move your HMG teams during battle since they tire very quickly when moving fast and thus are rather limited in their mobility, especially when you have to react quickly. 2.) HMGs are quite vulnerable to close combat. If enemy infantry closes on your HMGs they will usually wipe the HMG team out. 3.) HMGs (except the heavy ones, .50cal...) have no AT capability and won't be able to lob an AT mine or a Molotov cocktail on a nearby tank, making them dependand on AT guns/teams. We all know the AI isn't very good when attacking, so the results are not very surprising. You could have achieved the same results buying only 81/120mm spotters and some TRPs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrNoobie Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 I just finished up a QB using the afore mentioned "Gamieness"...is wasn't pretty. Sept 1942 Russian Assault Small map with Modest Hills and Moderate tree cover 1000 points Soviet Forces restriced to Infantry only. 25 turns I purchased 23 MG-42s...nothing more. No trenches, no nothing! Here is the result of my click-fest. German Results Troops Okay 138 (All) Causalties 0 KIA 0 Soviet Results Troops Okay 361 Caualties 194 KIA 39 Final result - Total German victoryuh...if you put it that way what did you expect? do you have CMBO? compare that with their weak ass HMG..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 Regular troops can overrun HMGs just fine if those aren't properly supported. Just had that in a Quickbattle when my HMG had a vehicle buddy and the vehicle syndrome kicked in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruceov Posted October 6, 2002 Share Posted October 6, 2002 Use smoke on the machine gunners then Human wave assault, take em right out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russellmz Posted October 7, 2002 Share Posted October 7, 2002 Originally posted by Nippy: P.S. What's the deal with Flak Guns? Everyone seems to gripe about them all the time. imagine this: you are starting a nice game of cmbo against someone. they stock up on a couple 20mm's. you bought some shermans and due to your placement, are subject to the fire of ONE 20mm that proceeds to immobilize one and gun damage a second. later on in the game you send some guys into a tall light building. another 20mm opens up and brings down the building in ONE turn before you can get your guys out with a withdrawl command. fun and realistic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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