Some Allied Strategies

[Hubert Cater]

Before the next patch arrives I thought I would address the apparent Axis bias with a few key Allied strategies and insights of my own. These may or may not work against a very good Axis player, but at the very least they will give them a run for their money and perhaps show that the Allied position is not untenable after all. An interesting note is that Bruce Geryk gave Strategic Command 2 out of 4 stars in a recent issue of Computer Gaming World mostly in part because of an apparent Allied bias in the game, so either Bruce is not the strategic tactician he thinks he is or perhaps he has had some of the same insight as mine

Let's start with some of the key elements to an Axis victory as found in this game:

1) Quick victory over France

2) Key research in Tech and Jets

3) Bold and aggressive strategy

The main reason I start with France is simply due to the economics, the earlier you knock France out, the sooner you receive the plunder (a big one at that) her resources, and the sooner you can start that all important tech investment strategy. This is key since the Axis needs all the advantage they can get early on in order to win. They need experienced units, the right amount of units, the right return from tech investment, and a bold and aggressive strategy if they want to have a chance at winning, otherwise if any of these things don't happen the Axis will have a very hard time once the combined incomes of the UK, USSR and USA come into play.

I think that this much has been agreed upon and the main argument has been that the Axis can get too much of an advantage early on (especially via research) and that makes the Allied position unwinnable each and every time. What is left then is the all important question, what can the Allies do to turn or even stem the tide? Primarily the Allies have to change their way of thinking and how they do battle.

Some recent suggestions have been:

1) Disbanding and reorganization of units

2) An early attack on Italy

3) Moving the bulk of the French army to England

I'll start by saying that some may find these gamey, and that may or may not be a fair assessment, but consider this, the Axis have declared TOTAL WAR and found a winning strategy whereby they invest heavily in tech and build a superarmy so any effort to counteract this strategy I would not consider gamey at all, it's all a part of declaring total war as well and fighting anyway you can to win the game. Despite saying this, I've never employed any of these strategies simply because I find them too risky and could open you up to potential problems in other areas.

1) I've found some good use of the start Allied units, more on that to come

2) Risky at best and very easily counteracted by a good Axis player, just ask Jollyguy

3) Doing this and you allow the Axis player to take France too early. Sure he may never be able to take England, but with that early MPP bonus he can really make you pay by the time he decides to attack the USSR and have enough left over to counteract any amphibious assaults on the French mainland even with the extra Free French units.

Ok so the question remains, what can be done then? Well it all comes back to identifying and working against the Axis winning strategies as outlined in the original points 1-3. I'll outline some optional strategies shortly, but the basics come down to picking your fights as the Allies and when you do, fight tooth and nail while at the same time trying to limit your losses. Make him pay every step of the way. If done right, you will limit what your Axis opponent can invest in research and limit his options during the all important time frame between the Fall of France and Barbarossa

Next installment: Battle For France

[Hubert Cater]

The Battle of France

===============

Again this may or may not work against a competent Axis player and may just be some food for thought. In the battle for France I pretty much go into it with the understanding that it's going to be a lost cause. I could put everything into it, but too often I will still end up losing at a heavy price to the UK due to their extra efforts, i.e. losing the Canadian armies or risking portions of my UK fleet that could come back to haunt me later on in the war. So the strategy I have devised can really make the Axis player pay with some casualties while limiting my UK involvement and at the same time (if you are lucky) drag out the Battle for France to August or even September.

The key here is patience and just the right amount of manouvering of the French armies to take out at least 1 Axis unit and at most 3 during the Battle of France. This strategy of course assumes you have taken out his Axis subs in the Atlantic and that he has taken his time by going with Poland, at least Demark and then the Low Countries. Also FoW is the key, here is a screenshot of my initial French setup (Note shots were taken with FoW off):

Ok, what I have done is made sure my Allied ground units in the Med have not moved to keep Italy out of the war as long as possible, and then proceeded to move my French Air Fleet to England, switched the Maginot units with Corps, and moved all armies with a few additional army purchases to this new front line across Paris.

