Sombra Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Originally posted by Terif: But I agree with Curry that he should first have a chance for self defence and an explaination before we start hanging him - until now we have only heared one side . The curious mob gathers. Chance to defend himself bahhh boring!!!!!!!! As it is a PBEM game there should be a good chance that there is still the first turn of the game hanging around? Like the others said ask him for his password. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuniworth Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Ah come on Terif. If we once and for all gonna get rid of cheating it's time we strike down hard on crime. I say hang him by his balls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade Trapp Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 He lied when he said he "disbanded all the useless units", that pretty much killed any chances of him saying "it was an accident" convincingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curry Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Aztec gave me the name of this person yesterday and I have written this person giving him an opportunity to explain himself. So far I have not heard from him. I dont know for sure if this was an sc pbem league game since I dont have his pbem league name. If it was not a league game it is sort of out of my jurisdiction. If he is in the league then he has the opportunity to explain himself. However, already in my mind things are looking bad for him. If he had an explaination I would have thought that he would have posted it here. My guess is he is reading all of this. Unfortunatley playing via email is not the most secure system for competative games. JJ had a good thread on this subject and it would be worthy to find it again. I found the one on the SC-II thread and bumped it up again asking Mr. H.C. to try to do whatever he can in SC-II to make the pbem system more secure. The SC PBEM league is not meant to be the hard competative league the old TCIP leagues were. Its meant to give a good idea of players abilities with win/loss records. I hope all the new players in the league understand that. Unfortunatly I think I have run into some cheaters via PBEM. When tech increases are just too much and when combat results are also just too good to be true too often. I have played so many games that I have come to be able to sport those things. However, its never anything that one can prove. My way of solving the problem is to resign and give the other person the win. Then never play that person again. Because I could be wrong and I dont want to accuse someone falsely. But I have had such strong suspicions that I would rather just give the win away and move on to a new game. I do hope that Mr. H.C. will be able to do something to make the pbem system better. [ July 05, 2004, 08:47 AM: Message edited by: Curry ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sombra Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Originally posted by Aztecace: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Kuniworth: Interesting is; Who started and hosted the game. If it was you Aztecace then we have a MMP-hack to deal with. I was Allies so he started the game. </font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curry Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 I have heard from the player in question and he told me that this was not a SC PBEM league game. Therefore I will not get involved. Its between Aztec and him and for Aztec to give out the name if he wishes. Aztec - was this a PBEM league game? The player did not defend his actions but only said its not good to hang someone without proof. I asked him to come here and defend himself as that would be the best thing to do in my estimation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b00ch Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Well, I have read all the thread and I agree in some terms but Terif you have done math in a wrong way as Germany can collect more MPPs in 8 turns than (8x120), as Ger is increasing MPP per turn with conquests... maybe 160/170 in turn 5, so he can reach 2700 and more so for me, its possible. I dont have any game file, but if something is suspicious, well dont play with that guy anymore, but btw, do you guys have any proof? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terif Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Originally posted by Curry: The player did not defend his actions but only said its not good to hang someone without proof. In principle he is right, but here there is a proof: the PBEM turn. In my eyes the only defence could have been that he never played this game and/or that it would not be his PBEM turn. Cause when looking at the presented turn, there is not the smallest doubt that the axis player in this game increased his mpps/research chits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenfedoroff Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 So... I'm not the only who has faced a Hi-Tech Guru. I always wondered how people get Level-2 jets and infantry by the fall of France. I am hoping the game designer can fix SC-2 to stop this nonsense. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztecace Posted July 5, 2004 Author Share Posted July 5, 2004 I don't believe this was a league game. He never told me his league name if he had one or that he was in any league. I have sent him a email explaining my position. I don't want this thread become a "lets bash this guy" thing. Hopefully he will learn from this experience. Sombra...I don't know how he could cheated in our other game when I started it. I just thought it was odd that he had all that tech and air forces at that part of the game. I could not proved that he did anything wrong at that time though. I want to thank Terif, Curry, and everyone else who helped me figure this out. Thanks! I have learned a thing or two and I will pay more attention to Mpp values and such from now on. SC to me is just a fun and challenging hobby and not a competitive venture. I have and am playing against some very nice people. [ July 05, 