Doug Beman Posted June 1, 1999 Share Posted June 1, 1999 I noticed just now, reading through the list of included vehicles/stuff in the game, that there is no mention of AT guns. If my impression is correct, what led you guys to write off AT guns--notably the 88, but also the British 76.2 and US 90? My pet theory is that, at that stage in the war, (post-Normandy landing) AT guns had been largely surpassed by tanks SP guns mounting potent AT guns, and also towed guns had become too vulnerable to all the other stuff on the battlefield (something that can be noted and watched in games like CC3 and SP; the 88 rules for a while, but then the enemy gets vehicles that fire useful HE shells, and it's all over) DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixman Posted June 1, 1999 Share Posted June 1, 1999 Nowhere in the history I have read was it ever "over" for the German 88. Conversely, it was usually "over" for whatever it targeted. I know that BTS has modeled the American 57mm. I cannot imagine the 88, signature weapon of the Wehrmacht, was left out of CM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted June 1, 1999 Share Posted June 1, 1999 Not to fear! A game at this scale without AT guns would be the same as a game without tanks. They were VERY important and can not be left out at all. The reason you have seen no specific mention of them is that we have only listed vehicles. AT guns, artillery, small arms, etc. are all included by are not specifically listed anywhere. The Germans will certianly have 75mm and 88mm AT guns, as well as 20mm and 88mm Flak guns (maybe even quad 20mms amd 30mm stand alone Flak guns too). We also think that there were still a decent number of 50mm AT guns still in service with units in Normandy, so we might include them as well. Brits and Yanks will get their fair share or historical AT guns as well. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted June 1, 1999 Author Share Posted June 1, 1999 Ah. I see now. Moo, moo moo. Hope everybody had a safe and enjoyable Memorial Day weekend, and maybe thought a little about what it means. Regards, DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixman Posted June 2, 1999 Share Posted June 2, 1999 Thanks Steve. While we're on the subject of AT guns, a few questions: 1.) Have you modeled the protection they provide the crews along their covered arc? 2.) If so, is this done with penetration and damage effect algorithms, similar to your approach to AFVs? Also, I see that the Wirbelwind will be in the game. This makes me very happy (as long as I am playing the German side!) As you know, it was technically an AAA weapon but was used to great effect firing horizontally at ground targets (like the 88). Will it be used in this way in CM? If so, any comments on it's rate of fire and firepower? Thanks for taking the time to answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted June 2, 1999 Share Posted June 2, 1999 AT gun protection is indeed simulated. To the best of my knowledge the physics are not the same as vehicles because pretty much anything from 50cal up can go straight through any of the shields. The shields were meant to protect the crew (or part of the crew) from small arms fire and small shell fragments only. No clue about the firepower of a Quad 20mm AA gun system. I can say that a single 20mm AA gun kicks ass, so I can only imagine what 4 of them would do Like all vehicles, the Wirbelwind's guns rotate and elevate/depress just like the real thing. So if the vehicle in question could be used for direct fire purposes, it can in CM. Yet another benefit of using real world physics is that things just work right, without hardcoding crap like "DF=true" somewhere in the code. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted August 8, 2000 Share Posted August 8, 2000 Dear BTS, I know this thread is ancient, but I remembered something which might help. The PAK-40's shield was made of spaced armor and was specifically designed to defeat the Soviet 14.5mm AT rifles. It should, therefore, do quite well against .50 caliber MG fire. Regards, John Kettler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Posted August 8, 2000 Share Posted August 8, 2000 one of my favorite weapons in the game as the germans is a halftrack with a 37 mm flak gun mounted on the rear. bam bam bam! infantry hits the dirt. Then those damn infantry toss gernades from the nearby woods and no more flak gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Posted August 8, 2000 Share Posted August 8, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tiger: one of my favorite weapons in the game as the germans is a halftrack with a 37 mm flak gun mounted on the rear. bam bam bam! infantry hits the dirt. Then those damn infantry toss gernades from the nearby woods and no more flak gun <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> lol, damned open topped AFVs can be a bit of trouble! How about shooting at infantry from a longer range, 'cause I don't think this particular vehicle was designed for close in combat. Mace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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