Juardis Posted July 17, 2000 Share Posted July 17, 2000 I did a search on Ambush (lots and lots of posts), but I didn't find the answer. Found other useful info though... Anyway, last night I had 2 ambushes setup on opposite sides of the map. In both cases I had piats laying the ambush marker. At the start of the turn, both piats are targetting the ambush markers (red line from piat to marker). Great. Action phase starts and german armor slowly rolls toward marker. Piats still targeting the marker. As the armor gets to within 10 m of marker, the targetting line from the piat disappears. It does not shift to the armor (which would indicate a triggered ambush), but it just completely disappears. My piats are NOT underfire, are not hiding, are not being suppressed, and are regular quality troops. So what happened in both cases was that the armor rolled right through the ambush point, past my piats, and into my hidden forces behind. WTF? My piats did reacquire the armor as it was going past, but it took a while for them to get off a shot and by then the armor was already in the midst of my hidden troops. What causes this? ------------------ Jeff Abbott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted July 17, 2000 Share Posted July 17, 2000 Did the PIATs have LOS to the point where the armor stopped? If not, that might be why what happened did. The tanks were close enough to "activate" the Ambush marker, but the PIATs couldn't see them. I usually try to place ambush markers a little beyond where I expect to actually have LOS to get around this. ------------------ "Belly to belly and everything's better" - Russian proverb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Los Posted July 17, 2000 Share Posted July 17, 2000 I have experienced in real life enemies moving through the kill zone without anyone firing a shot on several occasions as well as witnessed (at NTC) enemy forces even companies of armor moving through carefully set up anti-armor kill zones with everyone watching and reporting what's going on without anyone opening fire until it's too due to errors of coordination and ommissions of seemingly minor details in the fire plan. The **** happens for real. Los Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted July 17, 2000 Share Posted July 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Los: I have experienced in real life enemies moving through the kill zone without anyone firing a shot on several occasions as well as witnessed (at NTC) enemy forces even companies of armor moving through carefully set up anti-armor kill zones with everyone watching and reporting what's going on without anyone opening fire until it's too due to errors of coordination and ommissions of seemingly minor details in the fire plan. The **** happens for real. Los <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ah, memories. Why did that sort of thing never seem to happen to the OPFOR? Better still, having friendly recon elements falling back the wrong way and triggering the ambush! ------------------ "Belly to belly and everything's better" - Russian proverb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L4Pilot Posted July 17, 2000 Share Posted July 17, 2000 I had the same thing happen with a Hellcat in a Bulge scenario. Panther drove directly over the ambush marker without triggering fire from the Hellcat. I suspect ADD (Ambush Deficit Disorder) Or else a good Glenn Miller tune was playing on the radio.... The target line diasppeared like yours did, too. If there is some probability that an ambush marker is going to be ignored by it's originator, then BTS should make that clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juju Posted July 18, 2000 Share Posted July 18, 2000 What happened to me was that a Sherman rolled into my ambush. Dutyfully 2 schrecks, an infantry squad and a 75mm inf. gun opened up (all at 20 to 60 meters)... and missed!! The Sherman just went on its merry way, right into my rear area, which was completely undefended (large map). It didn't slow, it didn't accelerate. It just dissapeared into the night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeybutt Posted July 18, 2000 Share Posted July 18, 2000 Yes I've seen tanks just roll throght the ambush spot I had set up for a bazooka team.I think the bazooka men were too busy picking their nose to pay much attention to the battle. -Monkeybutt ------------------ The Combat Mission Scenario Dump! http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/3805/Cm.html [This message has been edited by Monkeybutt (edited 07-17-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted July 18, 2000 Author Share Posted July 18, 2000 Well, I feel somewhat better now that I know it's happened to other people as well. But even so, it's frustrating to setup a well laid ambush and not have it go off. If this is supposed to happen to model miscommunication, fine, I can live with that so long as it works more than it fails. And yes, I did have a clear LOS from the ambush marker and all along the path the armor took. I was next to a road and the armor was on the road, coming at me, then past me, no more than 10 m from where I was. BTW, one interesting tidbit I learned during my search. During the setup phase, move your HQ units to different positions and setup ambush markers all around the map at opportune locations, then place your HQ where you normally would. When the turns start, you'll have ambush markers to focus fire on much more rapidly (and efficiently in the case of mortars) than you would have otherwise. ------------------ Jeff Abbott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiwiJoe Posted July 18, 2000 Share Posted July 18, 2000 Man that pretty bloody gamey... in fact thats almost cheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted July 18, 2000 Author Share Posted July 18, 2000 Not really Kiwi. This simulates the fact that a commander would have the chance to scout out the terrain prior to a battle. I mean, one has to have a good idea as to where to attack or where an attack will come from prior to it happening. So it only makes sense to plot up some mortar fire on those positions...just in case. I would if I were the commander. ------------------ Jeff Abbott [This message has been edited by Juardis (edited 07-17-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Posted July 18, 2000 Share Posted July 18, 2000 Errr....if it was around 3pm, I think the Brits stopped the war for an afternoon brew of tea! Mace <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Juardis: <snip> So what happened in both cases was that the armor rolled right through the ambush point, past my piats, and into my hidden forces behind. WTF? My piats did reacquire the armor as it was going past, but it took a while for them to get off a shot and by then the armor was already in the midst of my hidden troops. What causes this? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Lucke Posted July 18, 2000 Share Posted July 18, 2000 Where yr AT teams hiding initally? How fast was the triggering unit moving? I've had ambushes like yours run afoul because the AT team has to rise up from the prone position, acquire the target, estimate it's speed, give it some lead, and then fir--- Oops! Target all gone! I tend to do like IW suggested --- give your ambushers some lag time after the ambush marker to really pop the target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted July 18, 2000 Author Share Posted July 18, 2000 Well, I've seen advice for both setting the marker before where you want it and after where you want it, depending on troop quality (more crack it is, the closer you place the marker to where you really want it). Some have supposed that green troops will fire before the ambush marker is reached, so place the marker 20 m further on than where you want it. You suggest putting the marker 20 m in front of where you want it. Guess only experience will tell. Regards ------------------ Jeff Abbott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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