How to protect your Pz IV's ( aka tin cans )

[Rob Murray]

I've found a good way to protect your PZ IV's ( or as I call them "tin cans" - vulnerable to practically everything !! ). Screen them with Pz III's. Just played a QB & I knocked out 12 Grants with no losses on my side. I moved the Pz IV's ( F2's ) up behind my Pz IIIL's. Everytime one of my 2 "tin cans" was targeted I ordered it to shoot & scoot back to a safe distance & let the IIIL's take the brunt of the fire.

[CombinedArms]

How does this tactic avoid making pincushions out of the PzIIILs? Grants and Shermans can generally KO any PzIII and the PzIII has trouble striking back. So I'm surprised you escaped with no tank loses in this situation.

[Joachim]

Maybe PzIII on a steep crest might work... or at extreme ranges... or with flank shots at long ranges.

The trick does work in CMBB vs T34 & KV1

[Slappy]

Depends. I'm not an expert on my III lettering, but some of the later ones have 80mm armor. Actually, I'll take the 80mm III with the 50mm Long gun over any of the IVs. That way I don't need to worry about protecting them at all.

[Bergerbitz]

Now I forget...

Would the AI target nearest threat, the most potent threat or a combination of the two? If I were targetting manually, I would ignore the screen of the Pz III's and pot shot the Pz IV's, backing up as necessary to keep a flanking move at bay.

I'll have to do some experimenting in CMBB. I have a scenario in which four T-34/76's take on two Tiger I's. Speed and maneuvering is what wins it for the Soviets. It's good practice for coordinating Shoot n' Scoot setups. In that scenario, the Tigers take the most convenient (in terms of barrel positioning) and/or closest target. I might mix it up with some lighter Soviet tanks to see what gets targetted first.

[FM Paul Heinrik]

Hi,

I'm new to the CM games and I'm currently playing Beyond Overlord. My problem is that every tank seems to be a "tin can". Shouldn't Tigers whoop on M4s?

There doesn't seem to be a problem offensively but the problems seem to lie in shot placement and armor values. To me it doesn't seem to be much difference if an M4 shoots at the Tiger's glaci plate or at the rear deck it seems to get "knocked out" regardless, after 1 or 2 "hits".

The only way that armor survives the scenerio is if tank crews are bad shots and simply miss a lot.

I thought that 1 Tiger should be able to take on 5 Shermans and it would be considered fair game. At certain ranges the M4 should not penetrate the Tigers front armor.

Is this an omission that needs to be patched or is this for game play balance? Whatever it is, it is flustrating to witness such armor attrition for both sides.

On another note I've experienced a 2cm flak gun fire all it's ammo at a Stuart and do nothing to it. Unfortunately, for the Stuart it got stuck and never did fire on the flak gun (couldn't see it?). Maybe the flak imobilized the Stuart but no message noted that action.

[Sergei]

Hello Paul,

you will notice that in 1944-45 there are several guns in the Allied arsenal that penetrate the Tiger I armour with ease. The normal 75mm is not one of those, but the US 76mm (such as in E8) and Brit 17pdr guns (in Firefly) do that job just fine. Remember, Tiger entered service in 1942 and back then it was superior because Allies didn't have enough of guns capable of penetrating it.