The new French line:

This line I've found to be helpful in many ways, but primarily it limits his attacks to only two ground hexes per French army, keeps my French armies close to Paris so they are in good supply (better than if they are along the Belgian border), forces him to attack me close to my supply source and away from his supply (Brussels which will be at level 5 once the Low Countries surrender). What it also does during FoW is give it may give him a good surprise here and there. Notice all the positions that this gives you to surround his units on 3 to 4 sides if he ventures too far and not in force, also notice the French positions just north of Paris, if he ventures too far off along the coast, you can hammer him with your French ground troops, the air units in the UK and portions of the fleet located here next to Brest.

Again there will be patience needed here, to balance out when to strike back and when to sit tight and hold the line, but with keeping your air units initially out of his range (chances are he won't suspect they are around) there is a good chance you can even move in your carriers at maximum range with a good strike from your UK air units, bomber and French ground units, and French naval units (shore bombardment, better these than your UK navy) to take out 1 or 2 German units along the north. If he forces the situation in the south, a timely retreat from the Maginot swinging French units downwards and towards Paris while maintaining any part of the Maginot helps, regardless, at some point he will have to move along the upper portions of France otherwise his Axis armies will be too far out of supply and ripe for the picking once again.

All in all if done right and with a bit of luck, you can give your Axis opponent a bit of a bloody nose and even delay his conquest of France which can be very important as he will be forced to replace his losses instead of spend on tech, and it should give him less of a headstart in the all important tech race.

France will eventually fall, but before it does, if there is any remaining French naval units use them to attack the port at Antwerp. This is key since he will be less likely to spend his time attacking your French naval units with his air force while the Battle for France rages on, and if you can manage to knock it down to below 5 he will not be able to transport any units over from there for an amphibious assault of England. Right before France falls, station the bulk of your UK navy right next to Brest and move your Allied air units over to that direction as well as shown here:

You naval units will be in good supply from the previous turn, and it will enable you to immediatly hammer Brest, start with the port and make sure you reduce it to 0, then hit the city with whatever is left. Notice the position of the Allied Bomber, right below Liverpool, at that position you can reach both Antwerp and Brest, and if you reduce both these ports to 0, that is 5 turns before he can mount an amphibious from those positions forcing him to use either Arcachon or Kiel. This alone can save the UK from amphibious assault. Once these objectives are achieved, haul ass out of there with your navy (make sure you have enough to guard against an eastern and western approach to the UK from an amphibious assault should there still be one) and air force and sit tight to see what your opponent does next. Make sure your air force is out of range of intercept range of London for now, all your opponent can do is hit it without any immediate fear from amphibious assault and it usually costs him more than you since that Corps is at entrenchment level 6.

[ November 01, 2002, 01:13 PM: Message edited by: Hubert Cater ]

[Hubert Cater]

Defending England

=============

At this point you can only hope that things have gone well in the Battle for France, you have given your opponent a bit of a bloody nose, delayed the victory a bit and reduced his two nearest port enough to stave off an immediate amphibious assault, but you are still not sure.

You should have a fair amount of MPP's (despite the immediate purchase of Montgomery for the Battle of France), yet it's still a good idea is to sit tight and avoid tech investments for now unless your situation is very good, invest in another Air Fleet or Strategic Bomber if possible and make sure you have enough Corps just in case of a daring amphibious assault. The following setup usually gives me enough cover to counter an amphbious invasion if one is still launched at me:

With my current Bomber position stationed just below Liverpool I can still hit his ports and spot an invasion force from any direction unless it comes from the extreme north, in that case I have a decent naval contingent stationed at Scapa Flow for that. If I suddenly see an invasion flotilla I move all my Corps units down along the coast line around London to deny him a place to land (denying them London is important to limit their supply). I then move in my Air units to make sure they are in a defensive range of the Corps and station my navy in striking distance, I don't commit them just yet in case this is all just a bluff, but I do sit and pray that the rolls go my way. On his next turn he has either got to hit my Corps units with his air or retreat from the assault. If he goes for my Corps, I have about 2 or 3 air units defending and the Corps can usually take some losses and not be destoyed. This will eventually be a losing battle but the longer you delay him, the more time wasted on what could be a fruitless endevour especially since it may bring in the USSR or USA early as well as deny him time to sit back and invest in tech.

