illo Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 My Königs Tiger just got knocked out by single Stuart from 12oc at 600m. Front turret weak spot penetration. Is this realistic...any accounts of US 37mm penetrating KTs Henschel front turret from ww2? Is this even possible in theory? ...i can not see how. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 There is one recorded incident during the war that I have read of in which a M5 Ko'd a KingTiger. It was apparently a grill-doors shot from about 50 meters. The KT was wallowing about in the base of a soggie gully. The Stuart was firing from above and to the rear of the KT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 Also came across a tale of an M8 that took out a Tiger I by several shots in the pooper. The M8 was apparently in an ambush position somewheres' in Belgium (Late 44 early 45). Along comes this Tiger down the road. The M8 falls in behind the Tiger and accelerates to within 30 or 40 meters. The Tiger was apparently unaware of the pending doom approaching its arse. As the story goes; first 37mm round bounced off...tiger begins to traverse to swat this fly...second 37mm round fired from point blank kills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Steiner Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 I agree, a frontal penetration of a KT by a Stuart is total BS. Rear shots into the engine compartment yes, but definitely not from the front, "turret weak spots" notwithstanding.. ------------------ Ob's stürmt oder schneit, ob die Sonne uns lacht, der Tag glühend heiß oder eiskalt die Nacht, bestaubt sind die Gesichter, doch froh ist unser sinn, ja unser sinn, es braust unser Panzer im Sturmwind dahin -- Panzerlied Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 MacDonald's "A Time for Trumpets" also has an account of a probable frontal Panther kill by an M8 Greyhound. No one was more surprised than the M8 crew, apparently. Not exactly on topic, but I thought it was interesting. -dale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sgt. Steiner: I agree, a frontal penetration of a KT by a Stuart is total BS. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Relax. Maybe it was a ricochet down into a hatch cover or something. **** happens. -dalem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 Sounds like Chaos Theory. Maybe the armour was brittle and the impact shattered the entire vehicle? =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mikey D Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 Front TURRET penetration? Weird. Maybe it went straight through the mg opening! As likely as winning the lottery. I have heard of the bow mg ball mount being driven back into the vehicle when hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dittohead Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 In theory the KT did have a weak spot on the front that could be penetrated. But there is no documented evidence that this ever happened. Plus in WWII very rarely did stuarts engage KT. The laws of probability just caught up to you. Now on another note, in theory and in practice the turrets of Panthers could be traversed quickly. Shhhhh Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pain Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 I had some other weird thing. My Flak 37mm killed a Sherman with "weak-point-front-turret-penetration". I was very surprised, but also very happy of it. My PBEM-opponent wasn't that pleased of it Greez Pain ------------------ War is in my heart Death is by my side! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Now on another note, in theory and in practice the turrets of Panthers could be traversed quickly. Shhhhh<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> heh heh my lips are sealed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasper Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 Ya know - driving your M8 that close might not be a foolish as I first thought. The traverse time for the Tiger was very slow if I recall. Could an M8 drive around the Tiger faster than the turret could transverse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vergeltungswaffe Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 It is absolutely, positively possible. But, historically, there is no record of frontal penetration of a KT. No pictures, no anecdotal evidence, no reports. None. Not even by the Russians, who are veeery liberal with the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindan Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 It had to happen sooner or later. If my ancestors could have fielded the ten thousands King Tigers that were used in the games all of us played, I'm sure we had our documented case. (only if there would have been something left to shoot back of course..) ------------------ ----------------------- Croda: "You hang out with a guy named "Warphead?" "Nuts!" " visit lindan.panzershark.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Vergeltungswaffe said: But, historically, there is no record of frontal penetration of a KT.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> From: Belton Cooper Death Traps, The Survival of an American Armored Division in WWII” Pg 257. Cooper was an ordnance officer serving with the 3rd Armored Division. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I had always been curious about the actual penetrating power of a panzerfaust and also about the strength of the armor on a King Tiger. I felt it was a good time to test out both. I told Wrayford to give me one of the 100-meter panzerfausts. I took the panzerfaust and paced off approximately thirty yards directly in front of the tank. I set the sight for thirty yards and aimed directly at a ten-inch-square patch of the forward turret faceplate just to one side of the gun mantlet. I fired, and the panzerfaust struck it dead center. There was a tremendous explosion, and we were showered with small cement particles. (The Germans covered their tanks with a thin layer of cement to protect them from magnetic mines.) The blast center was about four inches to the right of the aperture where the machine gun came through the faceplate. Upon closer examination, I could see a distinct penetration about a half inch to three-quarters of an inch in diameter on the outside that went all the way through the faceplate of the turret and opened out about half an inch in diameter on the inside. The hole was complete all the way through the eight-and-a-half-inch turret faceplate.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniversalWolf Posted December 22, 2000 Share Posted December 22, 2000 What about a 37mm shell down the barrel of the 88mm gun? That's a theoretical weak spot, isn't it? Especially if they were in the midst of reloading. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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