Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 i have a question about the uniforms in cmbb. i have noticed from the sneak peeks of the game on the cmhq site that there is no winter cammo. i saw a winter map with russian soldiers running around in the snow wearing brown uniforms, and it made no sense to me. are we going to have to download winter mods for cmbb? the russians commonly dressed in white during the winter, as did the germans so i was just wondering if this will be modeled or not :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 The screenshots you saw very months outdated by the time they were posted, Iron Chef. Don't worry - I'm sure we will have uniforms-a-plenty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sitzkrieg Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by The Commissar: Don't worry - I'm sure we will have uniforms-a-plenty. <hr></blockquote> Especially once the modders get rolling on CMBB. Andrew, you listening? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 The brown winter clothes is accurate. The Russians used a padded-type jacket (forgot what it's called). You can find many photos of it, particuarly photos of Soviet troops in Berlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 13, 2001 Author Share Posted December 13, 2001 in the winter months though, the soviets would wear white, the soviets were not in berlin until april right? the germans, after the winter of 41 also used winter cammo for their soldiers and vehicles, on both fronts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 13, 2001 Author Share Posted December 13, 2001 i still can't beleive they are doing the whole eastern war, 41-45. i'm still having a blast with cmbo and that does'nt even cover a whole year, and it's still my favorite game right now. oh by the way, i recently reformated my computer so lost my mods. the site where i got my mods is gone now, they were soem realy good mods too, would you by any chance know of a realy good site for mods? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zitadelle Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 Iron Chef- The Russians had two winter uniform combinations. Either they would wear white coveralls or a white insulated coat- that you are thinking about. Or, they would wear the khaki padded coat (the 'telogreika'). The padded coat was also worn during other months as well. There are photos of Russian assualt troops wearing it during Operation Bagration (S. Zaloga)- which was in late June/early July. For warmer months, or fighting on the southern fronts, Russians had a lighter weight khaki uniform as well. The padded uniforms- and especially the felt mittens- were highly desired by German forces throughout the eastern campaigns. German troops were generally not issued the white or reversible overalls for the first winter (1941-42). A few were sent to the ostfront, but the Germans mostly used what they could get off of dead Russians. By the way, the padded trousers were called: 'vatnie sharovari.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 I am looking forward to the mod where the Germans wear their white underwear overtop of their wool uniforms as a form of expedient winter camo (41-42) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Zitadelle: Iron Chef- The Russians had two winter uniform combinations. Either they would wear white coveralls or a white insulated coat- that you are thinking about. Or, they would wear the khaki padded coat (the 'telogreika'). The padded coat was also worn during other months as well. There are photos of Russian assualt troops wearing it during Operation Bagration (S. Zaloga)- which was in late June/early July. For warmer months, or fighting on the southern fronts, Russians had a lighter weight khaki uniform as well. The padded uniforms- and especially the felt mittens- were highly desired by German forces throughout the eastern campaigns. German troops were generally not issued the white or reversible overalls for the first winter (1941-42). A few were sent to the ostfront, but the Germans mostly used what they could get off of dead Russians. By the way, the padded trousers were called: 'vatnie sharovari.'<hr></blockquote> What were the padded uniforms made out of? If it was warm enough to wear during the winter months I would hate to wear that thing during the summer. Someday, I'll have to get me a good replica of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 13, 2001 Author Share Posted December 13, 2001 the russians had great winter boots as well, these were also a highly prized item for the beleguered german troops during the winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 13, 2001 Author Share Posted December 13, 2001 Dorosh, that link to the cmbb forum is nice!! finaly a mod for cmbo where the german infantry are not dressed in battleship grey!!! i can now use the same green in wich they actualy had. why do all games model the germans in grey? whether it was axis and allies years ago or this game or anyhting inbetween, the germans have to be grey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zitadelle Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 Commissar- I will check on the composition of the uniform and get back to you. I agree, I am not sure that the padded jacket would be the most comfortable thing during Russian summers (maybe a little more tolerable in the Baltic states). Then again and as you know, the Russian army didn't really care for the comfort of the troops. "Yes, comrade, we have "winterwear, summerwear, and swimwear. Very nice."