An optional strategy is to wait out of distance from London with your air, garrison Manchester, Edinburgh and the mountain hexes south of Manchester and allow him to land. This too requires a bit of patience and knowing the right time to strike back, with some skill and a bit of luck, it can cause the early entries of the USA or USSR as desired and if things go really well, hit the London port with your Bomber, he won't have any way to escape once the port strength is less than 5 and you can wipe out his landed units in England. If successfull it should be a short war.

[ November 01, 2002, 05:08 PM: Message edited by: Hubert Cater ]

[Hubert Cater]

The Mediterranean

============

The Med should have greater importance once the Suez loop becomes available, but the key will be hanging on to it until you can build the area up. Some interesting strategies include the taking of Iraq by both the Axis and Allied sides. For the Allies it can greatly increase your income and once the USSR is involved all connected Allied resources to Soviet soil will go up to a full 10 in strength or at least 8 for occupied territory. For the Axis just controlling this to deny the Allies is sometimes important enough.

This is a tricky situation since the Allies start very weak as they did historically, infact the Italians marched on Egypt in 1940 with a 10 to 1 ratio in their favour but still managed to have defeat snatched from the jaws of victory It involves a bit of risk but confident with my Battle for France and defence of England tactics I usually send my Canadian army down to Alexandria as well as move the Valiant Battleship from Gibraltar to Alexandria to bolster the naval defences. Once Italy joins the war move the French Syrian Corps also, better to fight on as Free French than to surrender

I usually end up with a situation as follows:

By the time Italy tries to take on Alexandria you should be well entrenched and make things very difficult for them, you may lose the bulk of your navy but if you can delay them or even waste their time there the better it is. Keeping the carrier in port is key as the port gives a great defence to the carrier position and helps from air attacks on Allied Alexandrian positions as well. With the two units stationed around the Alex it should allow you to hold up long enough in time for you to reinforce the area, it also protects the Carrier from ground attack while it's in port.

[ November 01, 2002, 05:11 PM: Message edited by: Hubert Cater ]

[Hubert Cater]

Extras

====

Sometimes it comes down to distracting your Axis opponent and delaying his victories in the early years while limiting your own risk. Sure if the Axis has some good tech it may all be lost but delaying his tech advances and preventing easy walk overs here and there can limit the 20 Air Fleet Axis strategy that some have seen, as I've been fortunate enough to not see this myself

There are many examples and variants, here is one for Norway. Some players will go for Sweden first and then build for Norway. If this happens a good counter measure is to anticipate this move and set up a counter move in the waiting as follows:

So what I have done here is set up a transport to immediately land in Bergen should Norway fall on the first turn as this will deny the Axis player the port and city on their next turn, not even if they had a transport ready or if they were prepared to operate a unit in there themselves. The transport is protected by my naval screen and the naval screen let's me know if he plans on dropping off a unit himself due to the location and spotting range of my battleship furthest to the right. If he decides to commit in force with subs and cruisers of his own, there is a good chance of a naval exchange that should cost him more than yourself with the addition of your bomber and fighers with an HQ located around Scapa Flow.

If things go bad, you can always pull back, or even land the Corps and retreat after stealing a few resource MPP's and a little distraction. Part of his distraction may be to fight it out up there and this costs him money such as the transfer costs of sending his Air units north or the repair costs to his own navy. Either way these all add up and can cost him more in the long run despite UK losses. The main argument for this is that if he is not 100% unprepared for war in Russia then the UK sacrifices can often be well worth it.

[ November 01, 2002, 05:25 PM: Message edited by: Hubert Cater ]

[Flash Gordon]

Hubert - where did you get those new symbols for the unit counters? They look very nice? Are they one of the downloadable mods or is this something from the upcoming patch?

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Flash, www.ww2n.com/schq thats were you can find that mod

Hubert, i never understand the strategy of A delaying action in France. You fight for France like you would fight for any other country. You shall fight in france, you shall fight on the seas and oceans......

