Ryan Crierie Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 I've read up on the current über-Finn thread on Winter warfare, and I have to say this: CLOTHING IS THE KEY! THE KEY! Try fighting in the snow in a pair of Hawaiian shorts! I've thought on and expanded my idea. There should be a new variable available at the quick battle/scenario edit screen in CM3, "TEMPERATURE" (Drop down menu) -40 C to -20 C -20 C to 0 C 0 C to 20 C 20 C to 40 C 40 C to 60 C Basically, extreme cold and extreme temperatures act as a modifier to EVERY unit's health and fatigue rate, PERIOD. Even bundled up tightly, -30 Celsius isn't like walking around at 40 Celsius. To counter these modifiers, units can be equipped with clothes, from another drop down menu: CLOTHING: Level 1 Level 2 Level 3 Level 1 clothing is basically the typical summer uniform for the Wehrmacht and Russians, and allows you to represent a newly-arrived Wehrmacht formation on the Ostfront during the 41/42 winter, or a Red Army formation that was hastily formed and doesn't have adequate clothing, or guns, or ammo, or whatever. Level 2 is typical of a Wehrmacht formation that has been around long enough in the cold to have learned how to handle the cold, and has stolen clothing from the civilian population. Level 3 is the typical Russian Winter Uniform, along with a few Luftwaffe units who were equipped with PROPER winter clothing at the start of Barbarossa, and for the Wehrmacht after 1942, when they had begun shipping purpose made winter uniforms to the front. Each level of clothing decreases temperature modifiers, with the Level 1 equipped units getting screwed during the winter, while Level 3 people are hampered somewhat by the weather, but not as bad as Lvl. 1 or 2. Whaddya think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevilDog Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 Good idea! I second the suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 If I'm not mistaken, temperature will be modeled in CMBB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 If you extended your clothing range, slightly by adding a level 0, then you'd be able to represent light-weight tropical/desert uniforms and clothing. This would allow it to be able to better model the Western Desert. I'll be much more interested to see how it handles summer effects, rather than winter ones. Heat haze occurs even on the steppes and will seriously effect visibility. In the desert, it will make life very miserable for those people who believe an 88mm should be able to pick opponents off at over 500 metres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 I like it. It is simple, it is realistic, it is tied to something tangible instead of dubious national characteristics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 I agree this is not a bad suggestion, and is vastly superior to any "national modifier" requests. But we are not going to implement something like this. Instead, as someone else suggested, the Fitness level can be adjusted. Anybody who has been out in the cold without the correct clothing knows that judgement, reflexes, willingness to do much of anything, etc. is all reduced. And if you aren't in great shape to begin with (fed well, not suffering from prolonged exposure, etc.) it is even worse. Changing the Fitness rating for one side or the other will simulate better/worse troop condition, be it because of freezing, soaking, hunger, sweating, etc. Today I was standing around outside with nothing but semi-insulated boots, light wool pants (1940s vintage Swedish Army to be exact ), light shirt, light coat, lined hat, no gloves, and nothing on my face or neck. This reminded me that I didn't want to continue doing it for long since it was 0 F (that's what, -15 C?). I like the cold. I'm used to the cold. But unless I am moving around, or dressed much better, it isn't all that fun for more than 10-20 minutes. As for claims of people being more adept to cold or not, I think it is a bunch of bunk. I know plenty of people that have grown up here all their lives and are the biggest babies when the temp drops below freezing. Yet my wife, who had hardly even been outside in sub freezing temps in her entire life, had no problem taking a pee at -28 F in the wind at night. Sure, we could have chosen a better weekend to go winter camping, but she did not complain one bit Point is that dealing with cold is not a national trait, rather something that is different for each person and changes with experience/exposure. I'm sure that if some simulation was being made about winter camping that the same people asking for national modifiers would suggest women from temperate climates should be inferior to men from cold climates. I'm here to say that is pure bunk Steve [ February 13, 2002, 12:40 AM: Message edited by: Big Time Software ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffsmith Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 Originally posted by Big Time Software: she did not complain one bit StevePlease Steve if DNA Farming ever becomes legal make sure your Sainted wife is among the candidates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thermopylae Posted February 13, 2002 Share Posted February 13, 2002 60 C? That'd be hellish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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