PeterX Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 1- The depiction of three man squads. I was never one of those who lobbied for the graphical representation of every single soldier. I think it would detract from the efficiency and elegance of the system, as is. However, I don't understand why there's not a graphic for, say, every third soldier. IOW, a 6 man Company HQ would show a two soldier graphic. Ditto with tank crews, MG teams, etc. It would increase the unit population on the map and add, I sense, to the immersion factor w/o overburdering average PCs. Also, the player would benefit from a better visual 'feel' for the size of his kampfgruppe. I suppose BFC wanted to distinguish the Infantry squads from the rest of the supporting cast, but there could be strictures about splitting any but designated units. 2- Entering buildings City fighting is necessarily heavily abstracted in CM and, overall, works pretty well. One thing that I often find strange is the nonchalant ease with which units enter buildings. There's only a barely perceptible delay, even in enemy controlled towns. This stretches credulity, IMO. A house doesn't provide an entrance on every facing and, one presumes, windows would have to be smashed, doors kicked in, and tenants brushed aside and sequestered. Anyone for variable time delays in this situation? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Znarf Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 I don't mind the three man representation, but I would like to see a body drop every time there is a wounded/killed soldier. It would help identify areas with very lethal fields of fire..... and would look cool. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AstroCat Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Well I would much rather have the 1 for 1 representation. They could all move together and then when stopping fan out a little but stay in the same general area. I also would like 1 for 1 wounded/killed soldiers. I think this would be the best and "coolest" looking for both situations. But...hey, that's just what I think would be best. Jordan "AstroCat" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Originally posted by Znarf: I don't mind the three man representation, but I would like to see a body drop every time there is a wounded/killed soldier. It would help identify areas with very lethal fields of fire..... and would look cool. Bear in mind that casualties in CM represent wounded men far more often than dead or incapacitated men; there would thus not be a dead body on the ground for about 2/3 of the casualties you suffer. What you are asking for would be an unrealistic way of tracking enemy weapons performance. Wounded men are evacuated and disappear from the game - rightly so. [ January 02, 2004, 02:09 PM: Message edited by: Michael Dorosh ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Originally posted by PeterX: 1- The depiction of three man squads. I was never one of those who lobbied for the graphical representation of every single soldier. I think it would detract from the efficiency and elegance of the system, as is. However, I don't understand why there's not a graphic for, say, every third soldier. IOW, a 6 man Company HQ would show a two soldier graphic. Ditto with tank crews, MG teams, etc. It would increase the unit population on the map and add, I sense, to the immersion factor w/o overburdering average PCs. Also, the player would benefit from a better visual 'feel' for the size of his kampfgruppe. I suppose BFC wanted to distinguish the Infantry squads from the rest of the supporting cast, but there could be strictures about splitting any but designated units. Note also the two man truck crews represented with two men; til they bail out and become 1 man. Never understood that one, either. Or the 5 man tank crew that becomes 1 man. I do like the idea of a strict 1:3 ratio; you can spot the bigger full-strength US squads easier that way, too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Znarf Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Bear in mind that casualties in CM represent wounded men far more often than dead or incapacitated men; there would thus not be a dead body on the ground for about 2/3 of the casualties you suffer. What you are asking for would be an unrealistic way of tracking enemy weapons performance. Wounded men are evacuated and disappear from the game - rightly so. ------- Good point. Perhaps the engine could be modified to determine whether the soldier is KIA or wounded at the time the soldier is hit. Wounded may then not be represented as a downed soldier, or perhaps represented for a round or two and then removed to simulate evacuation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Originally posted by Znarf: Bear in mind that casualties in CM represent wounded men far more often than dead or incapacitated men; there would thus not be a dead body on the ground for about 2/3 of the casualties you suffer. What you are asking for would be an unrealistic way of tracking enemy weapons performance. Wounded men are evacuated and disappear from the game - rightly so. ------- Good point. Perhaps the engine could be modified to determine whether the soldier is KIA or wounded at the time the soldier is hit. Wounded may then not be represented as a downed soldier, or perhaps represented for a round or two and then removed to simulate evacuation. Interesting, but what effect would this have on gameplay? To be honest, I see no practical benefits to this other than a "would be cool to see" kind of deal, unless I'm missing something? :confused: On the contrary, wounded men on board who can do nothing but bleed or lay unconscious would seem to me to be just more unnecessary clutter, especially if they are not really doing anything. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Znarf Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Interesting, but what effect would this have on gameplay? To be honest, I see no practical benefits to this other than a "would be cool to see" kind of deal, unless I'm missing something? ----- Don't know if the game models proximity of dead soldiers to live soldiers to determine morale... but I imagine if one gave the order to a squad of 12 soldiers to advance over a field littered with 60 dead or wounded fellow soldiers, the morale of the dozen unlucky soldiers would be adversely affected. Besides, did I mention it would be cool to see, especially with all those burning tank hulls? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumrox Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 With EFOW, I think the 3 man squad representation is kept around far too long as the enemy squad takes casualties. Even if you haven't fully identified the unit type, you should have an idea on approximately how many soldiers there are. When a squad breaks and runs for it, if you haven't fully identified the unit, you don't know if it's 12 guys or 1 running away and you don't know whether to waste time/ammo pursuing him (or them). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Carr Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Everything infantry related is heavily abstracted in CM. Armor seems to be a little more one to one. Hopefully CMX2 will alleviate some of this infantry related abstraction. If infantry ever gets to the one to one level that armor is at in the game, it will require some more processing horsepower to play. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGSF Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Originally posted by dumrox: Even if you haven't fully identified the unit type, you should have an idea on approximately how many soldiers there are. When a squad breaks and runs for it, if you haven't fully identified the unit, you don't know if it's 12 guys or 1 running away and you don't know whether to waste time/ammo pursuing him (or them). The 3 man reduces to 2 man then 1 man as the squad takes casualties. You can also see the squad "flinch" when one of the members is "hit". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumrox Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Originally posted by OGSF: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by dumrox: Even if you haven't fully identified the unit type, you should have an idea on approximately how many soldiers there are. When a squad breaks and runs for it, if you haven't fully identified the unit, you don't know if it's 12 guys or 1 running away and you don't know whether to waste time/ammo pursuing him (or them). The 3 man reduces to 2 man then 1 man as the squad takes casualties. You can also see the squad "flinch" when one of the members is "hit". </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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