Btw, I inadvertently used this Bergen strategy in my AAr

[Jollyguy]

Keeping in mind that I'm basically a computer simpleton, how do you actually get the mods to work?

I downloaded into SC via Windows Explorer, and unzipped the file, and it said it unzipped, and I see the "unit.sprites" there, and when I click on it I see the mod units, but when I get into the actual game, no change.

So, if someone could give me a paint-by-numbers, step-by-step procudure for activiting the mod units, I'd be appreciative. Do I have to move the zip file into a specific SC folder, and unzip it there? Did I forget knock on wood?

Thanks

Bob

[Zeres]

I Love that mod. That's what I'm using

[ November 02, 2002, 01:02 AM: Message edited by: Zeres ]

[Russ Bensing]

Originally posted by Jollyguy:

Keeping in mind that I'm basically a computer simpleton, how do you actually get the mods to work?

I downloaded into SC via Windows Explorer, and unzipped the file, and it said it unzipped, and I see the "unit.sprites" there, and when I click on it I see the mod units, but when I get into the actual game, no change.

So, if someone could give me a paint-by-numbers, step-by-step procudure for activiting the mod units, I'd be appreciative. Do I have to move the zip file into a specific SC folder, and unzip it there? Did I forget knock on wood?

Thanks

Bob

You have to unzip the files into the /Program Files/Strategic Command/Bitmaps directory. That's all it takes. You're probably unzipping them into the same directory you downloaded them into.

[Kurt Bullard]

Convinced that the war is won or lost in Russia, I tended to be too "non-strategic" as the Allies in 1939-41. I attacked some ports here and bombarded units there, but not toward a strategic end.

While I still believe Russia is key, Hubert demonstrates a subtle point: the Western Front can have important long-term affects on Barbarossa. My two cents:

- It may seem obvious, but don't invest a single MPP in Poland under normal circumstances. The sad strategic reality is that Poland is a goner and MPPs spent there simply give the Axis an opportunity for easy experience. In fact, I prefer to *attack* if there's any opportunity to inflict losses.

- As I found out the first time, contesting Norway requires advance planning. If the Axis takes Norway in a single turn from Sweden, Bergen definitely will be garrisoned the next and a contested invasion will fail.

- Norway also offers the British the option of "going big early". The prospect of a substantial British force in Norway under Montgomery will force the Axis to make a tough strategic decision -- just about the time Barbarossa is supposed to start.

- I still prefer an HQ in France, especially if your objective is to destroy at least one German unit. That makes it harder, though, to establish a solid line. Given a choice, leave the coast open. If the Axis takes the bait, use your naval units.

Kurt

[pzgndr]

Otto, are you there Otto? Please consider adding a strategy guide section to your Strategic Command website. Hubert's discussions posted here are excellent and should be made available in some central location. Future installments from Hubert and others could be added and maintained. :cool:

Future topics could include:

Early Axis strategies

Axis and Allied Med strategies

Russo-German east front strategies

Anglo-US west front strategies

Research strategies

MPP management strategies

Political considerations

Fancy eye-candy graphics mods and a plethora of scenario mods are fine, but the heart and soul of this game is WWII grand strategy and all the subtle variations possible. As Hubert pointed out, a well played game between two competent players can be balanced. Games can easily get out of balance not by one player exploiting some particular game aspect, but by the other making mistakes and allowing his opponent to gain an advantage. As players learn the "right" way to play and make fewer mistakes, they should find the game to be more "fair." As Napoleon once said, "When the enemy is making a mistake, don't interrupt him."

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Bill, agree that we need an SC strategy guide. However, there is one consequence that cannot be avoided. I beleive it was you that once stated (in regards to 3R) "I can tell you exactl where the allied player will place his Polish units to acheive the best defense," This mean that sooner or later the game will become a virtual stalemate, since each side knows all the strategies and knows how to counter-act them.

CvM

[Jollyguy]

As to the Mod. Thanks, that helped. I moved it to the bitmaps and voila, it worked.

