M Hofbauer Posted October 3, 2001 Share Posted October 3, 2001 in a recent thread, someone among other things mentioned he would like to see operations having battles with more than 20 turns possible. I really like that. I would like to take this further. The ideal thing for someone like me would be a dedicated campaign game. Start out in 1941 with your company/battalion combat team, then play respective randomized (QB) battles at a frequency of 2 per month (or any other rate). Try to maintain your force yet achieve your mission, witness vehicle updates over time and reconfigure your tactics around the new vehicles. This is about the single biggest improvement IMO which for would radically increase the value of the "old" CM engine within a feasible amount of coding neccessary. btw: I know it's a dead horse. But even dead horses need to be dealt with. You can dispose of them, or you can make salami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted October 3, 2001 Share Posted October 3, 2001 A campaign Game has got my vote as well. If you direct me to the ballot box I will do my best to stuff it with yes votes for this sort of add-on. Dead horse or not….It looks like a large group of folks have actually taken it upon themselves to create some sort CM campaign. I don't know all the details, but I get the impression they are using an Operational level wargame to generate CM battles (Operational Art of War perhaps??). Some folks handle operational movements and other folks fight the CM tactical battles. Sounded pretty cool. Now if this level of player initiative isn't an indication of the popularity of this campaign game add-on idea I dunno what is. [ 10-03-2001: Message edited by: Jeff Duquette ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herr Kruger Posted October 3, 2001 Share Posted October 3, 2001 I find the idea of a campaign game very appealing, especially if it tracks your stats in a detailed maner... men lost, enemy casualties inflicted (known and after you are done the actual number etc...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 3, 2001 Share Posted October 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeff Duquette: Dead horse or not….It looks like a large group of folks have actually taken it upon themselves to create some sort CM campaign. I don't know all the details, but I get the impression they are using an Operational level wargame to generate CM battles (Operational Art of War perhaps??). Some folks handle operational movements and other folks fight the CM tactical battles. Sounded pretty cool. Now if this level of player initiative isn't an indication of the popularity of this campaign game add-on idea I dunno what is.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Jeff, if you are talking about CMMC, it actually uses custom-made software and human GMs, as well as CMBO. Email me if you want to find out more or play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 4, 2001 Share Posted October 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Herr Kruger: I find the idea of a campaign game very appealing, especially if it tracks your stats in a detailed maner... men lost, enemy casualties inflicted (known and after you are done the actual number etc...)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> CMMC is better than that - it is larger than life. So there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted October 4, 2001 Share Posted October 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Anglophile: ... it is larger than life ...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> ... just like Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 4, 2001 Share Posted October 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JonS: ... just like Andreas <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hehe - I am not an Anglophile though. Tomorrow morning when I wait for my train (again) I will roundly curse this dastardly country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Hofbauer Posted October 4, 2001 Author Share Posted October 4, 2001 Jeff, although I do not know it intricately I am *sure* those campaigns done by these people are a *great* campaign game and add atmosphere and increased fun to the game in a multiplayer environment. That's the catch. I do like h2h, too, though it's been a while now that I've been playing that way. I cannot subscribe to such an undertaking in temrs of commitment neccessary. I would like something remotely like that - even much less sophisticated - to play vs AI. Just a step up from the current operation type we have now (at least the statistics work now since the last patch). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted October 4, 2001 Share Posted October 4, 2001 Concerning the CMMC, to paraphrase Abraham Lincoln, if you like that sort of thing, it's the sort of thing you'll like. It takes a lot of time and dedication, and you've got to be able to put up with long delays. ScoutPL and ... someone else; blast, I can't remember who it was ... were organizing smaller, more abstract campaigns that would presumably be faster-paced. I haven't seen anything about these recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted October 4, 2001 Share Posted October 4, 2001 Why thank you for the kind invite Germanboy…you're a scholar and a gentleman. Unfortunately I'm in about the same boat as Marcus in that I love head to head play, but don't have the sort of time I would like to devote to head to head play. I typically have one or two pbem games going than wife time or work time takes over. Ok…I'm whipped…I freely admit it. I would like a solid campaign game add-on to the CM system that I can play solitaire on those occasions when the time becomes available to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted October 4, 2001 Share Posted October 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeff Duquette: Why thank you for the kind invite Germanboy…you're a scholar and a gentleman.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> He's a gentleman and a scholar. And there are damn few of us left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeff Duquette: Why thank you for the kind invite Germanboy…you're a scholar and a gentleman. Unfortunately I'm in about the same boat as Marcus in that I love head to head play, but don't have the sort of time I would like to devote to head to head play. I typically have one or two pbem games going than wife time or work time takes over. Ok…I'm whipped…I freely admit it. I would like a solid campaign game add-on to the CM system that I can play solitaire on those occasions when the time becomes available to me.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Thanks for the compliment, Jeff and Leland. Jeff, considered some light staff work? Much less work, and no commitment in terms of battles that have to be finished. Positions going on both sides I believe, but inquire with James. As interesting as actually fighting the battles, if that is your poison . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Alkema Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 I like the idea of a campaign game for two reasons. 1) it puts the battle in some sort of context and makes it have consequences. 2) It gives you a reason to retreat when you are outmatched. You can get those things in an Operation (although I am not sure what happens if you retreat all the way off the map) but an actual campaign would allow more fexibility. Exploit victory, deal with defeat, attack in unexpected places against inferior forces. All that good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Harrison Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 i know this has been brought up before, and i said the same thing back then, but ill say it again! one thing that CM in its near perfection still lacks is a continuous campaign option. obviously playing one person would be hard to model, but what if we could play as a company commander from beggining to end of the war? supplies, replacements, expereince, and all that fun stuff would come into play. i loved on the old SL how you could play as a SGT and move your way up through the ranks with experience points. WHAT HAS BTS EVER SAID ABOUT A CONTINOUS CAMPAIGN? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foobar Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 Band of Brothers, combat mission player's group... The Winter War camapign I am currently involved is spectacular. Relatively fast paced, great GM, and good players. There is also an Italian campaign in the works. I know very little about it, but check it out for yourselves http://stryker1.home.att.net/index.htm Also, I am heading up the allies in the new SopCCM campaign, with only 6-8 players. Hasn't started yet, but I am sure it will be fun too... Track down ScoutPL and tell him, if you want to play. I am certain we will need some alternates (I got into Winter War as an alternate) I am also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chad Harrison: WHAT HAS BTS EVER SAID ABOUT A CONTINOUS CAMPAIGN?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> That they won't do it in the style you describe. You can have a look in Russel's FAQ, where I believe he quotes me outlining the reasoning, based on a number of posts by BTS, or you can do a search with Steve's member number and campaign as key. Will be a while back though. Or you can trust me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 Germanboy, What is involved in being a member of the "staff" in the CMMC campaign? Thx. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Commissar: Germanboy, What is involved in being a member of the "staff" in the CMMC campaign? Thx.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Being able to run COCAT, taking work of the commanding officer, e.g. creating map files, collating spotting info from various units. Assisting in planning, helping to keep the fort down at HQ, that sort of thing. Leg work. Nothing glorious, and you have to take orders. The enticement is that you get to watch the operational game unfold, and are a part of it. Smaller engagements are often fought by staff officers who volunteer for fighting, but don't want a permanent command. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 Germanboy, When you mentioned "map design", do you mean the in-game "world" or an actual map? Ive had some experience with the former, but Im afraid the later would leave me stupified. In any case, where can I look for a position of this sort? Things have been slowing down lately, and random QB's at CMTH aren't the same anymore. Nice to be a "part of something". Thanks again, btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumbo2 Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 Yes to sign my name next to the "campaigns are cool" box. I would dearly love to see a Steel Pathers style campaign generator in CM2 so I can play a series of solo battles. Unfortunateky BTS has rejected this in the past as they believe such a system is unrealistic. I disagree but hey its their game and frankly i will buy CM2 any way so I guess Ii am on the hook Maybe we can eventually change their minds UPDATE: My bad here is BTS's actual response rather than me putting words into their mouth. "Will there be a campaign system added to the game? "We currently have THREE folks asking to make a huge campaign system of one form or another. All three have made multiple detailed pitches to us. All three have started by saying all they need is the file format. All three have then described a system that requires much more involvement from us than just that to make their system work. We haven't rulled any of the three out (yet), but to be honest... I just don't see how it will be possible to do any of them. We know there is interest (though we don't think it is more than a decent minority of customers), but on balance it isn't as important as the other things we have to do. Remember, any campaign system is only as good as the tactical battles they contain. If we skip something major in order to do the campaign stuff, everybody suffers the loss.{correction. I made this sound worse than it really is. Let's just say that we are skeptical that "just an export file" will be enough. So we porceed with caution, but are still looking at the proposals I mentioned seriously." -Steve" [ 10-04-2001: Message edited by: dumbo2 ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 How bout an add-on than. Seperate disk...seperate purchase. I'm up for. TOAW did this several times with add-ons or scenario packs that could be purchased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Commissar: Germanboy, When you mentioned "map design", do you mean the in-game "world" or an actual map? Ive had some experience with the former, but Im afraid the later would leave me stupified. In any case, where can I look for a position of this sort? Things have been slowing down lately, and random QB's at CMTH aren't the same anymore. Nice to be a "part of something". Thanks again, btw.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Sorry - what I really meant was making maps in COCAT (you need a PC), although there maybe a need for making maps for battles (unlike in CPX, maps are bespoke in CMMC). Contact me at the email in my profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted October 5, 2001 Share Posted October 5, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Germanboy: Thanks for the compliment, Jeff and Leland.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, I was going more for the self-aggrandizement, but there's nothing wrong with a little collateral aggrandizement along with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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