* I've seen photos where they would wear the jacket only during the warmer season (if not issued the fully khaki uniform). *Old 1980s commerical reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 An interesting bit about boots in winter. It was common Russian practice to pack their boots with straw to give them a degree of insulation. sounds crude, but apparently it was affective. Oh, yes. And no Russian socks. It took some skill to wind a sorta 'foot scarf' (my term) around the foot properly. I remember an old TV documentary (circa 1983 or so?) showing then-modern Soviet conscripts still being taught the foot-scarf technique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 Veteran German soldiers also used footwraps. You are right, there was an art to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 14, 2001 Author Share Posted December 14, 2001 you would think the germans would have been better equiped for winter fighting since they were in league with Finland, who were excelent winter fighters. i understand the germans expected a quick victory, but you would have thought there would have been some kind of plan b. i guess thats what happens when an army catches the vicotry bug, take a look at the japanese for an equel if not better example during that period. also, i have a question concerning sweden during 1940. i understand they were neutral, but why did they not come to the aid of Finland? i would rather Finland as a nieghbor then stalin's soviet russia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>by Michale Dorosh: I am looking forward to the mod where the Germans wear their white underwear overtop of their wool uniforms as a form of expedient winter camo (41-42) <hr></blockquote> Stains will be visible in the high res mods. Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 14, 2001 Author Share Posted December 14, 2001 will flags come in white as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zitadelle Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 PART I <blockquote>quote:</font><hr> you would think the germans would have been better equiped for winter fighting since they were in league with Finland, who were excelent winter fighters. i understand the germans expected a quick victory, but you would have thought there would have been some kind of plan b. <hr></blockquote> The truth of the matter is that in 1939-41 Germany and Finland were not "in league"- remember Germany had the Non-agression Treaty with the USSR until June, 1941. Germany could not actively support nor establish strong relations with Finland while the USSR was invading. Also, German strategy/tactics were far different from Finish strategy/tactics, and thus the methodology and equipment for fighting were different as well. Finland was also fighting a defensive conflict- not offensive. PART II <blockquote>quote:</font><hr> ...i have a question concerning sweden during 1940. i understand they were neutral, but why did they not come to the aid of Finland? i would rather Finland as a nieghbor then stalin's soviet russia.... <hr></blockquote> I recommend that you read William Trotter's book Frozen Hell; a book about the Finish/Russian War 1939-40. The book presents an excellent overview of the Winter War, and includes political analysis of the key players on the political front- England, Norway, France, Germany, Sweden, and of course, USSR and Finland. Sweden also realized that the threat would be greater if they were to ally with Finland- it what they believed was a lost war. They were even resistant to allowing British and German arms to be shipping through their ports and along their roads to Finland. I guess a major theme to this message is question generalized beliefs about World War II alliances- particularly in the first year. European politics in 1939-41 were very interesting. For example, in 1939 and early 1940, both France and Britain explored establishing alliances with Italy. They thought that Italy would be a cooling element to control Hitler's Germany, and Italy was a vocal anti-Bolshevik which was more in par with British and French politics. (USSR was not looked upon favorably after the Non-Agression Act and its actions in Finland). Also, the "Axis minor allies" were not immediate actors, and even then did not always blindly follow policies dictated from Germany. Remember, England strongly considering invading Norway in 1940.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Iron Chef Sakai: also, i have a question concerning sweden during 1940. i understand they were neutral, but why did they not come to the aid of Finland? i would rather Finland as a nieghbor then stalin's soviet russia.<hr></blockquote> Look at your map: southern Sweden is very close to Germany, and Germany was for Soviet Union at the time being as it needed to ensure being able to deal with France and Britain. And in 1940 Germany invaded Denmark and Norway, so I understand that fear. Also, the nazi-talks about blue-eyed blond supermen was sort of flattery to hear for Swedish statesmen! Actually some of the biggest supporters of Finland were Great Britain and Italy. As you can see, during WW2 alliances were formed randomly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Chef Sakai Posted December 14, 2001 Author Share Posted December 14, 2001 thats true, also how come no one declared war on russia in 1939? they invaded poland as well, then waged a war on finland for no good reason. it would have been great if both the 3rd reich and the soviet union could have been toppled in world war 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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