Bob

[Lou Wigman]

I can usually defend France well and it rarely falls too far short of Christmas 1940. Often later. There is however a serious downside to fighting too hard for France. The German units receive a HEAP of experience. The longer the Germans fight in France the more medals they get! A prolonged fight in France makes the German army and especially the airfoce unstoppable in Russia.

[blackbellamy]

Hubert, I noticed your French defense setup takes the army out of the Maginot and replaces it with a corps. Since the army begins dug in and the corps will not, do you have enough time for the corps to dig in so as to present an obstacle to the Germans?

[Kuniworth]

Hubert, thx for your innovative thoughts...however I find it very hard to keep the maginot line intact. Attacked by 3 or 4 ground units and airfleets the two fortifications up north are destroyed rather quickly.

[IrishGuards]

Sir, great thoughts, but what I am seeing now from the allied player is the DOW on Low countries on turn 3.

As is not only do the allies get to choose the brits to take brussels, since they attack with only 1 corp and the majority of attackers co-ordinating are french. What detriment is there besides Italy coming in a bit quicker and the americans being slowed.

Plunder goes to UK for hq and then the brit air force goes into attack mode.

Russia is not affected at all and the french are laughing at you. It seems that the set-up of minors to alter who is actually attacking them is key.

Also if this is the allied political position it would have huge ramifications to the other minors in the game.

Yugo, Spain, as the examples. Uk units sitting off the coast waiting for the Axis to attack Norway. And through all this the minors do not react. Later actions by the allies to take all minors for virtually nothing, Ireland, Portugal and even Spain though tougher is still possible. :eek:

UK air attacks GER targets right through a neutral Low countries with carrier support on turn 2 to compound the irony, and any air defence for Ger is lacking the HQ Von Leeb which should be on the western front.

All in all a horrible situation which would never have occured seeing as the maginot armies were not mobile compared to the armies defending the Low countries border, and the co-operation of the french and brits.

If Ger has not taken out Den by this time the initiative is fully with the allies.

Reagrds

Michael Anderson

[Desert Dave]

As originally posted by Kuniworth:

...however I find it very hard to keep the maginot line intact. Attacked by 3 or 4 ground units and airfleets the two fortifications up north are destroyed rather quickly

IMO, it is a very good idea to replace the units in the Maginot with corps. You are going to be bypassed in any event, so better to have the Armies placed in the area of German blitzkreig.

They do little good if they remain in Maginot, and all the while the Germans are attacking through the Ardennes. Finally, they will be easily blocked from moving west to reinforce the Paris area by a competent Axis player.

Keep in mind that you wish to buy TIME so that the Brits might reinforce the Med before Italy enters, and also inflict as many casualties on the Germans as is possible. Essentially, that's ALL you can do. Great if you can completely destroy a unit, since we appreciate that the cost is much higher to build a brand new unit.

The French Armies can effectively do that if they have 2 or 3 hex attacking capability, and if they are supported by a HQ.

No matter, if the AI persists in attacking the Maginot line, then that causes more casualites and costs the Germans more MPPs.

A human opponent will rarely resort to such useless attacks, so moving north and west is a good idea, and even better if you can do it early so to get the entrenchment bonus.

Also, IF you use the carriers to air assault a German unit that has strayed out along the north-most coast, then be sure that you have enough land-based air support, AND watch out for the Germans re-basing Air Fleets closer to the front, in the vicinity of Low Countries, yes?

[Hubert Cater]

Originally posted by Flash Gordon:

Hubert - where did you get those new symbols for the unit counters? They look very nice? Are they one of the downloadable mods or is this something from the upcoming patch?

Forgot to give thanks to jmbunnelle for those unit sprites in my strategy pics, fantastic job on those!

[Hubert Cater]

Originally posted by Carl Von Mannerheim:

Hubert, i never understand the strategy of A delaying action in France. You fight for France like you would fight for any other country. You shall fight in france, you shall fight on the seas and oceans......

It's kind of a toss up, if you throw everything in to France you may just delay Germany enough before they have a good chance to setup for Barbarossa but the risk is that the Brits will have commited too many resources too early and have nothing left for a long time to pose any threatful action on Germany's western front or in defence of the Mediterranean etc. But if on the other hand you fight an effective delaying action in France with minimal UK involvement you will have a considerable number of MPP's to make some key purchases and to invest in research during the critical period from the Fall of France to the start of Barbarossa. If done just right then it's more than possible to threaten the Axis from the west (instead of being mostly on the defensive) and just in time to help turn the tide in the east against the Germans.

Hubert

[Hubert Cater]

Originally posted by blackbellamy:

Hubert, I noticed your French defense setup takes the army out of the Maginot and replaces it with a corps. Since the army begins dug in and the corps will not, do you have enough time for the corps to dig in so as to present an obstacle to the Germans?

More often than not the key Maginot hex is the one just below Brussles and the bottom two are usually left until later in the Battle for France, so I usually replace this one with a Corps on the Allied first turn to get as high as possible entrenchment before the Axis attack. Either way the Maginot defences are more or less just to prevent a direct route to Paris and serve their purpose as such forcing the Axis player to go around them and along the coast, if they decide to attack them the better for you and the longer their battle in France which is usually a good thing

Hubert

[Hubert Cater]

Originally posted by Kuniworth:

Hubert, thx for your innovative thoughts...however I find it very hard to keep the maginot line intact. Attacked by 3 or 4 ground units and airfleets the two fortifications up north are destroyed rather quickly.

Immer Etwas gives an excellent response to this and my notes to Blackbellamy would also apply in this regard. Basically if the enemy wants to attack the Maginot let them, the big prize is Paris and the longer they take to get there the better

Hubert

[pzgndr]

Moving the French armies out of the Maginot and forming a line farther back works very well if the Germans rush into the trap. Having made this mistake once, I can vouch for the tenacity of a rugged French defense. If France can take out a tank group or more and delay the German timetable, it's a successful defense. The German countermeasure to this strategy is to pause and regroup after taking the Low Countries, moving air fleets forward, and then proceed with a deliberate attack toward Paris. Destroy French units one by one while protecting yourself from unit losses.

And from a current game with Immer Etwas, here's another interesting twist on this. If France moves its Algerian garrison and activates Italy too soon, it opens the backdoor for a German blitz from the south. After taking Low Countries in March, I was pondering how to break the solid French line and then Italy declares war early! So off goes Rommel and 2 tank groups to Italy and a couple turns later the French defense is in shambles. Paris fell in June and the Germans took no unit losses. Lesson learned here is for the Allied player to understand the risk of moving his Med garrison too early and how that may affect other things.

[Desert Dave]

As originally posted by Bill Macon:

So off goes Rommel and 2 tank groups to Italy and a couple turns later the French defense is in shambles. Paris fell in June and the Germans took no unit losses.

Well, it was a a sound and imaginative ploy, but I would disagree that the defense (... which might have been handled a bit better, but this was the first time I had seen this, so I was caught unawares) was ...a shambles? :eek:

As I remember it, your pincer movement caused the fall of Paris in early August, and France capitulated with 3 full strength French corps right next to Paris, and so the surrender struck me as a mite premature.

Nonetheless, your point is a good one. In general, I would recommend that NO Foreign Legion units be moved from starting colonies at all, unless of course you should WANT Italy involved sooner.

There may be instances when you would PREFER an early entry -- for example, if you have the French navy positioned just south of Taranto so that they might help RN destroy the Italian fleet.

In that instance, you may need more time to complete the job (...OTOH, an alert Axis player will have deployed Air Fleets to protect the Italian navy, and so -- whee! 'round & 'round the strategy wheel we go!).

Playing TCP/IP is surely different than playing the AI, and there are many old and partially ingrained habits that must be reevaluated and readjusted. With PBEM you have extended periods in which you may re-play the various tactics in your mind, and more time to consider and reconsider various options.

But, TCP/IP makes for a more rousing and satisfying game for that very reason. It more closely resembles the sturm & drang of actual battlefield decision-making.

Those of you who haven't tried it as of yet, I would surely recommend it!