zappsweden Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Dragon, that's a joke isn't it? "Early May to late June" with the double HQ defence? From where do you get your results? I held Paris until August against the best SC player in the world and would have held it longer without my silly counter (Yes, he had chance of taking empty Paris in May if he had broke through but Yes I also had a chance to hold very long if I had not gambled on counters). Believe me, against less experienced opponents I would not have gambled at all. Ask Cosmin. He got Paris in November when I introduced him to my Allied show. Ask Rambo who was stopped in France several times. Zapp knows SC -> Zapp knows his strategies -> Zapp >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OUT p.s I could run a test against you using the double HQ and we will see about when Paris falls. I expect ppl to back up their statements. :cool: - [ December 15, 2004, 02:43 AM: Message edited by: zappsweden ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Originally posted by zappsweden: Dragon, that's a joke isn't it? "Early May to late June" with the double HQ defence? From where do you get your results? I held Paris until August against the best SC player in the world and would have held it longer without my silly counter. Yes, he had chance of taking empty Paris in May if he had broke through but Yes I also had a chance to hold very long if I had not gambled on counters. Believe me, against less experienced opponents I would not have gambled at all. Ask Cosmin. He got Paris in November when I introduced him to my Allied show. Ask Rambo who was stopped in France several times. I read some AAR's between you and Yoda and sometimes you lose Paris in June. The double HQ is June-August. Zapp knows SC -> Zapp knows his strategies -> Zapp >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OUT p.s I could run a test against you using the double HQ and we will see about when Paris falls. I expect ppl to back up their statements. - Typing error it´s late May to late June not early may. In our last games it proved to be that time i mentioned so there is no need for a test. It can be later for sure when the axis player chooses the save way and does not risk units...but anyway its a killer either for axis or for the allies..so let´s call it zapp´s airgambit. Edit: I´m talking about when i will take France with these different strategies ..the performance of other players is another thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Hmm, it is not a game killer. Normally the games continue to long games. For instance I only got a draw against Cosmin despite holding paris until November. I got lazy, what else can I say. Anyhow, my stats against the best player (Terif) using this strategy was: Game #1: Held Paris until Late March Game #2: Held Paris until Late July Game #3: Held Paris until Early August And that was against EXPERT opposition (Terif)! Both game #2 and game #3 went on after France. The strategy is not a game killer or a gambit because only occasionally Allies lose Paris way too early or Axis gets stopped in France. "In our last games it proved to be that time i mentioned so there is no need for a test." That is exactly what IS needed if you want a descent result. I used this strategy about 10-12 times now and would say that Paris normally falls in June-July using this strategy. [ December 15, 2004, 02:57 AM: Message edited by: zappsweden ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Zapp first read then post I was not talking about a gamekiller but about a killer for either axis or allies. Killer with the sense of deciding the game early. I dont critizize your tactic. And then i was talking how i perform ag these strategies and when other players play more cautious there will be another result for sure. Maybe you did not catch my edit in time concerning the 2nd point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 "Its quite simple there are 3 possibilities to defend france" To me it looked like descriptions and expected outcomes of different strategies in a general way. That is why I gave my personal view, I did not think it was a description of only your own games. - Thats not what you said, you said Santiago was in Danger, I asked "Great Danger" and you said "is there any other kind?". I can have them read it back to you... - I KNOW WHAT I SAID, I do not need to have it read back to me (A Few Good Men) By the way, you seem to be very much "alive" on forum the last days. I do not even have time to do my correcting edit before you quote me. [ December 15, 2004, 03:08 AM: Message edited by: zappsweden ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Well first it was intented in that way but then i rembered that you killed rambo 7 times in a row with this tactic...so it cant be general Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Originally posted by Dragonheart: Well first it was intented in that way but then i rembered that you killed rambo 7 times in a row with this tactic...so it cant be general schhhhhhhh, silence... do not wake up the sleeping bear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Yup , Zapp is right, I took France vs him in November 40. It was the first time i experienced such a savage defence of France But even at my level of experience it didn't prove fatal to my axis. The main problem of the aggressive air strategy is how you will fare in the later stages of the game. Forcing intercepts means a huge mpp drain for axis but also for UK. UK will have less cash to invest in tech and buy additional AFs, not to mention UK is unable to intervene anywhere else until barbarossa. Thus UK will be weaker for the D-Day and US alone cannot do much. Yes, I agree, axis will be delayed and maybe forced to postpone capturing some minors, like I was - I started barbie vs Zapp without Spain. Without having to fear for an early powerful D-Day, Axis can commit almost everything in Russia. So, long term wise, Zapp's strategy boils down to how well you can play the russians. Axis is able to flood France with cheap corps AND, due to a weaker UK air power to keep airfleets in France to mess with your invasion force/carriers/etc. Some minors will come a bit later, maybe the barbarossa will be weaker but this is, by all means, no game breaker for axis. The main problem is if axis can be stopped in France, which i seriously doubt. You need at least 3 UK RAFs or maybe 4. So you will probably need Ireland for that. Going for Ireland could mean no air fights over LC/France for quite some turns which are enough for Axis to gain a strong foothold on France soil. I have high doubts if even I can be stopped in France and I am not a perfect Axis player. Again, ZAS has its pros and cons. It is no sure winner, it is no sure loser. What it is for sure, it prolongs a game till the UK is able to cope with the task of air supporting the D-Day. This means you have to be a damn Russian player to win the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 I m not sure but i think he cant go for Irland with leaving malta unguarded for one round as in this case the italians will come into war.... but Zapp can answer you this for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Zapp does not leave Malta ungarissoned. I think he buys a french corps during first turn which he sends to malta to replace the AF there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Hmm maybe ppl dont like to read hole sentences today...... Malta is ungarded for one round....as this corps cant sail to malta within one round...it will need 2 rounds.....as it´s not captain kirk from the spaceship enterprise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Dragon von Slow zu Clone quit being so accurate otoh, do you need the second raf in turn 1? Turn 3 should be ok I think so no need to leave malta ungarissoned even for 1 turn - so you can toy with IRA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 @Dragon Clown - good luck with the upcoming matches vs The Force wielder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Dragonheart, you should read my topic about the Allied Air Strategy. Ireland and Malta is explained there. How can you discuss a stragegy you do not even know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 @Dragon Clonenstein, sole shareholder of Slowness Inc. : you didn't do your homework ... next time i'll give you a test from ZAS, better be prepared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 15, 2004 Author Share Posted December 15, 2004 Hey...you have your fun with me? Originally posted by zappsweden: Dragonheart, you should read my topic about the Allied Air Strategy. Ireland and Malta is explained there. How can you discuss a stragegy you do not even know? Obviously i only know how to counter it but i know one persion who thanks god that you retired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curry Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Dragon, I thought your recap of the 3 general strategies for the defense of France was well done. Of course its only general and depends on who you play. But its very good reading for any new players. These three options are the three major options and Dragon gives in my view a good recap on the advantages and weaknesses of each. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 Dragonhearts descriptions of the strategies were ok but the conclusions were hasty. I will leave the fate of the ZAS in the hands of my SC students (Hellraiser/Cosmin, kick their ass). Nuff Said. :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_j_rambo Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 @Zapp --- Hmmm, please add that Poland didn't surrender TWICE. LC failed! You think I really cared when I kitchen sinked Poland? These 20+ hour games of SC aren't in my system programming anymore. I'm large in life in my community, family, & job. Don't have the time to wait for DragonSlow to calculate how he can save 10% in operand costs with his corps. "I need a new drug" --- Huey Lewis in one sorry ass song. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 15, 2004 Share Posted December 15, 2004 yo, the clone of the slow dragon is cool; i just like to make a little fun that's all; he's a very good player, we all have to admit. but this is no excuse for being so damn SLOOOOW!!! j/k DH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 16, 2004 Author Share Posted December 16, 2004 Originally posted by hellraiser: yo, the clone of the slow dragon is cool; i just like to make a little fun that's all; he's a very good player, we all have to admit. but this is no excuse for being so damn SLOOOOW!!! j/k DH Ok added to the NWTPA List. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 NWTPA ??? do you play utopia by any chance? NW stands for province's networth and TPA should be Thieves Per Acre anyway, is that for good or bad? I'll do you a favour and add to my WAJSDFGUIR list ... now, decipher that ... if that should be 'not worthy to play anymore/pay attn' - really I could care less Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 16, 2004 Author Share Posted December 16, 2004 Wow you cracked the nut :eek: cool Yep thats rite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellraiser Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 lol@DH ... ppl take things too seriously these days ... whatever floats your boat DragonSl... errr Dragonheart Beavis!!! Punish him!!! Punish him!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted December 16, 2004 Author Share Posted December 16, 2004 Honestly said....i had christmasparty yesterday with my collegues.....and i was together with another one the first one in the office ....but not coming from home So i slept no minute and its a long time ago i did this before....and now i feel so ooooooold. So today it should read Dragonsleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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