lcm1947 Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 I HAVE LOOKED AND LOOKED TO TRY TO DETERMINE THE CARTRIDGE THAT THE RUSSIANS WILL BE USING IN CM2 AND HAVE FAILED TO FIND IT. THE ONE BOOK I'M USING JUST DOESN'T LIST IT OR MORE THEN LIKELY JUST NOT MENTION IT IN THAT SENSE. ANYBODY KNOW? I ASSUME THAT THEY USED BOLT ACTION RIFLES ALSO? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Johnson-- Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 ummm, they used the 14.5 extensively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pzman Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Frist thing stop yelling. Second well like you I have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcm1947 Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 You two guys must be gooffing off like I am waiting for tomorrow. But thanks for the anwer Mr. Johnson and I'm not yelling but know what you mean so I shall quit it. Didn't mean to yell. Sorry, sorry. Anyway, now I can look it up to see the figures on it. Hope it's a good round but probably not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PzKpfw 1 Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 7.62mm in the rifles, 7.62 x 25mm in the SMGs. 7.62 x 54R in the LMGs's. Regards, John Waters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapdragon Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lcm1947: You two guys must be gooffing off like I am waiting for tomorrow. But thanks for the anwer Mr. Johnson and I'm not yelling but know what you mean so I shall quit it. Didn't mean to yell. Sorry, sorry. Anyway, now I can look it up to see the figures on it. Hope it's a good round but probably not.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> ICM, they are fooling you. The Russians used a 7.62 Russian cartridge in rfiles, and a 7.62 Mauser (loaded hot) in SMG. The 14.5 was an ATR cartridge. A 12.7x108mm HMG cart was used also. I will send you any date you like on these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcm1947 Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 So, we have funny people on the board. Boy would I have looked far and wide trying to locate the 14.5mm. That wasn't very nice Mr. Johnson but I enjoy a good joke now and again myself so you are forgiven. This once. Well, I thank you PzKpFw 1 and Slapdragon for answering then. I know those calibers are in the book but must just not plainly mention it so I'll do some reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mensch Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 I thought they use the Cartrage Family? *snicker*... ok i shut up now. *shuffles off* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Johnson-- Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 hehehe, I was just kidding. I can't wait to use that 12.7mm HMG. Thats gonna be fun. Plus considering how many of those 14.5mm ATRs in the Russian TO&E its gonna be like MG fire from them all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr. Johnson-<THC>-: hehehe, I was just kidding. I can't wait to use that 12.7mm HMG. Thats gonna be fun. Plus considering how many of those 14.5mm ATRs in the Russian TO&E its gonna be like MG fire from them all.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The russian 14.5mm MG uses the ATR round doesnt it? So it literally is a full auto ATR. Some of the russian ATR are semi-auto also. The russian 12.7mm (literally 50 cal) is a shorter cartridge than the US 50 cal. Sort of a '50 cal Kurtz' Lewis Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalin's Organ Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Last eyar I got to fire a M1944 Moison Nagant - a shortened version of het standard russian rifle with a fixed folding bayonet. The bloody thing kicked like a mule, barked like a dog, and had a muzzle flash like a dragon!! (all in comparison to an SMLE I used the same day!) 7.62 x 54mm IIRC - a very big necked cartridge compared to the .303. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapdragon Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Username: The russian 14.5mm MG uses the ATR round doesnt it? So it literally is a full auto ATR. Some of the russian ATR are semi-auto also. The russian 12.7mm (literally 50 cal) is a shorter cartridge than the US 50 cal. Sort of a '50 cal Kurtz' Lewis Lewis<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The Russian HMG round is officially 12.7x108mm. The US round is 12.7x99mm, so it is actually the US round that is (slightly) smaller. The KPV round is 14.5x114mm, and was used in the PTRS ATR, but was not adopted to machinegun use until 1954 with the KPV, and then usually as an anti aircraft mounting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slapdragon: The Russian HMG round is officially 12.7x108mm. The US round is 12.7x99mm, so it is actually the US round that is (slightly) smaller. The KPV round is 14.5x114mm, and was used in the PTRS ATR, but was not adopted to machinegun use until 1954 with the KPV, and then usually as an anti aircraft mounting.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well done Slappy... that should shut him up! BTW, how can you have a folding bayonet that's fixed? Isn't that a contradiction of terms? :confused: Regards Jim R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapdragon Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kanonier Reichmann: Well done Slappy... that should shut him up! BTW, how can you have a folding bayonet that's fixed? Isn't that a contradiction of terms? :confused: Regards Jim R.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kanonier Reichmann: Well done Slappy... that should shut him up! BTW, how can you have a folding bayonet that's fixed? Isn't that a contradiction of terms? :confused: Regards Jim R.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> It's fixed to the rifle, not fixed in place for action. I own both the long and the carbine versions, but you know, I've never actually fired them. After reading the description here, perhaps I needn't bother! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Sorry, I was looking at a 12.7 x 80SR Vickers '50 cal' in a book. Its sort of a stubby 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGSF Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: I own both the long and the carbine versions, but you know, I've never actually fired them. After reading the description here, perhaps I needn't bother!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Heh! I own an M1944 Moisin Nagant, amongst other things, and it's a "hoot to shoot". Not only is it as described - loud, smokey, kicks, and lots of muzzle flash, but there is even flash around the receiver! Can be a lttle disconcerting. The rifle is also "balanced" to be fired with the bayonet extended. This prompts the occasional comment from other nearby shooters. OGSF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 http://www.rt66.com/~korteng/SmallArms/boysat.htm Thbis site shows a 14.5mm and the british 50 cal I thought was a soviet 12.7mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalin's Organ Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Thanks Michael for pointing out the bleedin' obvious to those without the appropriate knowledge!! I fired a long rifle Moison the same day too I think - it didn't have any of the problems of the short one that I can recall - presumably the powder all burned before the bullet left the barrel! But the action was still rough compared to the SMLE. Hey OGSF - could you please revert to your native tongue - I'm having trouble reading what you post in English! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted July 5, 2001 Share Posted July 5, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stalin's Organ: Thanks Michael for pointing out the bleedin' obvious to those without the appropriate knowledge!! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Jeez, these bloody Kiwi's are a sensitive lot! Regards Jim R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapdragon Posted July 5, 2001 Share Posted July 5, 2001 Comes from identifying with Xena and Hercules to much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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