2004, 10:35 AM: Message edited by: Aztecace ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztecace Posted July 5, 2004 Author Share Posted July 5, 2004 Originally posted by b00ch: Well, I have read all the thread and I agree in some terms but Terif you have done math in a wrong way as Germany can collect more MPPs in 8 turns than (8x120), as Ger is increasing MPP per turn with conquests... maybe 160/170 in turn 5, so he can reach 2700 and more so for me, its possible. If you look at Terif's math he did take into account the added MPP's generated by conquests of Poland, LC, and Denmark. The (8x120) for Germany is just for Germany itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terif Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 @b00ch: Thats the point, here we have the PBEM turn i.e. proof . The conquests are already included in the mpps as written above. In short: Germany is 9x120= 1080 Conquests are ~250 mpp (during the last turns) + Plunder from conquests: max 1050 mpp So Germany can have collected a total of max. ~2380 mpp (with maximum luck, but in average it should be closer to 2200mpp...) But here Germany owns newly bought assets that can be directly seen of 2725 mpp (+ report screen shows at least another new unknown unit). Additionally it reinforced (alone last turn 13 army strength points = ~156mpp) and surely operated units (usually this is again around 200-300 mpp). So in this aspect there is no doubt . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 It seems to me he cheated with start chits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terif Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Originally posted by Aztecace: ... I don't want this thread become a "lets bash this guy" thing. Hopefully he will learn from this experience. ... I have learned a thing or two and I will pay more attention to Mpp values and such from now on. SC to me is just a fun and challenging hobby and not a competitive venture. I have and am playing against some very nice people. Yes, to have fun playing SC is the most important thing. Therefore there is no reason to cheat and nothing to gain from it - a cheater can only loose his reputation and honour. And I think when playing some games against veteran players it will be obvious very soon if someone is cheating or really knows what he is doing - in SC there is not much luck involved in the long term...however, for everyone it doesnt hurt to check during the first turns the report screen and mpp values to be sure that the correct scenario has been started . Fortunately I have not encountered many cheaters in SC (only 2 in total now, i.e. 1 cheater per year - the first one was a new player who also obviously incresed his research chits, when I asked him he more or less admitted it and I have never seen him again since this time...). In contrary I am glad to say cheaters seem to be extremely seldom in SC especially compared to other games . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b00ch Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Aztec & Terif, yep you are both right. Just one thing more to make this thread alive, its just too easy to cheat in a PBEM game, and you dont have to start the game to do so. Furthermore you can alter the file at every single turn. Beside theres no joy in do that, if you want to win just beat the silly AI . I hope there will be a counter-measure in SC2 to stop altering PBEM files as I have said its just plain simple to increase your MPPs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztecace Posted July 5, 2004 Author Share Posted July 5, 2004 I was not going to post this guys email but after talking to another person, who playing the same person right now and he also is seeing some fishy things happening in the game, I think I will. jaimeal@jazzfree.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curry Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 Aztec, where did you meet this dude to get a game with him? I take it that he is not in the SC PBEM league. So just wondering. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kossuth Posted July 5, 2004 Share Posted July 5, 2004 piuuhhh ! ! it was not my name that was the one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztecace Posted July 5, 2004 Author Share Posted July 5, 2004 Originally posted by Curry: Aztec, where did you meet this dude to get a game with him? I take it that he is not in the SC PBEM league. So just wondering. ? I asked for a game on this board and he responded. Here is the Thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDog944 Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Aztecace, are you interested in starting another game with a medium-skill player? No cheating, I promise! I'm BigDog on the PBEM ladder. Let me know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_j_rambo Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 Case looks closed, very cut & dry. The MMPs don't add up to the 3-extra LF, 2-chit minimum, & tank. The guilty needs to repent & quickly. The mob is coming, the hangman has the noose, & we're bored... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade Trapp Posted July 8, 2004 Share Posted July 8, 2004 Been on vacation for the past few days and just got back today, glad to see this little problem was solved. Profile for thb Member Status: Junior Member Member Number: 15212 Registered: May 24, 2004 Posts: 3 Email Address: jaimeal@jazzfree.comJudging by the guy's profile, I doubt we will be seeing him again under this screen name again. He only made 3 posts, all of which were made on the day he registered and all were made in the "Opponent Finder Forum: English Speaking Players". If we see this guy again, he will probably be under a different screen name. Luckily, we have the little bastard's e-mail address so its all good. Like Rambo said, this one is pretty cut and dry, we got proof and we got his e-mail address, can't do much better than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuniworth Posted July 8, 2004 Share Posted July 8, 2004 Best of all, we got his members number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts